Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
03-11-2010, 09:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptic_Gozer
I couldnt help but notice you failed to respond to the comments made concerning space combat and how zergish it is because of the way the game is laid out.

I didn't respond to it because I don't think it has anything to add to this thread. I'm sorry you feel that way, but I didn't make the "Entire" game, I'm just here to update you on this mission.

Edit - You know in all honesty you guys better put those heads together and figure out this riad content and difficulty so that people can pug this effectively, this game genre is not your world of ******** player base.

We weren't trying to make these PUG freindly, they are designed for a small group of people that play together often and like to work as a team.. you know.. Like a Task Force even... Make some friends, play with them often, or don't .. Thats your call, but the overall design is working as we intended.

Learn from SOE's mistakes with Star Wars Galaxies. You'd be the first group to take those lessons to heart IMO
I stand corrected. But as far as you not making the "entire" game, how can you work effectively to make one part harder, if the game mechanics have you hemmed in to a way that you cant alter?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
03-11-2010, 10:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptic_Gozer
Hmmm.. interesting, so far all the reports I have seen have pointed at the first part as being the one where most people are not getting the credit. I'll look at that particular break point when i get a chance. As to your actual question, that's pretty much the reason i haven't put that in yet.. I'm still looking to see if there is something else hiding from me first. If it breaks on you again at that part... send a bug right then, so we can look at whats going on from the info you bug will capture.

Gozer
Check out this thread http://forums.startrekonline.com/sho...d.php?t=134822 especially post #2 where he identifies the problem he experienced:

"3) Fight our way through the first part of the ground encounter and defeat Captain Ogen (do NOT receive the last part, Deeper into the Mystery - While the bottom portion of the quest tracker (mission specific objectives) shows the objectives for Deeper into the Mystery, the top portion (which shows multiple missions you have) stays Fact or Fiction)."

I hope that helps.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
03-11-2010, 10:04 PM
Ok, on the chance that this is helpful Gozer, I have seen three seperate occations where someone in my group did not get credit.

We did not do any fancy 'drop it and re-take it' stuff. We did not do any "complete part of it today, and the rest tomorrow' type stuff either.

Every Infected run I have done is complete beginning to end. Everyone logs in and gets the quest as soon as it is avaialble. Once we have five ready to go, we all head in. We clear the space part (very quickly I might add), and then we cancel the 'beam down' prompt. We have to do this, in order to fly around and collect our loot first.

In the ground instance, the zerging largely continues, until we reach the first boss.

To fight the first boss, we first clear the two nodes in his room, and then all the borg. Once he is the only guy left, we engage him. Once we take a chunk out of him, he spawns two more nodes and a bunch more borg into the room. We then turn our focus to those two nodes, and try to take them both out quickly before we are all killed. We ARE killed. No matter how good we are, we always die at this point. The swarm of borg are far too much to survive, even a well equipped group with two or three medics in the team.

We run all the way back to the boss room. And start clearing the borg, and any nodes we failed to kill. Finally, we engage the boss again, and kill him. We collect his loot, and then open the forcefield.

Now, the zerging continues, but at least we have a closer respawn point now.

Finally we reach the final room. We take a quick afk break if needed, or explain the encounter, if we have a new player in the team.

The final room plays out something like this:

1. We all run in, kill the three borg (twice) on the center platform. The two worst jumpers in the group stay on the center platform as fire support. Our three best jumpers circle the room, dealing with the corner forcefields.

2. In each corner, we kill the 4 borg (twice each) and then get in position and do a 1, 2, 3. With the forcefield down, we quickly 'upload the virus', and move to the next platform, and this whole process repeats.

3. The timer on the first one we virused is right about at the limit, considering all the borg we have to kill. When we successfully get all 4 viruses, it is with seconds to spare. We quickly shoot down the center generator, and hope that we kill it before that first virus runs out of time.

4. At this point, we only have a short period of time to relocate to our favorite spots, before the borg queen begins her rampage. Different people like to fight in different places. Some on the center platform, some on the corner platforms. Personally, I prefer to sit at the entrance door.

*sidenote: sometimes her attacks will actually push one of us through the forcefield, trapping us outside the room. That sucks.

5. We now proceed to shoot her, heal franticly, and revive each other if possible. Barring any flukes, she dies, and her loot spawns on the center platform.

6. Before picking up the big loot, we kill the remaining borg in the room, and collect their loot. Finally, we claim the big loot, and check out how awsome or dissapointing the purple item is.

7. At this point, most of us typically turn in the quest and call it a day. But there have been three seperate occations at this point in the quest, where someone in my group suddenly says some bad words and "it didnt finish!"

The first time it was the guy's very first run through infected, and he had just picked up the quest before coming to the system.

The second time it was a different player, who had already completed the instance a few times before.

The third time, it was that first guy again. He had completed it successfully a couple times since that first run, but he wasn't happy to see it break on him again.

So that is everything I can tell you about this problem. It hasn't happened to me personally, so I cannot think of anything the players might have done wrong to cause it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
03-11-2010, 10:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptic_Gozer
I couldnt help but notice you failed to respond to the comments made concerning space combat and how zergish it is because of the way the game is laid out.

I didn't respond to it because I don't think it has anything to add to this thread. I'm sorry you feel that way, but I didn't make the "Entire" game, I'm just here to update you on this mission.

Edit - You know in all honesty you guys better put those heads together and figure out this riad content and difficulty so that people can pug this effectively, this game genre is not your world of ******** player base.

We weren't trying to make these PUG freindly, they are designed for a small group of people that play together often and like to work as a team.. you know.. Like a Task Force even... Make some friends, play with them often, or don't .. Thats your call, but the overall design is working as we intended.

Learn from SOE's mistakes with Star Wars Galaxies. You'd be the first group to take those lessons to heart IMO
Atleast now we know the intentions of Cryptic for STF's.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
03-11-2010, 10:17 PM
Oh... I just thought of something that might be important.

Upon first entering the ground portion of the instance, you are required to speak to the NPC there, for a mission update. Only one person really needs to talk to the NPC, and it updates the mission for everyone in the group.

What if someone in the group has not yet zoned into the instance yet, or is on the loading screen when this NPC is talked to? Could it be that they are not getting this update?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
03-11-2010, 10:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vobe
What if someone in the group has not yet zoned into the instance yet, or is on the loading screen when this NPC is talked to? Could it be that they are not getting this update?
I think this may be a factor, as the other night i was slightly late zoning in and even though i personally talked to the NPC and chose the green option(twice for good measure), the mission did not update for me past Fact or Fiction. Ended up beating the queen, no completion, no marks. Ticketed, remains to be seen if im reimbursed for the marks, most likely not.

I did encounter this "progression bug" a few times while lvling, but not every time was in a group, if i recall correctly.

If anyone knows of a workaround to somehow get the mission to update again(zone out/in again, relog, recite incantations) id be happy to know, im inciined to hold off on Infected for now, because it was very frustrating to beat her, along with my team(who all got completion) and not get the marks.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
03-11-2010, 10:38 PM
Quote:
This was much more pug friendly, however some were farming the first mission objective, so we moved then to the end of the mission.
It's sad to see people can essentially waste 1-2 hours grinding through the first 2/3 of this mission only to have the last 3rd stop them from getting a reward.

Why not just make it so you can only earn 5 valor every 24 hours from the Infected Raidisode instead of removing Valor from each piece. Or just make it so that the pickup timer starts after completing one third of it?

You can join another group if you already have done other parts that they haven't and just redo them and get drops and such just no Valor...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
03-11-2010, 10:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptic_Gozer
I couldnt help but notice you failed to respond to the comments made concerning space combat and how zergish it is because of the way the game is laid out.

I didn't respond to it because I don't think it has anything to add to this thread. I'm sorry you feel that way, but I didn't make the "Entire" game, I'm just here to update you on this mission.

Edit - You know in all honesty you guys better put those heads together and figure out this riad content and difficulty so that people can pug this effectively, this game genre is not your world of ******** player base.

We weren't trying to make these PUG freindly, they are designed for a small group of people that play together often and like to work as a team.. you know.. Like a Task Force even... Make some friends, play with them often, or don't .. Thats your call, but the overall design is working as we intended.

Learn from SOE's mistakes with Star Wars Galaxies. You'd be the first group to take those lessons to heart IMO
I like it, death to PuG is a good thing
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
03-11-2010, 10:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cryptic_Gozer
Not getting mission credit. We have had a few reports of this, and we have looked into it. I canít reproduce it on this end, but we have a good idea how this might be happening to a few of you. The simple explanation is that you are not getting mission credit for the first part of the episode, and then beaming down to the ground with your team. This may be due to how fast you guys are completing the first part of the mission (Iíll explain this in just a min), although I suspect it has something to do with joining groups where you guys are all on different stages of the episode.
Just to add some clarification here, in case my above post wasnt clear in all aspects.

When I did this last night along with our team, we actually all dropped and retook the mission just prior to starting the mission. Also we played the first part of the mission we believe its "meant" to be played, with 2 ships attempting to snipe the conduit while the rest keep the blobs off our backs. We suceeded but it was in no way a "zerg", nor was it particulariy fast. I'm looking forward to seeing the changes on test to the space portion, as this to me is the most fun part of the mission. Also while were on the issue, i believe the tactical cube could use a buff. Higher base resistance on its hull, higher regeneration and perhaps a hull repair ability. It also needs to shoot multiple targets "simultaneously" not just its aggroed target(refer to typical cube behaviour in the shows).

Also as far as i know its not possible to have someone zone into the space portion(Stop the Flow) if they are on another part of the mission. (they will get a beam down dialog instead) This would seem to contradict your conclusion above.

Above, if by "first part" you are referring to "Stop the Flow" we all did get completion for this. For me it appears to happen as soon as the tactical cube is destroyed, and the music changes. I didnt look closely however.

What happened next is we all beamed into the station. Possibly someone talked to the NPC before i had fully materialized, thus triggering the next step of Fact or Fiction(locate base commander) before i had zoned in completely. However i did speak to the NPC and chose the How can we help(the green option) twice just to make sure. On my screen i had the first subobjective completed, and everything seemed to update fine. However(i did not realise this until much later) on my Episode log i never progressed past Fact or Fiction. Fact or Fiction stayed active for the duration, and subsequently i was unable to gain completion of the mission.

Suggestion for reproducing: Make a team of 5 players, complete the Stop the flow(spacepart) encounter as normal. Then have 4 persons of your team beam in, and have the last member zone just as you are about to select the green option in the dialog(so that he is in-transit while the quest updates) and get back to us. If you all have very fast computers this could be an issue, i suggest having the 5th person use your least powerful machine. I believe this is the issue and i believe it could be fixed by having the most recent quest update "pulse" to all members as soon as a new team member zones in(and one more time about 10 seconds later for good measure).

Keep at it, this issue is holding me(and presumably others) from doing Infected, and i do appreciate doing it, just not so much for no rewards.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
03-12-2010, 01:46 AM
I love how the entire game is a casual solofest and then they make the only end-game content require a team of people that play together frequently and can work together.

yeah. I think i'll be cancelling my subscription if I can't pug any end game content.

i'm apalled that this "gozer" has so much power at cryptic and is in charge of this stuff, he's single handedly ruining my experience with STO and is eventually going to cause me to quit if things don't start looking up.
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