Battle Cloaking/Evade is countered by tractor beam or scan. You know this. Also, when you pop that BoP out of cloak, they don't always get their shields up. So you get to do phaser (if you are using anything other than phasers, you really should consider switching.

The sci spam? Well, I personally hate that build, but even so, it is a weak build because it lacks both damage and defenses...especially with the upcoming nerf to cannons.

All in all, I feel that the advantages of the BoP are balanced with it's weaknesses. I am not saying that there aren't problems with pvp, but that you are focusing on the wrong aspects.

You make a good point, not denying this, however I think the issue is more subtle.

the solution in my opinion should not be to Nerf the Ship but rather to revise the ability/power.

For all intents and purposes, BOP's are the equivalent of a Science Ship from a Warrior society perspective. Within the premise of a War a science focus, takes on the Role of Scouting, intelligence gathering, infiltration, Sabotage, and the BOP is a perfect ship to this, it is supposed to be versatile.

Therefore in my opinion the Ship and its capabilities is not the issue causing imbalance, but rather the nature of the Abilities/powers combined with the capabilities of a versatile ship.

If we wish to really correct the imbalance it would be more effective to do it by eliminating the Overpowered Element, in this case, certain abilities and powers, that would need to be revised so that when combined with a versatile ship it does not result in an Overpowered mechanic.

In my opinion.

Ok first off, the popularity of the bird of prey versus the raptor in tier 5 has no basis on the discussion other than it hints at the PERCEPTION people have about strength, and not about the actual strength of the ship. If you want to try to argue that having 1 more turret with rapid fire going and 1 more disruptor console for even more damage doesn't equate to more dps than go ahead and try.

Also, if you want to kill someone in sub 5 seconds, you need to have at least: attack pattern beta 2, high yield 1, rapid fire 1, and ideally attack pattern alpha if you're a tac officer. If I loaded up a BoP with lets see. Feedback pulse 3, 2, VM 2, hazard emitters 1, science team 2, polarize hull and some other LT science ability for my Com and LT Com slots which would leave 2 LT BO slots for 1 engineer (for 1 RSP and engy team 1) and 1 Tac (for high yield 1 and rapid fire 1) I would do soooo much less burst damage than with my current build, I also would not have 2 ways to get out of VM as I do now (omega 3 and science team 2).

So why would I need someone to not being moving because of VM when I can sneak up to within 5 km and instagib people with my raptor?

This next point is basically the same as the first, you're using your own anecodatal evidence that points to the popularity of the bird of prey versus the raptor and therefor the BoP is better. This is a fallacy, just because something is popular DOES NOT MEAN IT IS BETTER or correct. And yes my position is precisely this: The raptor is on par with the bird of prey in pvp as the premier damage dealing platform available to klingons. Why do I need to fly a bird of prey when my Sci officer friends are already providing all the wonderful benefits you love to wag around like some banner. The Sci officers line up the ducks, the Engies keep me and the Sci officers alive, and I make the feddies dead.

I'd like to point out that evasive manuevers with high engine power against most people is get out of jail free by itself as most people choose not to pursue. Rsp won't help you however if they do pursue, you'll still need to drop shields at some point to battlecloak. I'm not saying battlecloak is useless, it has it's uses, but I don't agree with your stance on it. Also, did you really need to resort to calling into to question my ability to play the game simply because I don't agree with your position and provided my rationale for it?

This is a good thread about universal BO slots.


IMO i think all fed ships should have atleast 1 LT CDR, or LT universal slot

Same goes for Klingons. (Exception the BoP, which is a multi purpose, jack of all trades, master of none type vessel)





What does the "K" on Klin(K) come from....I remember Klingon...where does this K develop from? Is this some sort of racial slur? Something we are not "suppose" tolerate IRL, but we tolerate in game? I can draw comparisons, but, I prefer not to.

No.

this line used to fill 10 chars.

Give feds a carrier that can **** out npc's like the klingons with universal stations and problem solved you have balance pvp

Do PVP with a Bird of Prey through level 11, you'll be very appreciated of the universal bridge officer spots. Put yourself in the Klingon shoes, and you'll understand things a bit better.

This is the Fed's game. They will continue to try to nerf the KDF into the ground so that even the worst Fed player will be able roflstomp any Klink into oblivion.

These folks are only concerned about their own fun and could care less about anyone else.

They make blanket statements about our ships and combat and have never even bother to roll a Toon up to cap to really find out if their perceptions are correct.

It will be great when the 3rd faction is brought in and that faction stomps them too. Ohh the river that QQ will create....

I can't wait till the update when spacebar mashing will result in less damage because of the new changes. More rivers of QQ in the future.

Yeah, 3rd faction will be great. Klingons will go from 6 total players to 3.

Actually the popularity DOES have a direct relationship to it's usefulness in PvP.

Especially on a side that is mainly geared towards PvP functionality.

I'm not sure why you would think that someone is going to just randomly pick a specific ship type on a PvP faction "just because".

There is no logic in that, it doesn't make any sense, and it would be 100% wrong.

Just ask the Klink players in the OrganizedPvP channel.

Players are going to lean towards the more "OP" ship for obvious reason. lol



A few things.

#1. Sci spamming lasts longer then 5 seconds.

#2. Again loading up with primarily Tac Slots is unnecessary when Sci spamming.

Because VM does more then not make someone move.

It disables all their abilities (except team abilities) until they are hit with Sci team again or it's extremely long duration is completed.

No offense but I feel like I'm running a PvP Clinic here where you don't understand the full functionality of certain abilities.


A few things here -

#1. Because more Sci spamming atm is always best. It disables people from being able to help another person who was just Sci spammed.

#2. Because the only other ship with that type of Sci slot capability on Klink side is a Carrier and their Sci effectiveness is much less due to their turn rate.

This is the point of the conversation that gives me doubt you have ever done any T4-T5 PvP.

You seem to completely not understand how these abilities work and how they're used in normal PvP.


Allow me to reiterate - It is EFFORTLESS to distance yourself 15-20km away from your enemy using a Evasive Maneuver + RSP move then cloak.

This maneuver can be done in split seconds and is highly effective for survivability on a BoP.

Especially when the majority of players are still using Efficient engines and are CRUISERS.


Honestly I think a lot of this is a l2p on the side of the Klink players desperately trying to hold on to Sci Spamming BoPs that can Battle Cloak, have high survivability, and Fed escort "like" damage.

I really thought about this a little bit when I posted because of the fun factor that exists when I'm on my BoP PvPing.

However that fun factor is slowly fading because of the amount of ease that ship is to use in FvK PvP.


I really don't mind if someone here has a valid argument against my points.

But please at least have a basic understanding of PvP, don't try to fool PvP savvy players with silly comments based on fiction, and by all means counter the point with a fact or at least an opinion that can be based on some form of logic.


Saying that players choose a BoP over a Raptor not because of it's functionality and abilities in PvP but "just cuz" is a good example of a failed argument.

It ruins your credibility, wastes time on the forums, and most importantly wastes my time in replying if I choose to do so....