Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
02-24-2010, 08:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Great_Milenko
Yeah see I dont get this with a MMO.
WoW FORCES you to do instances at lvl and definately to do raids, btu you dont see hundreds of "OMFG WHY ARE YOU FORCING ME TO GROUP?!?!?!?!?!?!?!" threads there. Or I never did.
Sarcasm man. That has been in the few threads I have read here on this site. Death penalties need to be put in game, but there is no solution that will placate everyone (or enough of us).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
02-24-2010, 08:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raximillian
It would default to the lowest difficulty setting. If someone has it on easy, then all on easy. If everyone has it in hard, then all on hard.

If you group with a random person, then just play it on the lowest common setting. If you want your party to play hard, get people to play on hard.

Hardcore players would not be able to group with anyone, only other hardcore players. Nothing is easy for them

I like the OPs idea. Nicely put out. And don't dismiss people, some people would actually play hardcore. I would add a memorial Cementery to the website, where it lists the top 100 harcore players, the ones that got furthest in the game. That would help and encourage those that want recognition.
Wow, nice elegant solution to the grouping problem!

And I think that a hardcore graveyard / leaderboard, a'la Diablo II, would be pretty cool.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
02-24-2010, 08:23 AM
i had a big list of things of why this would be cool but would not really work, but I decideed
not to bother since it would get flamed to hell and back. We can point to DD0 as an example
since they use a similar system. Now point at all the things you like and hate about it...
And there you go.


(Edit. What I mean about how it not working, I mean how much are the dev's going to be willing to
to change alot in the game. Im sure there will be alot of balancing issues, plus with all the other
things that need to be looked at already.)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
02-24-2010, 08:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Khabok
After tossing around the ideas with some RL friends at work who also play STO, we came up with the following solution that would make everyone happy!

Implement difficulty sliders, and attach death penalties to the sliders, as well as increased rewards for increased difficulty.

There would be several settings, with the following:

Standard: Normal difficulty, exactly how it is now, with the current loss of energy / crew penalty, and the current rewards. This is exactly as STO is now, and would not change anything for anyone, and would be the default setting.

Hard: Slightly increased spawn sizes, similar to having a 2nd person in your team but playing the map solo. There would be a much harsher energy and crew loss penalty for dying, but slightly increased rewards due to the increase of ships / ground mobs, and a slightly higher % chance to find a rarer item.

Harder: Greatly increased spawn sizes, similar to having 3 additional people in your team, with greater chances for rarer loot, greater chances for loot overall due to increased spawn size, and a significantly increased death penalty: Mission restart (kicked to sector space), complete crew loss with a crew regeneration debuff for a few minutes, and a minor energy credit and Starfleet merit cost.

Hardest: Largest spawn sizes (larger than if in a full team), much greater chance at finding rares: However, there's pretty severe death penalty. Respawn at Sol Starbase, harsh Starfleet merit cost and energy credit cost (upwards of 25% of all existing credits), and a chance to lose an existing piece of ship or ground equipment.

Hardcore: Yeah. Character deletion. Nobody will play this.

Oh, one thing that is an absolute must: NO way to change the difficulty slider on-the-fly. Once you set it in Sol Starbase, you can only change it in Sol Starbase.

Kind of kills two birds with one stone.... nobody has to change the game unless they want to, and those that do get better rewards for the increased difficulty, but also harsher penalties.

Ideas, suggestions, feedback?
I don't like it. Everyone should be playing under the same difficulty and death penalty.

You want to kill two or more birds with one stone, I would suggest this:

Space Death = Percent chance to destroy any or all consoles. Permanent item decay to main systems such as shields, weapons, deflector arrays, engines, ship itself.
Ground Death = Permanent item decay or destruction of any or all away team equipment. Chance of death for away team members upon incapacitation.

Throw out "energy credits" and implement actual credits. Yes yes, in ST:IV Kirk said "They're still using money" and in FIrst Contact Picard said something about not using money anymore, but there's at least as many references to using money throughout the canon. Kirk said "You earned your pay today mister" in the Doomsday Machine, and if they're not playing Poker for money in TNG why does Geordi fold every other hand? Ditch the former, go with the latter, insert some blurb about "Due to devastating losses in the Dominion War, encounters with the Borg, and renewed hostiilities with the Klingon Empire, the Federation re-adopted Capitalism to facilitate blah blah blah."

Then implement a better crafting system. Anomaly data to be used for researching advanced "recipes". Players can obtain asteroid mining facilities, planetary manufacturing facilites, etc, and can salvage ship hulks, with more advanced facilities to unlock with higher ranks, up to entire shipyards at Admiral.

Toss in a third neutral faction. Trade, smuggling, hauling, asteroid prospecting, etc.

Crafting materials have to be manually moved, none of this "I put it in the bank at Sol and took it out of the bank at K-7" stuff. Players could put haul orders up on a job board, i.e. player-made-missions for their own or the neutral faction. Optional cargo insurance could ensure the materials go back on the job board if the hauler gets destroyed (in which case all crafting materials are lost), but ups the fee paid to list the materials. Ships would need a cargo capacity based on class.

Raw materials would be gained from asteroids, planets, etc. Manufacturing facilities would be available at starbases, major planetary ports, etc. Raw materials and manufacturing facilities would never be located at the same place, i.e. the materials have to be hauled by the player or contract shipped. See job board above.

Toss in PotBS style "port contention".

Poof, instant vibrant economy, crafting system, meaningful PvP, "smuggling", and a neutral playable faction.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
02-24-2010, 08:50 AM
This is esay. In CoH/V which Cryptic owned for the 1st several years of its life, your DP is Exp debt. Early on you die/get defeated out side a mission door/instance you incured full debt, go down inside a door and its half Debt. They eventually leveled this out but trust me as a Blapper I set records in debt...even earned 4 badges worth and too FOREVER to make lvl50.

Also, whoever is leader of the team sets the diff level from easy to Hard (4 steps) and now recently they have harder settings which allow even more hard core diff (evey one is a boss type of thing). So if we go with a tiered Diff level, then the Leader sets the diff for the team.

If you have a high level and a low level toon (I'll use toon instead of character as its easier to type) tou can sidekick the low level up to just under your level and they get XP and stuff but at a scale with what they would get at their own level (this takes some but not all of the power leveling out, adds risk for the lowbie, and allows them to be something other than a minor actor in the mission because they dont die when the bad guy just looks at them)

If they ad a DP that adds debt to the XP bar...suddenly the game slows down and takes longer to progress through, but that also begs the need for much more content or more varied repeatable content to keep players going and working the Xp bar.

Losing bits of ships or equipment or a cash penality or toon death/restart is IMO a horrible idea.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
02-24-2010, 08:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Buffalo-6
This is esay. In CoH/V which Cryptic owned for the 1st several years of its life, your DP is Exp debt. Early on you die/get defeated out side a mission door/instance you incured full debt, go down inside a door and its half Debt. They eventually leveled this out but trust me as a Blapper I set records in debt...even earned 4 badges worth and too FOREVER to make lvl50.

Also, whoever is leader of the team sets the diff level from easy to Hard (4 steps) and now recently they have harder settings which allow even more hard core diff (evey one is a boss type of thing). So if we go with a tiered Diff level, then the Leader sets the diff for the team.

If you have a high level and a low level toon (I'll use toon instead of character as its easier to type) tou can sidekick the low level up to just under your level and they get XP and stuff but at a scale with what they would get at their own level (this takes some but not all of the power leveling out, adds risk for the lowbie, and allows them to be something other than a minor actor in the mission because they dont die when the bad guy just looks at them)

If they ad a DP that adds debt to the XP bar...suddenly the game slows down and takes longer to progress through, but that also begs the need for much more content or more varied repeatable content to keep players going and working the Xp bar.

Losing bits of ships or equipment or a cash penality or toon death/restart is IMO a horrible idea.
On the contrary, losing equipment worked beautifully in Pirates of the Burning Sea. It was brilliant.

Exp debt / loss is one of the weakest and most frustrating DP's out there.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
02-24-2010, 09:38 AM
team leader sets the value on missions when entered.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
02-24-2010, 09:41 AM
Nifty concept, Khabok. I'd support something like this. However, as others have pointed out, there would be problems with teaming. People would ether be inflicted with conditions they would not like (e.g. a person who plays on easy would become subject to harder game-play with penalties they do not agree with) or there would be MAJOR exploitation (e.g. player A sets the difficulty really high allowing players B, C, D, and E to play higher leveled content with no consequence).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
02-24-2010, 09:41 AM
You're heart is in the right place but as stated again and again in this thread it would divide people too much.

And really, hardcore mode? Why include something no one would play?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
02-24-2010, 09:47 AM
Anyone remember what happens in CoX when you team? The answer to this will answer the question because CoX has had a slider for some time since it was implemented while Cryptic was still there.
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