Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 41
03-03-2010, 09:47 PM
Thanks for the continued support guys. I haven't had a lot of time in the past week or so, but I was able to just finish another new concept image. This one replaces my old Image Compare game suggestion, which I was never really that happy with.

3D PLOT COMPARE

Attachment 3618

http://www.secondstartotheleft.com/i...Compare_20.jpg

The Game: The player would be presented with two 3D plots. The goal would be for the user to match the sliders so that the lines joining each pair are parallel. This could be complicated by the fact that if you raise the plot in one area it is lowered elsewhere, or perhaps both plots are constantly in a state of flux so it takes some skillful timing to get them to match up.

The Allegory: While it's a little vague how "scanning" works in Star Trek, in a lot of cases real-world sensors (RADAR, SONAR) work by emitting a signal and then measuring the image that signal returns. This minigame would be simulating the analysis of that returned signal and is general enough to apply to a variety of situations where a player has to scan something (plants, rocks, ship parts, etc.).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 42
03-03-2010, 09:54 PM
Oh god yes! Seriously This is some great ideas and i love them. Please Cryptic at least consider them.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 43
03-03-2010, 10:18 PM
Mini-games would absolutely rock!
It would definately break up the scan this scan that routine on exploration missions.

Actually getting to try to gain access to a station computer and be more involved in the mission beyond just click access console would be very nice.

Also woudln't mind being able to play games in quark's bar or chess in club 47 for some kind of mission and or just for fun.

I think just like bioshock, STO would also benefit and could use mini-game items and an in game skills-tree dealing with problem solving to help with those paticularly difficult to solve mini-games.


/signed
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 44
03-03-2010, 11:25 PM
Anywhere F is being used with a timer bar a mini game should replace it. And no, people should not be able to skip it. The only thing they might be able to do is lower the difficulty with the mission difficulty setting. Allowing people to skip content that adds to the "Trek" experience is silly. I don't see people complaining in Mass Effect I or II, Fallout 3, Oblivion, etc about being able to skip the mini games.

It just needs to make sense akin to the ideas presented by the ops and many of us before on this forum.

And an idea for the OP to play with. I think diplomacy gensis missions should be a fairly strong gameplay add on. Such that it is akin to some of the more interesting card games in Online and card systems. Though it looking like cards is probably wrong, the way to handle a fairly strong diplomacy game would be akin to card games. I played a game on Sony Freerealms awhile back that used card systems. They also have a lot of other card game systems to look at as well. Finding a way to hide the "card game" and make it feel very trek would be interesting.

The benefit of a card game diplomacy system is that multiple players can participate together and help each other instead of it being a solo setup. So your five team goes down to do a diplomatic treaty and you all have to work together in the card game to beat the other AI players. Could even add this to compete with Klingons in territory control latter on.

And note the card game is less a mini game and would be instead a full blown game akin to ship combat. It would have a lot of substance though hiding the card game and making it feel trek is important.

Some examples of pure card game for concept ideas:
http://www.freerealms.com/TCGhome.vm
http://poxnora.station.sony.com/
https://www.wizard101.com/home5/w101...1bb8cce0652edf
http://starchamber.station.sony.com/
http://piratesonline.station.sony.com/

Freerealms also has a massive amount of mini games for doing things if you need more mini game ideas. Interesting little world they created.

And wizard101 uses cards for casting spells in their combat system. So you can see how a card game can be conceptually used for a slower tactical setup with animations and characters.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 45
03-03-2010, 11:35 PM
Another simple way to add depth to the missions is a quick mini game to scan planets to find out where to beam down to. They recently added something like that in Mass Effect II.

In fact there are all sorts of things you can do with planets. Instead of just having the Boff tell you something first go find out what is going on. Is this a high tech world? Let the player gather some information and then the Boffs can report on the findings and what to do next.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 46
03-04-2010, 03:25 AM
Wow, great work! I think this is the best way for the devs to amp up the non-combat missions to a level, where they become even more interesting than the combat missions.... this would feel so much more like star trek compared to 'oh, lets go there and blow everything to pieces....'

Hope they'll consider it....
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 47
03-04-2010, 09:13 AM
Once again...keep in mind how each mini-game will have to interact with group play dynamics.

For mini-games that impact your ship or character only this really isn't an issue.

However, for systems such as "Diplomacy" --- it will be absolutely imperative to arrive at something which either does not stop the flow of play for other players or allows other players to participate meaningfully. This is complex for "Diplomacy" since you can't have other group members running about murdering the mobs while your trying to negotiate with them or other such immersion anomalies.

As a designer you can't expect a group to stare at their PC's for an indeterminate amount of time watching someone else "play" a mini-game or worse: have them watching nothing. It's like dead air in radio, total anathema for an MMO.

As a "suggester" always try to K.I.S.S. your way through your suggestions. Try your best to not come up with a complex tree of new skills that a developer will have to implement and manage,etc. Try your best to find "elegant solutions" instead of complex ones. (this is a coding thing, but in reality you can apply the philosophy to most anything)

This is why the mini-games as a basic class should have simple mechanics that are easy to grasp and short, fixed time frames to complete them in. The "Card Game" approach might allow for this...however, in most incarnations I've seen it suggested it is more a rube goldberg apparatus with massive skill tree add-ons and other infrastructure, rather than a quick and elegant pass through.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 48
03-04-2010, 12:29 PM
These are awesome ideas! /signed!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 49
03-04-2010, 03:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by malize View Post
Once again...keep in mind how each mini-game will have to interact with group play dynamics.

For mini-games that impact your ship or character only this really isn't an issue.

However, for systems such as "Diplomacy" --- it will be absolutely imperative to arrive at something which either does not stop the flow of play for other players or allows other players to participate meaningfully. This is complex for "Diplomacy" since you can't have other group members running about murdering the mobs while your trying to negotiate with them or other such immersion anomalies.

As a designer you can't expect a group to stare at their PC's for an indeterminate amount of time watching someone else "play" a mini-game or worse: have them watching nothing. It's like dead air in radio, total anathema for an MMO.

As a "suggester" always try to K.I.S.S. your way through your suggestions. Try your best to not come up with a complex tree of new skills that a developer will have to implement and manage,etc. Try your best to find "elegant solutions" instead of complex ones. (this is a coding thing, but in reality you can apply the philosophy to most anything)

This is why the mini-games as a basic class should have simple mechanics that are easy to grasp and short, fixed time frames to complete them in. The "Card Game" approach might allow for this...however, in most incarnations I've seen it suggested it is more a rube goldberg apparatus with massive skill tree add-ons and other infrastructure, rather than a quick and elegant pass through.
Yeah, the group clause was pointed out in a couple of the other idea threads. The ideas work very well when you think solo or playing with friends but when playing open team groups getting the compromise would be harder to press to them that to a friend
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 50
03-04-2010, 11:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by malize View Post
Once again...keep in mind how each mini-game will have to interact with group play dynamics.

For mini-games that impact your ship or character only this really isn't an issue.

However, for systems such as "Diplomacy" --- it will be absolutely imperative to arrive at something which either does not stop the flow of play for other players or allows other players to participate meaningfully. This is complex for "Diplomacy" since you can't have other group members running about murdering the mobs while your trying to negotiate with them or other such immersion anomalies.

As a designer you can't expect a group to stare at their PC's for an indeterminate amount of time watching someone else "play" a mini-game or worse: have them watching nothing. It's like dead air in radio, total anathema for an MMO.

As a "suggester" always try to K.I.S.S. your way through your suggestions. Try your best to not come up with a complex tree of new skills that a developer will have to implement and manage,etc. Try your best to find "elegant solutions" instead of complex ones. (this is a coding thing, but in reality you can apply the philosophy to most anything)

This is why the mini-games as a basic class should have simple mechanics that are easy to grasp and short, fixed time frames to complete them in. The "Card Game" approach might allow for this...however, in most incarnations I've seen it suggested it is more a rube goldberg apparatus with massive skill tree add-ons and other infrastructure, rather than a quick and elegant pass through.
At the point combat starts diplomacy ends. There is no running around shooting things while you are doing diplomacy as that wouldn't make sense.

The card concept fits well with diplomacy as you can aquire "diplmatic cards" as you participate more. And this adds another way to build your captain. Are you a philosopher like Picard or are you more like Data with analytical cards to play?

Diplomatic gameplay should be a big part of Star Trek online. It should be as complex as Space Combat and I wouldn't consider it a mini game though there are many mini games out there that could be used for examples of how to build it. The card game was the simplest conceptual idea of how I could envision it being approached to make it complex as space/ground combat as well as add the ability to aquire cards akin to skills. This aspect of development would be fun and allow players another way to develop a character in conjunction with the current skill point system but more akin to collecting items to use.

It is a fairly major add on system if not an expansion in and of itself. The mini games are also needed and will also add a huge amount of genre flavor that is needed to break up the combat and make the game feel right.
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