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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
02-27-2010, 05:46 PM
Direct your anger at the devs not the players. Spawn camping happens on both sides in almost every place where pvp can happen.

Poor planning and design of the system.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
02-27-2010, 06:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anxiety
Edit: A few MMOs stick guards around the spawns, but all that does is move the spawncamps about 10 feet out. Spawncamping is part and parcel of every pvp MMO I've ever seen, so uh, good luck with that.
which make it a reason that it shouldn't be tackled?

There is no circumstance in which spawncamping, or refusing to engage by cloaking can be condoned.

Given the amount of data that pings back and forth for these games, surely there is some kind of way to recognise a group doing this...and penalise accordingly.

I do it, because everyone else does it is a pretty poor excuse.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
02-27-2010, 07:57 PM
Well coming from Klingon side, the problem with spawn camping is that there are generally a goodly percentage of feds who either never leave their spawn point, or leave it very, very slowly, to stay in a group. If we always wait for the feds, some of the time we'd never get a battle.

So I know the general rule of thumb I have is that if the feds have a) moved or b) layed mines, then they're fair game, regardless of their numbers. Moving indicated patrolling, which means they're trying to find me, and mines means they're laying camoflage or defending themselves.

And once the battle starts, I'm not going to wait for you to spawn, set up your ship, and fire on me first.

Sure its not a perfect system, but what system is. Targets sitting still, doing nothing, are simply trying to team up and spawn in. Yes I understand that feds patrol and lay mines to try and stop the klingon spawn campers, but at the same time, I have to make a decision sometime a line needs to be drawn.

Also, its very hard to control your entire team sometimes.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
02-27-2010, 08:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cuffs View Post
Well coming from Klingon side, the problem with spawn camping is that there are generally a goodly percentage of feds who either never leave their spawn point, or leave it very, very slowly, to stay in a group. If we always wait for the feds, some of the time we'd never get a battle.

So I know the general rule of thumb I have is that if the feds have a) moved or b) layed mines, then they're fair game, regardless of their numbers. Moving indicated patrolling, which means they're trying to find me, and mines means they're laying camoflage or defending themselves.

And once the battle starts, I'm not going to wait for you to spawn, set up your ship, and fire on me first.

Sure its not a perfect system, but what system is. Targets sitting still, doing nothing, are simply trying to team up and spawn in. Yes I understand that feds patrol and lay mines to try and stop the klingon spawn campers, but at the same time, I have to make a decision sometime a line needs to be drawn.

Also, its very hard to control your entire team sometimes.
Klingon- you have honor. I look forward to seeing you in a match sometime.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
02-28-2010, 12:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by scud.nz View Post
which make it a reason that it shouldn't be tackled?

There is no circumstance in which spawncamping, or refusing to engage by cloaking can be condoned.

Given the amount of data that pings back and forth for these games, surely there is some kind of way to recognise a group doing this...and penalise accordingly.

I do it, because everyone else does it is a pretty poor excuse.
See, again, the problem we have here, is you think it's wrong, I could care less. It's a video game. Don't like it, whine at cryptic to created protected spawn zones. The player generated drama over it, while amusing for a bit, is pretty dumb, and as I've been trying to point out and it doesn't seem to be sinking in, is the people who do it do not even remotely care what your opinions are nor do they have to. Unless you're gonna pay their subs, they get to play however they'd like.

But jesus, if you actually think they're going to punish people for spawncamping? Is this your first MMO or something?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
02-28-2010, 01:45 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike111
Direct your anger at the devs not the players. Spawn camping happens on both sides in almost every place where pvp can happen.

Poor planning and design of the system.
...I wouldn't call it ..poor. The Ground PVP is extremely fun and addicting. The spawn in issue can be fixed by simply having a spawn area that is a safezone( perhaps a lil room thru a wall ) . Once you step out , you cant get back in . Now this would bring about a massing of players ....if the line breaks and you get runover....the respawning team will be able to regroup that way, and /or there wont be any rezzing in to find 5 enemies all kicking your ass before you can even see them .
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
02-28-2010, 08:37 AM
I can only speak for myself, my fleet, and the few skilled pilots of the KDF iv'e flown with. Every premade I rolled with since the game came out someone on our team if not me has said "wait for them to group, wiping them out will teach us nothing."

In two matches last night with some of the best players Ive come across, neither side emloyed such tactics, or left the map, or grief cloaked. Both matches were a challenge, and we won 1 lost 1 as klingons. The moral of the story here is that the honorable warrior will sharpen his skills by seeking a challenge as opposed to only engaging when he can't lose. In said games last night T-minus said a few times "let me finish this guy" and the rest of the klinks didnt interfere. We arent playing for points, for medals, or fun e-peen glory. We are playing so when fear becomes relevant when you have a death penalty,the "reputation" of dedicated fleets like Murder, BOK, and so many others, will speak for itself. <S>
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
02-28-2010, 09:38 AM
Okay so what do you suggest, buddy. I know, put a forcefield up so that everyone who spawns in is invulnerable.

Oh wait all that'll happen is you'll be killed outside the bubble.

Or how about escort ships that spawn in whenever you spawn in, and hang out for a minute.

Oh wait, that's still awfully imbalanced, because often times a fed group won't totally come in until 2-3 minutes later. Sometimes even 5 minutes later.

How about a 10 second invuln buff.

Wait, that's basically RSP, and we can wait that through.

How about you wait in a "space lobby", which can see the entrance you're taking in, and wait until you're full well and ready to come in.

Oh wait, that's terrible griefing material. I could just join maps and afk and cost players the game. Or I could be shoved out after a few minutes, but that will mean you too can get spawn camped because fed players won't necessarily start until up to 5 minutes later.

There really isn't an easy way to fix this, and saying only klings do it is asinine; I've come into games and had feds sitting and waiting, or even to find they've already put down mines. Either side will do it given the opportunity. And there is no easy way to fix this without it being some terrible griefing material, because as long as you have a say as per when you join, you can grief the hell out of the system.

There is one solid defense, however; Get a group of 5 people together. Boom. Not only will you likely survive your spawn camp, you will likely not even encounter the spawn camp; Kling players have just joined too. You also build some relationship within the game up, and learn how to play within a group, a valuable experience that near well all klings have gotten down.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
02-28-2010, 09:46 AM
nm this post
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
02-28-2010, 09:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Anxiety
See, again, the problem we have here, is you think it's wrong, I could care less. It's a video game. Don't like it, whine at cryptic to created protected spawn zones. The player generated drama over it, while amusing for a bit, is pretty dumb, and as I've been trying to point out and it doesn't seem to be sinking in, is the people who do it do not even remotely care what your opinions are nor do they have to. Unless you're gonna pay their subs, they get to play however they'd like.

But jesus, if you actually think they're going to punish people for spawncamping? Is this your first MMO or something?
the point is not that they can, but they choose to .. because there is an option to do or dont doesnt mean both options are always right

thats the problem with life today .. people are given to many options and choices that allow them to "f**k up"

i'm sure that given an easy "flip-of-the-switch" option, the devs would turn on some type of "safe zone", however they are working on more important issues and expanding other areas .. as we all know, the game is only still in its infancy .. its up to the players to temporarily "fill in blanks"(options) .. its not required of anyone to "play fair", but it helps the game grow and survive in such a fragile stats as it is now .. and lets not go overboard by my "play fiar" statement, we have a right to use every skill in the game, even OP ones, i am talking about the "grey areas" such as spawn camping and such .. go ahead and use your OP skills if you need them to win
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