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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
02-26-2010, 08:53 AM
Just poked back in the thread to say it's good at least people have some ideas on how it can be fixed, though perhaps it would be nice if it seemed Cryptic cared as well.

But I still don't get why people suicide in pvp so they can level up faster.....to do the exact same pvp.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
02-26-2010, 09:22 AM
If you penalised losing people would just leave games they are outnumbered. Both Fed and Kilngon. Atm the only thing that makes feds come back sometimes is they still got marks and the Klingons even if it is crap and they are outnumbered you can still decloak try to kill somene and get medals and xp for it. Which is essential for Klingons as there is no real other options to level.

There is some reward for particaption atm and it will vary depending on your hull damage and hull healing. This is very basic and needs to include shield damage, shield heals and for the some way to track debuffs and buffs/cc though I have no idea how you would do this. Perhaps a value each time the ability is effective on a target?

But then what if you are the meat target? Say you are a fed escort guess who the Klinks are decloaking on with guns blazing in a pack?

As for why some Klingons run through it. Let me ask you this. If you wanted to use a Cruiser or say a Carrier and you are a engie or Science and want to be suppor.. What does t1 and 2 do for you? Bascially you run around as an escort type of ship.


No I don't agree with him QQing for you all to suicide and being a ********. But from the other point of view watching 2 BOP'S cloaked shadow a fed ball from 15 KM for 10 minutes isn't fun either. Attack or leave imo after a certain amount of time. I know from my fed it is annoying as all hell to wait for 20-30 min for a game to find the system sucked and the 2 KDF in the zone are cloaking and won't decloak at all for 10 min.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
02-26-2010, 10:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Woshie
If you penalised losing people would just leave games they are outnumbered.
Being outnumbered is a separate issue which Cryptic can and must address, as is going AFK.

My thinking is that we just need a way to sort out the "griefers" - people who just want the match to end and will ruin the game for everyone else in trying to end it quickly. Dying more than anyone else could mean a number of things but at some point it becomes obvious that you are either griefing or are just so utterly terrible that you are effectively griefing, just by being so very bad at the game.


A better solution might be some kind of chess style rating system, just so that we can try and put higher rank people against higher rank people.

e.g., people in the queue:
Fed A rating 400 (terrible)
Fed B rating 1000 (meh)
Fed C rating 2000 (pro)
Fed D rating 1200
Fed E rating 800
Fed F rating 1800

My team goes in and our average rating is 400 because we suck. The queue picks out players A,B,D,E and F, skipping C because it's picking the 5 people closest to us in rating.

My team goes in and our average rating is 2000 because we rock. The queue picks out players B-F, skipping A because it's picking the 5 people closest to us in rating.


Perhaps after being skipped a number of times it will just throw you into the next game regardless but at least it would be making an effort to match skill levels rather than constantly throwing pro winners and suicidal losers into the same games.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
02-26-2010, 10:20 AM
Or, simply give rewards based purely on participation, with a bonus to the winners.

Ask Meat_Machine to post his elaboration on this, it's a good system in my opinion.


In terms of ratings, make ratings based on participation (as above) and not necessarily win:loss ratios, and implement them in multi-tier arenas:

http://forums.startrekonline.com/sho...d.php?t=127714
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
02-26-2010, 10:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt_Dravis
Or, simply give rewards based purely on participation, with a bonus to the winners.

Ask Meat_Machine to post his elaboration on this, it's a good system in my opinion.


In terms of ratings, make ratings based on participation (as above) and not necessarily win:loss ratios, and implement them in multi-tier arenas:

http://forums.startrekonline.com/sho...d.php?t=127714
This is already the case.

I participate always. Except when arriving late..no damage done = no reward...so those afkers are blowing themselves up...(giving a free kill to the other side) and then afking for a ~90ish point reward) max participation leading in healing and high over 100k damage dealth = 200point+ rewards when losing and 230 point rewards when winning....

They do need to cut the losers rewards down to about 30ish points to frustrate them into participating..
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
02-26-2010, 10:27 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lugh View Post
This is already the case.
No, it's not. At the moment rewards are not purely participation based. I can do 0 damage and 0 healing and still receive the same (or very nearly the same) rewards as someone who did the second most damage and/or the second most healing.

Furthermore, 'participation' at the moment only goes off damage dealt and hull repair, and does not take into account buffs/debuffs and shield repair, so this is not a true measure of participation.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
02-26-2010, 11:02 AM
In PvP matches i tend to have the lowest kill and dmg rate plus highest death rate because i am usually the first to open up on a fed ball and this does usually put me at the bottom of the board,im not that good at pvp but i try to follow others examples and improve

Im not trying to suicide or lose quickly, i fight to win, even if it looks like we will lose anyway my focus stays the same
If because of this style i get little or no rewards for participating then i might as well stick to the pve stuff (what there is of it at this time) and ignore pvp

I agree that there should be a way to penalise players that just sit and do nothing or try to lose a match but if there is too heavy a penalty for coming at the bottom it would create a free for all rather than a group situation

Reporting a player leads to its own potential problems
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
02-26-2010, 11:48 PM
as long as they dont change the medal reward - would suck if you get 0 badges if your side lost, even if you died 10 times or 15 times.. some people get picked on - or just suck but are pvping to get some decent gear.
A rating system imo would be terrible also :p breeds elitist jerks who belittle everyone just because of their score , then you have a horde of these little kids running around saying "haha stfu your 1200 in the rankings your nothing.."

i thought the system is fine as it is now..it adjusts according to how much you participated (ive noticed if im semi afk and eating food, not paying attention and only have like 1-2 kills i only get 20 or so badges, where as if i was actually playing i am usually 30-33 badges) not sure if that applies to the xp or not though
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
02-27-2010, 12:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NathanK
as long as they dont change the medal reward - would suck if you get 0 badges if your side lost, even if you died 10 times or 15 times.. some people get picked on - or just suck but are pvping to get some decent gear.
A rating system imo would be terrible also :p breeds elitist jerks who belittle everyone just because of their score , then you have a horde of these little kids running around saying "haha stfu your 1200 in the rankings your nothing.."

i thought the system is fine as it is now..it adjusts according to how much you participated (ive noticed if im semi afk and eating food, not paying attention and only have like 1-2 kills i only get 20 or so badges, where as if i was actually playing i am usually 30-33 badges) not sure if that applies to the xp or not though
Very well put. I also am I against removing the XP for a losing team. At T5 this would become a major issue for Klingons. Today I tried T5 and for the most part we were vastly outnumbered. Good game was 6k vs 8f. System is fairly balanced as it sits; those who want to blow themselves up can continue doing so. It doesn't affect PvP that much.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
02-27-2010, 01:19 AM
The matchmaker balance issue is seperate from this really, and yes, is the #1 problem with pvp in my opinion as well.

I'm assuming they fix that thing cause gods, if they don't, and fast, pvp will be dead anyways. Match after match after match with 1v3 or worse. And for some reason the matchmaker will KEEP ADDING TO THE LARGER TEAM. WTF matchmaker? Why are you so stupid?
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