Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
02-26-2010, 04:20 PM
I too agree, in general, with your thoughts on this matter. I am a 'very' casual player, possibly only 5 to maybe 6 hours a day, and not all in one sitting. Still only took me approximately 4 weeks to max rank. That includes my headstart time as well.

But......isn't there always a 'but'? *smirk*

If they basically nerf ranks, after all these people have attained Admiral status, you 'know' there will be a huge outcry, and butthurt folks out there. Basically the "I Win" folks that powered through to max rank.

I don't think Cryptic is ready for a new wave of QQ and Whining threads that this will involve.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
02-26-2010, 04:21 PM
I agree with adding new ranks as they should be there, but I can't stand how long it takes to rank up already. For someone that does play for hours everyday sure you get there fast, but for the rest of us no so much. I just made it to Cmdr 1 and I have been playing since head start. They need a balance between the two and just adding more ranks I think would be enough.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
02-26-2010, 04:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillyWonkaCF
I agree with adding new ranks as they should be there, but I can't stand how long it takes to rank up already. For someone that does play for hours everyday sure you get there fast, but for the rest of us no so much. I just made it to Cmdr 1 and I have been playing since head start. They need a balance between the two and just adding more ranks I think would be enough.
You think making Commander now, after only a few weeks, is too slow??

There's only two more ranks, man. You make Captain, then Admiral, then you're done.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
02-26-2010, 04:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProfessorSTAFF
I believe that our advancement through this game is happening too quickly. We gain ranks too fast, hit Admiral too soon, and then find ourselves with little else to do.

Adding endgame content is great, but we also need to slow the time it takes to reach endgame. Endgame should take a lot longer.

My suggestion is to restructure how the ranks are:
While I agree with a lot of the points you make, this was all discussed prior to launch and I seem to recall seeing a developer post someplace stating that they were pretty happy with the progression based on the data they were seeing.

MMO's are difficult as they try to accommodate many different types of people and often don't succeed. Some people will burn through the content at a phenomenal rate (and will complain loudly about the lack of content before going to haunt the next shiny new MMO they can "win") while others will struggle to make max level after a year.

I think Cryptic's design goal should have been a longer progression, but it seems they opted for a shorter one which makes me think they likely have additional tricks up their sleeves coming "soon" to keep the average player coming back for more. I say "average" player since again -- some people will burn through content in an instant regardless and it is usually too difficult to accommodate that crowd in the long term as they are often not in the majority.

Before I get myself in trouble, however, for suggesting that those who are already a Rear Admiral or near it are in the minority, I'd be curious to get some data from Cryptic in another month or two with regards to the "average" player level, amount of time played per week, etc. as ultimately, I think that is what the main target should be.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
02-26-2010, 04:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProfessorSTAFF
You think making Commander now, after only a few weeks, is too slow??

There's only two more ranks, man. You make Captain, then Admiral, then you're done.
Which is why I agree with adding the additional ranks(with the necessary skillpoints for each) not just adding inbetween. However, increasing the amount of skill points for each would make a more casual gamer give up as they feel like they are just running in place.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
02-26-2010, 04:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eleglas View Post
I like the idea of being a Ensign and using a Runabout for a while. But I totally disagree with how long it takes to rank up! Keep the rank up times as they are, but add the extra ranks.

I hate being stuck as Lt for ages, the Miranda is crap and I can never wait to get rid of it!
I gotta say the runabouts are fun, and although the current cost is quite high, I would reccomend people picking one up to play around in. Sadly, you can't do higher missions in your runabout, but it is a good way for Captains to play with their lieutenant friends.

That's what gave me the idea that we should start in a runabout instead of the Miranda-class. Having one at the start would be more fun, and a great way to get some use out of the thing. Also, when we do get our first ship, it helps ease the slower level progression that I am suggesting. Getting new ships is a fun little deversion that mixes up your day.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
02-26-2010, 04:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eleglas View Post
I like the idea of being a Ensign and using a Runabout for a while. But I totally disagree with how long it takes to rank up! Keep the rank up times as they are, but add the extra ranks.

I hate being stuck as Lt for ages, the Miranda is crap and I can never wait to get rid of it!
I think this illustrates the current problem. Each rank, especially the higher ones, should have more than one tier of ship that opens up at that level. I don't think most players care that they went from lt to lt cmdr, just that they got a new ship, and the same with lt cmdr to cmdr. If there were two or three tiers of ships that opened up within each rank at different grade levels, you could even justify getting rid of all the admirals we're seeing flying around. And for the upcoming raidisodes, doesn't it make more sense to have five elite captains teaming together on their ships and (especially) on the ground to take down the Borg and whatnot rather than five admirals?

'Cause everyone knows a true Trekkie wants to be The Captain, not some admiral-rank weasel.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
02-26-2010, 05:54 PM
Consider this a signature!


I am very upset with how QUICKLY we progress! I swear, I am not powering through the game, and I am already a very high rank. I really tried taking it slow, and I plan to roll up a toon to do it over again, but I'd prefer a longer jounrey.


Yeah, I like the sound of that: a longer journey.


Kudos to the OP.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
02-26-2010, 06:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ProfessorSTAFF
I believe that our advancement through this game is happening too quickly. We gain ranks too fast, hit Admiral too soon, and then find ourselves with little else to do.

Adding endgame content is great, but we also need to slow the time it takes to reach endgame. Endgame should take a lot longer.

My suggestion is to restructure how the ranks are:

Cadet

You begin the tutorial as a third year cadet, doing field work aboard a Miranda-class starship. This is how the tutorial starts, and you go through it exactly the same except that you are a cadet, not an Ensign. If people object to the idea of a cadet going over to a borg-infested ship alone, then redo the transport to be part of a full away team...which quickly gets killed, leaving only you. Your choice of the first three officers should be stated as NCOs.

At the end of the tutorial, you are awarded for your bravery and excellence by being made a full Ensign. The NCO you picked comes along, having forged a strong bond with you during the attack. Here's where it gets different: YOU ARE NOT PUT IN COMMAND OF THE SHIP. Instead, you are assigned to work directly under Admiral Quinn and given a runabout to fly about in. The runabout would be a perfect first ship, and technically you are working for Admiral Quinn. Ensign takes just as long as lieutenant does now. When you've 10 ranks of Ensign, you are promoted, but not to a full lieutenant, instead you are made lieutenant junior grade.

Lieutenant Junior Grade

This should take twice as long as Ensign did to complete. You still have your runabout, and still serve Admiral Quinn. Some missions let you take command of the Miranda class ship from the tutorial, but you don't get to keep it...yet. As a lieutenant junior grade, you can have more ensigns as BOs, and I envision this rank progresses like longer, watered down version of what lieutenant now is. When you complete it you are made a full lieutenant.

Lieutenant

For your amazing work, heroics, and because a war is on, you are given command of the Miranda class from the tutorial. You can have Ensign and lieutenant junior grades on your staff, as well as a bunch of crewmen and NCOs. People should stay a lieutenant for a long time. Add new ships that we can buy, and a lot more content like exploration and first contact and diplomacy to give us more to do. Staying lieutenant for a long time is less painful when we can get new ships, new designs, etc. I want to stress this should take a very long time to progress through, ever for power players. In terms of Star Trek, think of how Lieutenant Worf was a lieutenant for the entire seven years of Star Trek: TNG. I think they said in Starfleet that lieutenant is a rank some people stay in for about 7-10 years, some even longer. I'd say we should expect 7-10 weeks as lieutenant in this game if we want to make it long term.

Lieutenant Commander

This is the rank that people should settle in to. It should take a very long time to reach it, and once you do there should be A LOT to do. LOTS of different ships of different costs and abilities. LOTS more skills to learn, lots more BOs to get, LOTS more adventures and things to customize. It should be RARE to see people above Lieutenant Commander.

Commander

This should take an enormous amount of time to go through. Captain should be considered a legendary rank. We need a lot of ships and designs to choose from and more functions for our BOs. We need full ship's interiors with engineering, sickbay, holodecks, ten forwards, etc, and these rooms need to be bought by us, upgraded, credits spent, and give our ships powers and stats. Making commander take forever to get promoted from works if there's a lot more to do and a lot more to buy, etc.

Captain

This should be a rarer, almost legendary rank. The idea of making Admiral should be years off.

Admirals

From memory alpha: Starfleet admiral is a military rank, the equivalent of which is used by the service organizations of many civilizations. As a traditional naval grade, admirals command fleets of ships, as opposed to captains commanding single ships or units. Many rank systems, including that used by various incarnations of Starfleet, have been known to use several grades of the admiral rank, which include, in order from most senior: fleet admiral, admiral, vice admiral, rear admiral and rear admiral lower half (also known simply as commodore).


So we should have a lot of Admiral ranks, each of which take for freaking ever to complete. We're talking years here, people.

*Fleet Admiral

*Admiral

*Vice Admiral

*Rear Admiral

*Read Admiral Lower Half (commodore)


I believe that if we have a restructuring in this fashion, we can extend the life and playability of the game. To counter the frustrations of spending so much longer in each rank Cryptic needs to really expend a great deal of energy into not only creating new missions, but also expanding just what you can do with your time in the game. Add first contact, exploring, fix crafting, fix and expand PvP, add TONS more ships available at each rank, add ship interiors which need to be bought and upgraded, etc.

I like your suggestion but to balance and be fair to the playerbase this addition to your suggestion would be nice, I'm all for slowing down rank progression and would like to see more additions added to rank Vice Adm. Admiral and Fleet Admiral. However once you reach the end rank the option to progress on a alt should be x2 faster unless you roll another faction, going thru the same content more than once is repetitive and very unnecessary and with this little addition makes rolling alts more enjoyable and bearable. If there wasn't a skill cap then this suggestion wouldn't be needed but since they added the cap rolling alts is necessary.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
02-26-2010, 10:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jojobean View Post
If there wasn't a skill cap then this suggestion wouldn't be needed but since they added the cap rolling alts is necessary.
I am all in favor of

a) removing the skillcap

b) expanding/adding new skills to train in

c) allowing people to change professions
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