Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Stunn questions?
03-19-2010, 08:35 AM
Anyone know if they going to fix or address the instant stunn/expose in the next update. Some people are exploiting this heavily. Just run around with phasers with instant stunn, so your held and exposed instantly.

The same thing seems to occur with melee weapons. Once stunned you can be kept stunned till your exposed and just instantly killed. I don't mind dying, been playing pvp for years. It just gets frustrating when you can be permanetly stunned.

Player carries a stunn phaser and heavy dps weapon. Instantly stunns you with phaser and switches to other weapon to get the expose kill. If not exposed quickly switches back to phaser to keep you stunned because the cool down usually refreshes before the hold releases. Kind of sucks to sit there permantely stunned with no way to fight back.

Cheap tactic in my humble opinion. I know both sides use it but it needs to be addressed. I even started using it in retaliation but i find the tactic so easy and cheap i find it dishonoring to use. It insults people with real skill..

Anyway, hoping this gets addressed.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
03-19-2010, 09:29 AM
This is directed towards the devs.

Ensign Kelmvor is clearly taking a beating in ground PvP. He blames the game, and specifically you. He is correct, but not on any point he makes.

He is unable to describe exactly what combination is killing him, only that exploits and exposes kill him very quickly. Conditions are not discussed, and no context is offered. Whatever is killing him is a game feature I strongly support, because as someone who ground PvPs almost exclusively in game let me say there is remarkable balance within the system for those who play in it and understand it.

The real issue here is that Ensign Kelmvor is untrained, and has virtually no hope of getting the lessons necessary to compete effectively, thus will continue to vent frustration in every other direction.

In order for this to be resolved, I highly recommend Cryptic think seriously how the fleet system can be slightly adjusted to improve his situation. This is one proposal I hope is given consideration.

Players can be invited to the bridge of other players. If the bridge was an open PvP zone within a fleet, thus fleet members could kill, heal, buff, debuff, and res other fleet members within their own bridge, I could invite ensign Kelmvor to the bridge of my flagship and teach this young officer how to both kill and survive in PvP by SHOWING him both how to stay alive and how to quickly kill his enemies.

Without the ability to interact in PvP with this young ensign of PvP, there is no way I can effectively instruct him how to improve his experience and go over the various ways to improve his skill level. By addressing this within the fleet system, value is added to the team aspect and the game mechanics of the fleet.

As to the specific points addressed by Ensign Kelmvor, his complaints are made ignorant to the survival techniques that he will have to learn the hardest possible way - researching himself through the typed words of experts without any demonstration.

And that is a dev problem.

EDIT: The ensign added some details, and I still stand by everything written.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
03-19-2010, 09:47 AM
even easier, make entries in the combat log whenever you're stunned/held/exposed, etc. (including from whom, and using what ability) so you can review it afterwards and find out exactly what killed you.

more than once I've been just standing there with no (live) enemies around, and become exposed for no apparent reason. I'm pretty sure I know why, but it would really be nice to have some way to confirm it.

-ken
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
03-19-2010, 09:48 AM
On my KDF character, currently Tier 3, I run with a stun pistol and split beam rifle. I have noticed that if I use the pistol to stun someone more than once in succession, there appear to be diminishing returns on the stuns - subsequent stuns seem very brief.

I don't use the stun pistol specifically to expose, even though it has that chance. I use it to stun the target allowing me time to get behind them with a flanked split-beam shot after using Target Optics and its 10% expose chance. I also use the stun pistol to stop runners and allow my team to catch up.

Lately I have been thinking of using the sniper rifle for that flanked shot, and I will probably do that once the latest patch goes live. I feel quite effective with my stun-pistol tactics, and it is definitely not used to keep someone perma-stunned.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
03-19-2010, 10:07 AM
Kinja, thats pretty much how everyone with a clue in ground pvp plays too.

To the OP, its not pistols keeping you stunned. Its abilities, procs, stasis, knockdown/knockback effects, telekinisis, rifle butt spam, and a host of other effects. The pistol cannot keep anyone stunned by itself.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
03-19-2010, 11:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darksided View Post
...Players can be invited to the bridge of other players. If the bridge was an open PvP zone within a fleet, thus fleet members could kill, heal, buff, debuff, and res other fleet members within their own bridge, I could invite ensign Kelmvor to the bridge of my flagship and teach this young officer how to both kill and survive in PvP by SHOWING him both how to stay alive and how to quickly kill his enemies.

Without the ability to interact in PvP with this young ensign of PvP, there is no way I can effectively instruct him how to improve his experience and go over the various ways to improve his skill level. By addressing this within the fleet system, value is added to the team aspect and the game mechanics of the fleet.
...
Darksided, your comments got me to thinking.

As I understand it, you can invite members of the opposing faction onto your bridge, and combat is enabled against them - I remember reading about someone doing this recently. If that is the case, you could arrange combat training sessions by inviting those players who need training as well as members of the opposing faction (a friend's alt) onto your bridge. Then, using the opposing member as a sort of training dummy, you could demonstrate different combat tactics using real weapons, abilities, and effects.

This is worth testing!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
03-19-2010, 11:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kinja
As I understand it, you can invite members of the opposing faction onto your bridge, and combat is enabled against them - I remember reading about someone doing this recently. If that is the case, you could arrange combat training sessions by inviting those players who need training as well as members of the opposing faction (a friend's alt) onto your bridge. Then, using the opposing member as a sort of training dummy, you could demonstrate different combat tactics using real weapons, abilities, and effects.

This is worth testing!
Yes it is. I was unaware this was possible, but if it is, it would be useful. 99% of the complaints I read about ground PvP are said by someone who is clearly doing something wrong, and just needs a bit of advice and mentorship to get on the right track.

Ground PvP is hard to learn by trial and error without guidance.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
03-19-2010, 01:04 PM
yes, thats a good idea, but instead of using ur bridge, why not just go to ur holodeck, where its all practice, no rewards, or requirements needed (like rank/level)

...the patch been pushed back, so private matches would be a moot point atm.



But if players are curious, about ground combat. Slam's thread has the information.


What I do:


Klingon Tactical

1) Stun Pistol for expose
- faill to expose, close the distance and palm strike
- stun again if melee did not do anything.
- repeat
2) Split Beam for exploit
3) different team combination, i change kits. That also goes for the team playing against.


Star Fleet Tactical (Build for space combat, but I use the same method for ground. Unfortunately the traits I chose were for space, so I can't see ground stealth, or expose more.)

Star Fleet Science (Build to heal for ground combat)
Not being a doctor, and utilizing 2 other kits

1) Stasis field
2) scanner
3) Stun pistol
4) stasis field
5) mind meld
6) keep trying until I get an expose.

(rofl, apparently I do not get exposes easily so I keep locking them down till I get a expose)

*Flanking is a "must" more damage, better crits*


imo, ground traits and points into ground skills can make a real difference. A player with none or very little points into ground will do poorly, but will do better in space combat. But that all can be changed in how the "team work" plays out.
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