Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 31
02-13-2010, 06:08 AM
lol love it that this sort of topics dont die... also funny that people always bring up the pre-beta footage with the two galaxies and scream: OMFGWTFBBQ SAUCA SEPARATION, I NOW WANT!!!!111
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 32 multi vector attack mode
02-18-2010, 09:50 AM
ok guys i have the ship and it split into 3 parts but it did it of its own accord.....how did i do that? is it a proc or what need more info....
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 33
02-18-2010, 10:08 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aeolwind View Post
If I'm not mistaken, the saucer solo could achieve warp 1. I have this hung in my head from the Q episode with the Borg. If you'll remember, they separated at a very high warp speed. If the saucer didn't have a deflector field it would have been shredded instantly by the velocity.
The saucer section has no warp drive, so no faster-than-light travel.

During the episode with the high-warp separation, it was mentioned that it was highly impractical, that there would be no margin for error, and that they would have to clear the stardrive section right away because the saucer would immediately start loosing speed.

Inertial dampeners are a separate system, so I don't think a sudden drop from warp would tear the ship apart.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 34
02-18-2010, 10:20 AM
I'd just like to point out the Galaxy is also a multi-vector starship... as are, i'm sure, many others. Not just the Prometheus.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 35
02-18-2010, 10:33 AM
If you actually look at the published schematics for the Prometheus you see that the saucer section has two micro-nacelles, and the model for the Prometheus saucer retains the dorsal hangar in which the nacelle is deployed. This goes to suggest that the ship has a three-stage warp core, and that each segment has two functional nacelles. Technically it is possible, and I don't at all see why MVAM can't be implemented using a system similar to the photonic fleet.

Just give each section one fore and aft weapon that is currently equipped, the saucer having two, then have the AI control the two star-drive sections. Have your BO powers trigger powers on all three sections simultaneously.. So you pop RSP, all three are now reversing polarity, and so forth. It could be noted that by using this system one could even go as far as making a MV Missile Boat given each section could have its own torpedo tube.

To trigger it, once could treat it similar to MES or Cloak, just have a button, with a cool down that activates MVSM. It could even function similar to Security Escort or PF whereas it only lasts as long as one is in combat.

And to address the issue of 'what if something gets destroyed?': Depends on what it is I suppose. If the saucer is knocked out, then presumably the star-drives would either despawn like photonic fleet, or continue fighting autonomously until they're destroyed. If the lower hull goes down, then allow for re-coupling, but disable the last two weapons. If the center segment goes out, then make re-coupling impossible, but have your star-drive segment persist until death, or have a recharge bar that after, say... 5 minutes, a replacement star-drive is warped into the instance, allowing you to re-couple the ship.

Idunno though, there's so many actual possibilities that I'd really hate to see it just permanently written off.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 36
02-18-2010, 10:37 AM
Quote:
The saucer section has no warp drive, so no faster-than-light travel.
I believe the saucer section has a very small warp drive, capable of warp 1. So it would lose speed relative to the engineering hull, but it wouldn't drop completely out of warp.

Quote:
I'd just like to point out the Galaxy is also a multi-vector starship... as are, i'm sure, many others. Not just the Prometheus.
No, the Prometheus was a multi-vector assault starship, in that it designed to split up, and then each of the three components become a smaller warship in their own right. (the concept being that if a ship's being attacked from multiple angles it can't focus shield power or firepower, divide and conquer)

The Galaxy, Sovereign, and others were capable of saucer separation, but the saucer sections were not designed for combat, they were meant as somewhere the civilians aboard a ship could go and leave the ship if it were going into a major battle, or a way to get the majority of the crew clear of the engineering hull if the warp core was going to breach and couldn't be ejected. Unfortunately, the Galaxies were the first ones which were capable of this and so the separation system was not very efficient and too far to long to actually separate in an emergency situation. (as the death of the Enterprise D demonstrated) There were a few times when the Enterprise separated the saucer and used both halves of the ship in battle, but that was typically only in times of dire need, and not something intended. (though may have been an inspiration for the later MVA experiments)

As was explained before, the MVA capability has too many problems to really be viable, rule of cool or no, so in the game background it was written out as something too impractical to get beyond the experimental stage.

Also, it's not entirely true that the Galaxies were the first ones capable of saucer separation. As far back as the Original Constitution class federation ships were capable of it, just it was accomplished through explosives, so if the warp core did not in fact breach, you needed alot of duct tape to recombine the ship.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 37
02-18-2010, 11:14 AM
MVA mode isn't as easy as it sounds from a game stand point. Cryptic would have to redesign the models for Advanced Escorts, design new models for the three parts and design new animations for both uncoupling and recoupling of the three parts. Then write the necessary programming to allow AI control of the middile and lower parts along with giving you some kind of simplistic control over their targeting. No small task and there's far more important things Cyrptic should be working on than messing about with new models and animations.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 38
02-18-2010, 11:20 AM
Never said it would be easy.

Just some kind of epic 'We choose to go to implement MVAM in this release and do the other things, not because they are easy, but because they are hard.' would be nice.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 39
02-18-2010, 11:30 AM
I agree with a few people in here so far.

Make the Galaxy's Saucer Separation, and the Prometheus' MVAM an automated process.

You hit that one ability, and the ship goes into autopilot. It separates graphically and spreads out a little bit.

Then the saucer section does what would amount to Beam: Fire At Will.

And the Engineering section(s) do what would amount to several Torpedo Spreads.

Then the pieces recombine, and player regains control.


Nothing game breaking, but still pretty to watch!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 40
02-18-2010, 11:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Saladinbob View Post
MVA mode isn't as easy as it sounds from a game stand point. Cryptic would have to redesign the models for Advanced Escorts, design new models for the three parts and design new animations for both uncoupling and recoupling of the three parts. Then write the necessary programming to allow AI control of the middile and lower parts along with giving you some kind of simplistic control over their targeting. No small task and there's far more important things Cyrptic should be working on than messing about with new models and animations.

It's no different then ground mode. The player and 4 AI controlled objects. Yes art work would change some but pretty much you'd have a player controlled piece and 2 AI pieces. Of course then you'd have parts of your ship getting stuck on terrain. But heck I'm use to having to go back 4 or 5 times to get the moron AI to unstick itself from a crate.

If any one piece gets destroyed it's the same as if a BO dies on the ground. If the player controlled piece dies it's the same as if the player dies on the ground.
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