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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
Tell me if I'm getting this right;

I can choose once space and one ground Ability for each of my Bridge Officers for each of their levels, but beyond which class (Engineer/Science/Tactical) I chose for my captain, and which Kit I equip him with, I get no choice in which abilities my captain has?

So I can eventually choose up to 8(?) different abilities for BO's but I have a total of 4 (including a kit ability) for my captain, 3 of which are determined solely by my class?

Meaning all captains of the same rank and class will always have the same Abilities - excluding what they get for the kit they happen to equip?

Meanwhile, I can unlock teaching BO's certain Abilities Skill point allocations (for example if my tactical captain gets his Martial Arts skill to L9 I can teach BO's how to Leg Sweep) but I can't use the same abilities myself without a kit?

Its great that I can choose my weapons, my kits & my devices but I'd like to customise what my character can do beyond "class and rank grant X Y Z abilities but your skill point allocations only have an invisible influence on how well you do".

I hope someone tells me I'm wrong. If all thats true it has to be the single most disappointing thing I've encountered yet about STO. I hate the idea that all-player away teams have less control over the abilities available to them than solo away teams filled out by BOs.

Can crafting at least give me customized kits that give me a couple of prefered abilities rather than predermined ones?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
02-15-2010, 12:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terse View Post
Tell me if I'm getting this right;

I can choose once space and one ground Ability for each of my Bridge Officers for each of their levels, but beyond which class (Engineer/Science/Tactical) I chose for my captain, and which Kit I equip him with, I get no choice in which abilities my captain has?

So I can eventually choose up to 8(?) different abilities for BO's but I have a total of 4 (including a kit ability) for my captain, 3 of which are determined solely by my class?

Meaning all captains of the same rank and class will always have the same Abilities - excluding what they get for the kit they happen to equip?

Meanwhile, I can unlock teaching BO's certain Abilities Skill point allocations (for example if my tactical captain gets his Martial Arts skill to L9 I can teach BO's how to Leg Sweep) but I can't use the same abilities myself without a kit?

Its great that I can choose my weapons, my kits & my devices but I'd like to customise what my character can do beyond "class and rank grant X Y Z abilities but your skill point allocations only have an invisible influence on how well you do".

I hope someone tells me I'm wrong. If all thats true it has to be the single most disappointing thing I've encountered yet about STO. I hate the idea that all-player away teams have less control over the abilities available to them than solo away teams filled out by BOs.

Can crafting at least give me customized kits that give me a couple of prefered abilities rather than predermined ones?
Yeah, but remember on the ground the kits make you a unique player. In space YOUR BO'S make you a unique player. Your BOs all add to skills of YOUR SHIP AS A WHOLE. So every ship will be different because they have different BOs with different skills.
But I agree with you on the whole customized kits thing, that would be great.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
02-15-2010, 12:19 PM
The synergy of the predetermined abilities in the kit is quite amazing if you really understand how it all works together. I sometimes use the kits as a schematic of sorts when training my BOs' ground skills.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
02-15-2010, 01:20 PM
Speaking of Kits; how or when can you use them with your BO's. None of my BO's have a slot for them like my main has.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
02-15-2010, 01:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiftyfour23 View Post
Speaking of Kits; how or when can you use them with your BO's. None of my BO's have a slot for them like my main has.
The kits are only used for your character. The BO's don't use kits. They get their skills from the skill system.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
02-15-2010, 01:46 PM
But see, your boffs are working specialized positions on your ship and earning they're way up to being able to get command of a ship. You had no experience or chance to learn how to be a tactical, science, or engineering officer, they just threw you into management without any time to learn skills because you were lucky enough to survive...

You're now skilling up in management skills that make you better at getting the most out of your crew and you'll never learn how to do the hands on stuff, they just give you a magic kit that makes up for your lack of practical experience... Welcome to middle management.

Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
02-15-2010, 02:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terse View Post
Tell me if I'm getting this right;
You have it right, barring a few details on the numbers.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
02-15-2010, 04:42 PM
I think your saying you don't have enough skills to customise your character?

You have spotted that the Skills window has a scroll bar on the side, and there's oodles of skills down bellow? I only mention this because two of my friends got caught out like this. If its not what you mean then no idea.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
02-15-2010, 11:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Curii
I think your saying you don't have enough skills to customise your character?

You have spotted that the Skills window has a scroll bar on the side, and there's oodles of skills down bellow? I only mention this because two of my friends got caught out like this. If its not what you mean then no idea.
Nope, I saw the scroll bar. I was just disappointed when I realised that ranking up skills didn't actually let my own character DO anything new himself (beyond get promoted).

Skill ranks are very important strategically, they influence how hard your phasers hit etc etc. They let you teach your BO's how to do stuff, but they don't actually give your character any extra abilities in a tactical sense.

Abilities give me my tactical options. They're what let me throw photon grenades or knock my enemies down with a leg sweep when they surround me on the ground. When I'm on the ground, they (could) make me different from other players in my away team (or at least I thought they could before I found out you can't choose which abilities you unlock for yourself).

Building up my bridge crew's tactical options by planning their abilities is fun but as soon as I join an all-player away team all that planning goes out the window because my bridge officers aren't there. That becomes a disincentive to team up for ground combat for someone like me who enjoys maximizing my tactical options.

If I want to be sure of having tactical access to more than the Abilities Cryptic decided my character gets I need to avoid teaming up with other players or start dictating what kits my team mates use (I'm sure that would go down Great!).

Its a lose/lose situation. I lose out on my tactical options, or I lose out on teaming up with people for away missions.

Yes, I can carry multiple kits but I have to break off from combat to swap them out. If you were on my away team, in the thick of battle, how would you feel if I ran away from combat to swap out a kit because I realised at the last second my grenade kit would be more useful than my martial arts kit? Then did it again because I was getting rushed and wanted to swap back to martial arts?

(By the way, when I posted this thread I couldn't find it again so I thought it had been swallowed up by some kind of error. Apologies to anyone who read the similar thread I posted afterwards, I wasn't actually trying to spam the forum).

Thanks for the replies though, I'm grateful that everyone has tried to be helpful rather than just flame me because this aspect of the game isn't what I hoped it would be.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
02-16-2010, 02:33 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Terse View Post
Nope, I saw the scroll bar. I was just disappointed when I realised that ranking up skills didn't actually let my own character DO anything new himself (beyond get promoted).

Skill ranks are very important strategically, they influence how hard your phasers hit etc etc. They let you teach your BO's how to do stuff, but they don't actually give your character any extra abilities in a tactical sense.

Abilities give me my tactical options. They're what let me throw photon grenades or knock my enemies down with a leg sweep when they surround me on the ground. When I'm on the ground, they (could) make me different from other players in my away team (or at least I thought they could before I found out you can't choose which abilities you unlock for yourself).

Building up my bridge crew's tactical options by planning their abilities is fun but as soon as I join an all-player away team all that planning goes out the window because my bridge officers aren't there. That becomes a disincentive to team up for ground combat for someone like me who enjoys maximizing my tactical options.

If I want to be sure of having tactical access to more than the Abilities Cryptic decided my character gets I need to avoid teaming up with other players or start dictating what kits my team mates use (I'm sure that would go down Great!).

Its a lose/lose situation. I lose out on my tactical options, or I lose out on teaming up with people for away missions.

Yes, I can carry multiple kits but I have to break off from combat to swap them out. If you were on my away team, in the thick of battle, how would you feel if I ran away from combat to swap out a kit because I realised at the last second my grenade kit would be more useful than my martial arts kit? Then did it again because I was getting rushed and wanted to swap back to martial arts?

(By the way, when I posted this thread I couldn't find it again so I thought it had been swallowed up by some kind of error. Apologies to anyone who read the similar thread I posted afterwards, I wasn't actually trying to spam the forum).

Thanks for the replies though, I'm grateful that everyone has tried to be helpful rather than just flame me because this aspect of the game isn't what I hoped it would be.
I'm a bit confused. If you could only select which skills you could use via skills points then you wouldn't even have the choice at game time ...you would have to respec in order to get new skills..not something you can do during the heat of battle either. With kits at least you can change them out between fights if something isn't working out. The design of the player game is about career choice and kit and weapon choices. You don't spend skill points for those skills but you do spend skill points that affect how effective you are at certain things.

I understand what you want to be able to do, it just isn't the way the game is designed. I don't agree that there isn't both choice and complexity in how the player skillss work. Most of the game is played in space which means you always have full use of your Bridge Officers. When you beam down in a full group of captains you all have access to the skills in any kit you currently possess. If you are a Science player and you don't have a kit equiped to use medical tricorder you can always equip one. Yes you have to do that between combat sessoins but every ground combat in the game has those pauses between fights. I think there a a lot of possibilties in the current system without having to spend time wishing for a different system.
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