Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
02-16-2010, 08:40 PM
Indeed, the "Crafting" is nothing more than upgrading certain equipment. In fact, some of the items in the "Crafting" are equipment that comes standard off your ships, like the Deflector Dish and the Impulse Engines. But nobody is going to be constantly buying new ships, just for these items and throwing them away. And by the time you upgrade to the next level, you can buy similar or better gear via rewards.

I think the stats on some of these items should be more worth it, like the aforementioned Impulse Engines. I'm sure those who are Captains and Admirals would love high-end version of the Efficent Impulse Engines you get when you are a Lt Commander, or high end versions of the Neodynimum Deflector Dishes that boosts your Auxiliary and Turn Radius.


But honestly, this isn't the crafting that I imagined it to be. I wanted it be like EQ or SWG where you find parts and make something, where the slightest difference could make it stronger and less durable, or durable but not as efficent. After all, it's not like Trek didn't have this going on (instead they are just "stats").

I'm sure people would love to improve a Phaser and it ends up the Classic Blue Intensity. Or Klingons tweeking their Disruptors to get them with that Red color from DS9.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
02-16-2010, 09:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodwind
Crafting systems are trading in resources/components for a finished product.
It's not the traditional crafting that seasoned MMO gamers have come to enjoy.

In WoW and other MMOs that have real crafting, you can take crafting anywhere with you because it becomes a personal skill once you train in it. In most cases, the only time you have to see an NPC for crafting was to learn new recipes. In WoW, crafting recipes were also a random loot drop. Most resources were plentiful and once I gathered the resources to satisfy a recipe, I could then either fully make the item on the spot or go to a nearby post, town, or city and use their anvil, forge, stove or whatever. Many times, you could even find crafting "stations" in dungeons and also remote locations in the middle of nowhere.

On top of that, you sometimes had to make (craft) the tools yourself and even parts sometimes, then you would combine (craft) the parts with the tools to produce a whole item. In WoW, you had engineering, blacksmithing, tailoring, jewelcrafting, and several others. These are crafting skills of player characters, not NPCs.

My point is, crafting in other MMOs felt special and I really felt like I was creating something for myself and others. In STO, you go out and look for items to trade to NPCs who are far away, so to speak. In return, those NPCs give you gear. That's bartering, not crafting.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
02-16-2010, 10:23 PM
this isn't crafting.. it's buffing items.. they should allow us to create the items somehow in the first place, and obv give the buffers (scientists) more and better mods they can do..

let ME create a mark V rifle out of stuff i can mine, collect, replicate w/ blueprints. whatever.. keep memory alpha..

that would make for a good crafting system
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
02-16-2010, 10:40 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackRifle
It's not the traditional crafting that seasoned MMO gamers have come to enjoy.
Yes it is. You trade X for Y. Sometimes X is ore. Sometimes Y is a bolt. You do this a few times with Xs and Ys untill you get the Y you want. Few systems are more than that.

SWG was a bit more involved and probably the closest to true crafing that you can get. But WoW? Seriously. It is STO crafting with a few more steps (turning in Xs for Ys) than STO has.

In WoW and other MMOs that have real crafting, you can take crafting anywhere with you because it becomes a personal skill once you train in it. In most cases, the only time you have to see an NPC for crafting was to learn new recipes. [/quote]

Yes, because WoW didn't require certian looms, moon wells, forges or anvils for crafting. Nope. Not at all.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
02-16-2010, 11:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Goodwind
Yes, because WoW didn't require certian looms, moon wells, forges or anvils for crafting. Nope. Not at all.
Goodwind, how did you miss the following quote in my post?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackRifle
or go to a nearby post, town, or city and use their anvil, forge, stove or whatever. Many times, you could even find crafting "stations" in dungeons and also remote locations in the middle of nowhere.

Anyway, I do agree that SWG had deeper crafting than others. I used WoW to simply illustrate a difference.
Star Trek Online does not have player crafting... at all.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16 2c
02-16-2010, 11:23 PM
Good Ideas,
Hobbies are prominent in the series, from Riker and his trombone to Sisko and baseball. So I would propose a hobbie system based on a few hobbies of prominent characters of the series. They could provide the ability to build items or perform limited cross class skills.

Music= Can build and play a canon instrument provide att/def buffs, based on science skills
Archeology= Shovel and a pick unearths material for tinkering, based on science skills
Tinkering= Build your badass Mark XXX Quadphaser Array, based on engineering skills
Athletics= All this running could get ya something how bout ground movement de/buff or str de/buff, based on tactical skills
Culinary= Alcohol use is so pervasive in canon as well as cuisine, imagine your inventory filled with rare
tribbles. But can also make ground pots. based on engineering skills
Piloting= Provides space movement de/buffs and ability to create space pots, based on tactical skills.

Just a couple ideas. DON"T SHOOT!

Commander Highbone, U.S.S. Lion of Zion
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
02-17-2010, 01:22 AM
The system was a complete afterthought, it's almost as if they got closer to release date and then all of a sudden thought, "uh oh, crafting system!" and now we have what we have.

It's workable at the moment, there are too many other important and bigger things that need attention right now, like the Klingon content. So I can't say with any confidence that the crafting system will be addressed anytime soon.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
02-17-2010, 01:35 AM
I hate this "Crafting System" I spent 1.25million credits today, buying common gear/anomalies. The rewards should be more plentiful and more advanced then exploration or pvp rewards. It's just not worth it tbh, very annoyed.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
02-17-2010, 02:09 AM
Don't forget- The bridge officer system is also crafting according to Cryptic..

Memory alpha crafting's problem isn't even effort vs reward. People will do things in MMOs even if this is way out of wack. The problem is the reward, being the upgrade, is next to meaningless. +0.1 acc means nothing. I haven't parsed the combat log, but my unbuffed accuracy on everything is easily at the 90% mark. So what does this 0.1 add? Does that make me go from 90 to 91, or from 90 to 90.1? Or is the accuracy stat checked against an enemy's evasion stat, making things even more grey and situational? In either case anyone with very basic math skills can see this actually didn't even give you that 0.1. Going from 90 to 91% acc is less than a 1% increase, going from 90 to 90.1 acc is less than a tenth of a percent increase.

This is the majority of what I have seen. Its just not worth looking at, regardless of effort vs reward.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
02-17-2010, 07:15 AM
It needs a *lot* of work to be sure. As already stated lack of progress bar is one of the paramount problems with using it. You never know how close you are to the next tier other than the vague "give us more samples" statements.

I'll agree too, I don't consider this crafting compared to other mmos standard of crafting. However, this is the version of crafting we get in STO. So, my hopes are that they expand upon it and make things far less confusing for those trying to unlock the tier steps.

Some things that I think would help are:

*On scan missions in clusters it should adjust to that cluster's data samples rather than continually rewarding the base samples.
*Progress bar for the different tier/vendors so you have at least an inkling of how close you are to an unlock
*Clearly they need to add equivalent level items to make using this system as an option viable to using the other systems. As someone said, why unlock tier 3 when you get better items from other content? Esp considering the amount of items one has to sink into this.

Now, I'm not calling this system a waste of time myself. They've got a core system here that'd work just fine as long as they'll tweak it and expand upon it. But in it's current state it does come off as both frustrating and lack luster. Of course I'm still going to try and unlock my tier 3's simply because I think they will add to it later on.
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