Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
Just take it out of the game for both sides. It's nothing more than the Mezmerize spell I learned to hate in **** (and Wow as well--turns you into a sheep waiting to be slaughtered). In my opinion, it sunk **** PvP and that's the reason I left **** (and WoW as well). **** was also plauged by a 3rd party program that revealed opponents on the map, even cloaked ones. Mythic seemed not to want to do anything about these 3rd Party creeps except to ban people they found using the program. In truth, THAT is why I left (Mez was a close second).

Don't bring PvE skills into PvP.

I get hit with Mez, VM, whatever you want to call it, and I can do nothing but watch my screen as my ship gets ripped apart. Brilliant strategy.

I'd rather the Feds (or the Klingons if I were a Fed) get double shield and double hull than VM. I'd rather go down fighting than passivley sitting and watching my ship get ripped apart.

It's a rank Novice "I win button." Get rid of it.




Although I use them myself, stacking two Reverse Shield Polarity skills should not be possible, especially since Photonic Officer makes them even more powerful.

And Feedback Beam, though I use it myself, is overpowered as well. Target an enemy ship and get your hull taken out. Granted, I don't see my opponents (Feds) losing hull that badly, but I can say that I have to untarget some Fed ships so I don't blow myself up (which I initially did--I couldn't figure out how my hull was being destroyed while my shields were still up).

5 Feds or Klingons shooting at one ship and they get severe hull damage. Get rid of that overpowered skill as well. I can always untarget though. I mean, if it's meant as a deterrent I can somewhat see the point, but it's overpowering. Turn it into a heavy resist instead of the uber skill it is now, and will be at levels 2 and 3.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
02-10-2010, 02:42 AM
Honestly though very few use VM it's to easy to counter. Most Captains fly with Sci team 1 at least and if someone on their team calls out VM or see's the purple mist immediatly tosses sci team on them and their back in action. Also once you ID a VM user you shut them down and respawn them and keep them dead. Personally i got rid of it for an even "funner" toy. Not too mention try getting hit with a full aux rated SubNuc beam that will bring out true pain.

Lover of the SubNuc Beam since first used.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
02-10-2010, 02:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reyla
Honestly though very few use VM it's to easy to counter. Most Captains fly with Sci team 1 at least and if someone on their team calls out VM or see's the purple mist immediatly tosses sci team on them and their back in action. Also once you ID a VM user you shut them down and respawn them and keep them dead. Personally i got rid of it for an even "funner" toy. Not too mention try getting hit with a full aux rated SubNuc beam that will bring out true pain.

Lover of the SubNuc Beam since first used.
I can see your point. I hear they are working on having Science Team being able to self heal (I will accept this--though I'd rather not). Why even waste a slot for a counter? I mean, a skill which shuts your ship down? This is death in PUGs (which turns players off to PvP), especially if it is followed up with SubNuc Beam (if they survive VM). I may be able to survive (and have) ONE of them and run--taking two ships with me in pursuit (good for my team since I am hard to kill and may escape, and even get cooldowns back up, turn and take on the two pursuers, keeping them out of the main fight longer--Engineer Captain with a T3 Cruiser here--Klingon) but there's no way I can survive the double whammy. A good team can just kill me while I have VM on me.

If you want these skills in game, have them last 5 seconds. That's more than enough time of someone doing absolutely nothing, which is absolutely no fun.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
02-10-2010, 03:00 AM
Honestly though that would remove every crowd control ability. Jame Sensors 10s+, scramble 16+, Subnuc 10+. The list goes on. Pretty much MMO's nowadays go back to a very old game, Rock Paper Scissors. K1 attacks F2, F2 uses Jam on K1, F1 uses Extended on F2, K1 Scrambles F2 and F1, K1 cloak waits for jam to end. Hits F1 with VM. Now at this point if its a pug theres a 30% chance F2 will have and use sci teeam on F1.

Something to remember is its not a 1v1 game, Each side should be thinking as a team so carry powers that do dmg and help the team. 50% of my loadout on my bop are powers set to cause chaos to that pretty fedball. While the other half are heals of some kind to keep my team/self up and fighting (<3 cruiser shields).

Yea VM can suck but if they remove it or nerf it down whats to stop them from removing heals, attack paterns and such........Nothing at all. (some say VM is not removed by sci team, yes partially true if you use it prior to getting hit, theres a 50% it wont remove. But if sci team used after frozen it will remove, tested this alot thanks to a fed who was addicted to it.)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
02-10-2010, 03:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Reyla
Honestly though that would remove every crowd control ability. Jame Sensors 10s+, scramble 16+, Subnuc 10+. The list goes on. Pretty much MMO's nowadays go back to a very old game, Rock Paper Scissors. K1 attacks F2, F2 uses Jam on K1, F1 uses Extended on F2, K1 Scrambles F2 and F1, K1 cloak waits for jam to end. Hits F1 with VM. Now at this point if its a pug theres a 30% chance F2 will have and use sci teeam on F1.
With the exception of SubNuc Beam, the other "jams" only affect your ability to attack one ship. And Scramble Sensors is pretty much useless if the opposing team is alert (though the "stop heal" is potent indeed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reyla
Something to remember is its not a 1v1 game, Each side should be thinking as a team so carry powers that do dmg and help the team. 50% of my loadout on my bop are powers set to cause chaos to that pretty fedball. While the other half are heals of some kind to keep my team/self up and fighting (<3 cruiser shields).
I can understand your argument in a premade vs a premade, it is pointless overkill in PUGs where the PUG will probably be slaughtered anyway.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Reyla
Yea VM can suck but if they remove it or nerf it down whats to stop them from removing heals, attack paterns and such........Nothing at all. (some say VM is not removed by sci team, yes partially true if you use it prior to getting hit, theres a 50% it wont remove. But if sci team used after frozen it will remove, tested this alot thanks to a fed who was addicted to it.)

Don't forget that VM followed by SubNuc beam (which has no counter) is just plain death (true, less likely in a premade, but painfully obvious in PUGs, and PUGs should be encouraged since they may join Fleets and stick around the game).

I don't doubt that some new players go to PvP, see their systems shut down, they can't even fire a shot as they get blown up, laugh, have it happen again, and then uninstall the game. That's not fun.

While I understand your argument is valid in Premade vs Premade, some consideration/compromise has to be given to PUGs. They are the route almost all newcomers take.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
02-10-2010, 03:24 AM
atm ive just seen vm on me and im fed

I read a dev post that science team will be improved to be the counter.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
02-10-2010, 03:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 0850
atm ive just seen vm on me and im fed

I read a dev post that science team will be improved to be the counter.
I suppose I can live with that. I just hate Mezzes that one can't counter.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
02-10-2010, 03:44 AM
It's fine, they just need to fix Science team.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
02-10-2010, 03:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpaghettiMonster
It's fine, they just need to fix Science team.
Easy for a Spaghetti Monster to say
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
02-10-2010, 03:53 AM
VM is just like any other skill. It has its uses and its counters - especially once Science Team is fixed so it can be popped on yourself while under VM. This is first and foremost a team PvP game - there are no duels, there are no 1v1s. If you don't have a team that recognizes VM and acts on it - not everyone else's problem. Even in Pugs if I see VM on a friendly I pop Science Team.

The argument that you shouldn't bring a counter to any skill is poor. Science Team is more than just Anti-VM - it provides a decent Shield Heal not based on any current aux or shield power, it improves your overall shield resistance and it increases the effectiveness of following science skills. In itself that makes it a decent skill - not to mention it can remove Scramble Sensors, VM, Jam Sensors etc.

Then you have APO - guaranteed get out of VM, Tractor etc skill. Why don't you have that as it again has many uses besides anti-VM.

The devs don't need to nerf "OP" skills (Extend Shields, RSP, Rapid Fire, Multiple Target Shield Subsystem followed by Tractor Beam in place, Feedback Pulse - didn't really seem that potent when I used FP 2 - resistances and all other skills that make PvP more than just a grand melee with Spacebar mashing) they need to provide counters. VM actually has 2 counters, while RSP has but one true counter (Target Shield etc if it works).

Learn to equip your ship for PvP especially since it is almost a given that at least a ship on the other side will have VM. I personally use VM 3 and have killed people before they got out (but then again I'm basically an escort as a BoP). I've had people use VM on me in 1v1 encounters in PvP matches and fail to kill me in the alloted 20-22 seconds because they did not have the dps or the right positioning and they lost time getting a good shot after they stopped me dead.

The only thing I would like to see fixed is multiples of the same skill sharing just a token cooldown (like multiple VMs, RSPs etc). They should make the cooldown (for the same skill not the same device used) as long as the entire cooldown on the skill itself, while keeping the 20s cooldown for skills that use the same array. This will bring more diversity and allow skills that are atm overlooked in favor of their bigger cousins to be fitted on ships.
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 07:13 PM.