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# 1 Admiral Janeway's Toybox
03-15-2010, 12:13 PM
Just out of curiousity...

ST:VOY - Endgame

In the year 2404, Admiral Janeway uses her own personal shuttle to travel back and rescue Voyager.

Her shuttle features a stealth generator (cloak), ablative armor generators, transphasic torpedoes, and a synaptic transceiver which allowed her to use her neural interface to control the ship with her mind.

Now... STO takes place in 2409, which is 5 years later.

So...

Where's my stealth generator? And don't point at MES like it's the answer I'm looking for, because it's not and we all know it.

Where's my ablative armor generators? And again, don't point at the Ablative armor Eng console, because I'm pretty sure there's a difference between "fends off Borg weapons like a light breeze" and the 10% phaser resist we're looking at now.

We've got transphasic torpedoes, but I don't think I've seen a single shot take down a Cube yet. Could just be me though...


Now, you can say "Well, that was an alternate timeline" blah blah blah

But Voyager made it back safe and sound, with all of that technology in their pocket.

So what's kept Starfleet from reverse engineering it all in the last 5 years?
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# 2
03-15-2010, 01:18 PM
It wasn't an alternate timeline, it was the canon timeline. But what you're forgetting is that the Borg had 30 years to adapt and rebuild. I would imagine some of the explanation of how the Borg rebuilt the collective would be part of the future raidisodes.

But they have certainly had time to adapt to the transphasic torpedoes by now, although I certainly would say that transphasics need some significant buffing in game.
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# 3
03-15-2010, 01:20 PM
I'm sure the Federation still honors the Treaty of Algeron in an attempt to help restore peace with the Klingons and Romulans, which means no cloaking devices. Janeway was defying Federation law (not to mention time itself) when she took that shuttle, she likely had the cloaking device installed personally.

Yes, Janeway took her shuttle from the year 2404, but she went back to when Voyager was still in the Delta Quadrant, in the year 2378. Technology from 2404 would have a serious advantage over 2378 technology, even Borg tech, thus the one-shot on the Cube (two-shot? It was 2 torpedoes). However, it's obvious that the Borg survived neurolytic pathogen, so they likely collected the remains of Janeway's shuttle and assimilated what they could from it, nullifying a large part of that advantage. They had already begun to adapt to the Ablative Armor before Voyager even made it into the Transwarp Hub...

Don't get me wrong, I was really hoping to see Ablative Armor as some form of ability in this game (loved the animation sequence in Endgame). But implementing something like this would cause all sorts of animation and balance issues. The game is already easy enough, adding in Ablative Armor that can "fend off Borg weapons like a light breeze" would be far too powerful. And imagine the PVP battles where everyone is using it. It would take hours to finish a match.
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# 4
03-15-2010, 01:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinobiDragoon View Post
I'm sure the Federation still honors the Khitomer Accord in an attempt to help restore peace with the Klingons and Romulans, which means no cloaking devices. Janeway was defying Federation law (not to mention time itself) when she took that shuttle, she likely had the cloaking device installed personally.
It's actually the Treaty of Algeron, with the Romulans, which prevents Cloaking research.

And either way, I'm pretty sure I've been shot at plenty of times by the Klingons and the Romulans both.

So as Chef said, fudge 'em !
Quote:
Yes, Janeway took her shuttle from the year 2404, but she went back to when Voyager was still in the Delta Quadrant, in the year 2378. Technology from 2404 would have a serious advantage over 2378 technology, even Borg tech, thus the one-shot on the Cube (two-shot? It was 2 torpedoes). However, it's obvious that the Borg survived neurolytic pathogen, so they likely collected the remains of Janeway's shuttle and assimilated what they could from it, nullifying a large part of that advantage. They had already begun to adapt to the Ablative Armor before Voyager even made it into the Transwarp Hub...
The first Cube took 2 torps, but one was a glancing shot. The second Cube took a single torp.

And the complex where Admiral Janeway and the Queen were talking, was completely destroyed in the explosion that collapsed the Transwarp Conduit. So there wouldn't have been a shuttle left for them to assimilate.
Quote:
Don't get me wrong, I was really hoping to see Ablative Armor as some form of ability in this game (loved the animation sequence in Endgame). But implementing something like this would cause all sorts of animation and balance issues. The game is already easy enough, adding in Ablative Armor that can "fend off Borg weapons like a light breeze" would be far too powerful. And imagine the PVP battles where everyone is using it. It would take hours to finish a match.
I was really hoping Ablative Armor would have been something more substantial as well.

I'd envisioned as far as giving Escorts (which were the ships primarily carrying Ablative Armor) another layer of protection. So they HUD would display Shields, Armor, and then Hull.

If not that much, it still would be cool to have the graphics of the armor deploying. But that would also mean they'd need to get around to other ships graphics. Like the Intrepid nacelles or the BoP wings adjusting.

As for lengthy battles... why not? Everyone's complaining about combat being nothing more than Zerg until victory.
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# 5
03-15-2010, 01:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus_Gideon
It's actually the Treaty of Algeron, with the Romulans, which prevents Cloaking research.
Fixed

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus_Gideon
And either way, I'm pretty sure I've been shot at plenty of times by the Klingons and the Romulans both.

So as Chef said, fudge 'em !.
It's said several times that Federation is still pursuing restored peace with both factions. Sure, there is a war going on, but the Federation wants it to end (despite the constant offensive actions taken by the players, but we wouldn't have much of a game without that).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus_Gideon
And the complex where Admiral Janeway and the Queen were talking, was completely destroyed in the explosion that collapsed the Transwarp Conduit. So there wouldn't have been a shuttle left for them to assimilate.
There would still have been debris, and they still had the initial data from their first attempts to destroy Voyager. Certainly, the first Borg salvo only decreased the armor integrity to 97%, and held at 90% under fire from 3 Cubes... until Voyager was scanned and the armor suddenly fell to 50%, then 40%. The Borg were already adapting from the moment they began firing, and have had 30 years to study the data and further adapt, not 5 years.
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# 6
03-15-2010, 01:59 PM
Restoring peace, hah!

Although, if all the naysayers get their wish, and the game goes under (which I'm hoping it doesn't). I could see Cryptic coming along one day and saying "And then everyone was friends again, the end"

As for Borg adapting, I suppose I can see the stance. And having added resistance is better than a sharp stick in the eye, that's for sure.

I'd still like to see cosmetic ship effects, kinda like we have on ground missions.

When I swap Kits, my character sends out a weird looking pulse.

When I swap Armor, it shimmers into place.


It'd be kinda cool to see the Intrepid nacelles angle during those few seconds before we jump to warp.

Or have the BoP wings pivot based on the angle of flight (crazy mouse antics would lead to wing flapping lolz).

Or having armor deploy when the ship goes to Red Alert.
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# 7
03-15-2010, 02:05 PM
I have yet to see any Star Trek game apply the nacelle angle animation on the Intrepid-class (much to my sadness). I would love to see all the things you have pointed out as well, in particular the Ablative Armor, or any armor actually, dependent on which resistance console(s) you have equipped.

We can always hope, I suppose, since the game is only just starting out.
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# 8
03-15-2010, 10:31 PM
I think she (janeway) had upgraded the ship herself (as she was an admiral). The technology should be available on tier 5 ships (you would think).
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# 9
03-15-2010, 11:39 PM
To put it simply it's all Janeway's fault. The act of her going back in time to get her crew back in 7 years instead of the 23 years it would have taken in the alternate timeline, set the entire Federation back. I mean think about all the things she learned about the Borg and what new technology she would have had to adapt to fight them, all of that is lost because she wanted to save 7 of 9, Chakotay, and 22 other crew members.

So if you are looking for someone to blame, blame Janeway. :p
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# 10
03-16-2010, 09:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by skyhawk21 View Post
So if you are looking for someone to blame, blame Janeway.
Done. I agree things could be reverse-engineered as well, but decades of important experiences were clearly lost.
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