Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
03-21-2010, 11:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by spartan547 View Post
I tried a pre NGE server of SWG and I did not understand it. The game seemed empty, combat did not make any sense and the interface was hard to understand. I was only on it for about a week before I gave up. It probably would have been better if there were some player I could ask for help, but I highly doubt the server had a large population.
Pretty much my initial experience of SWG as well, it's like the game didnt want you to play it and did its best to offer absolutely no guidance. I quit for a while, then came back after the NGE.

Post-NGE was unbelievable. Whilst previously the game wasnt "noob" friendly, after the NGE it was not only difficult to get into but had also alienated the bulk of its player base. I remember a few people i'd met in my previous time with the game who were absolutely livid since the NGE had pretty much made all their previous effort in the game utterly pointless.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
03-21-2010, 11:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Caeran
Pretty much my initial experience of SWG as well, it's like the game didnt want you to play it and did its best to offer absolutely no guidance. I quit for a while, then came back after the NGE.

Post-NGE was unbelievable. Whilst previously the game wasnt "noob" friendly, after the NGE it was not only difficult to get into but had also alienated the bulk of its player base. I remember a few people i'd met in my previous time with the game who were absolutely livid since the NGE had pretty much made all their previous effort in the game utterly pointless.
Where would you place SWG?? :p


Funny part was that they thought that making the skills in the shape of a pie was brilliant!
(especially the pilot ones... New gear before a new ship? Why... Thats just stupid...)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
03-21-2010, 11:59 AM
What SOE did was a fail on so epic a scale, it should have effected all other MMO developers in ways so fundamental it should have re-vamped the entire approach these corporations take to relating to and interacting with the subscribers. Unfortunately, I believe it only reinforced the contempt they have for what they regard as a "finicky" group of grumpy basement dwelling trolls. The real problem is those basement dwellers are the base market, so ****ing us off doesn't really help.

As a basement dwelling troll, I take this personally.

I had years invested in this game. I was a shut in. I remember the first time a Jedi was rumored to be on our server, and stories of actually seeing a lightsaber battle were legends told in chat rooms and in the cantinas. People would comment "I know a guy who knows a guy who said he saw a battle! He said it was RAD!"

The struggle to become a Jedi itself made it so worthwhile when you finally got "glowy". You felt a visceral connection to your character and to your world. You felt like you earned it. Yeah, it was grindy and took true grit to get there, and a little whipper snapper with ADD is NOT going to get it. But if you had the gravel in the guts to grind grind grind (read that for some as macro macro macro...) you could get there.

What NGE and CU did was tell the gamers SOE did not care about all that work. See, it wasn't about what the experience in game was - for me anyway - it was about the time and effort all of us had already invested in our characters and communities we had built. It was about late nights stalking around the furthest reaches of remote planets looking for mobs, or trying and failing over and over and over and finally completing the Aurillia quests.

SOE invalidated all of it, and told us it didn't matter, and moreover that they did not give a s**t. They did not care about keeping the current subscribers, they wanted new ones. The way they saw it, there weren't more people subscribing because the game was just too hard. What a sign of the times, huh? Kids don't want to work for it, or have meaning or depth to the game- just give it to me and give it to me NOW. It was pitiful.

As has been previously stated, a game that could have been great was murdered on the altar of corporate greed. SWG was sacrificed because people in suits who don't game control the market. In the end it is ultimately about money, it always has and always will. I don't put so much of myself into MMO's these days, I don't commit myself like I did to SWG. With the death of SWG, a part of my youth died too. I don't think that is melodramatic, either. I think it killed a lot of people's illusions about what we do for fun. It is virtual, and it's make believe, and no one cares about us like you and me and the people who actually play. We are the only ones who care. SOE doesn't care. Blizzard doesn't care. Cryptic doesn't either. They want money, and that's it. Plain and simple we are a means by which to make cash. Don't ever let yourself think differently.

So, is this better? Worse? It's a game. SWG was a game. It will last until they stop making money. It's a place to waste time and it's better than television. SWG is dead. This isn't. It's fun right now, so let's just enjoy it before the good idea fairy fraks it all up.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
03-21-2010, 01:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Balti View Post
SWG is dead.
Believe it or not, it isnt. They recently launched their official facebook page, and they have 6,500 friends. Considering the fact that most people who play an MMO dont even post on its forums(let alone join its facebook page), I think its safe to assume that number is only a fraction of its total playerbase.

In fact, if that number were only 1/5 of the total players, that means there are sitll 30k people playing, and 30k x 15 = $450k a month. In fact, its entirely possible that that 6,500 number could be closer to 1/10 of its overall players, meaning there are still 60k people playing, generating $900k a month.

By comparison, STO has 40k friends on its facebook, so if we were going with the 1/5 of playerbase logic, that would put STO's playerbase at around 200k. If the 1/10 logic, then 400k.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
03-21-2010, 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RemoWilliams
SWG when it first released was a masterpiece, if it stayed it's course it would be as much of a hit as WoW is today.

Becoming a jedi was a long and tedious process. It could take months to complete the trials to become a jedi.

Then, they release NGE and CU updates. Which dumbed down the game by a huge amount. It merged their great diverse class system (Which had unlimited possibilities) into 9 default classes. They also tried to implement a FPS aspect into the game with CU, that had no place. Some will argue that it's fine now, yet those are the same people who never played pre-NGE/CU and they are idiots.

Basically, SWG when it first released was a shining beacon of MMO gaming. It was by far the best MMO game I have ever played. When they patched it with NGE/CU, a MASSIVE amount of people left and the game died.

How does this game compare?

When SWG first release, it would emit a shadow over this game that STO could never get out of. STO doesn't compare one bit to SWG.

Post NGE/CU? STO wins that battle...
I wasn't around in SWG for Pre NGE/CU and because of that I was able to enjoy SWG. Ignorance is Bliss. Does that make me an idiot Remo? It is quite possible those players had they joined SWG prior to NGE or CU would have left as well. Given I joined after the updates and had nothing to compare it to I found it quite enjoyable. Perhaps your sour grapes comes from knowing there are players who could enjoy a game so ruined for you that the mere mention of its name conjures flames?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
03-21-2010, 02:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by RemoWilliams
SWG when it first released was a masterpiece, if it stayed it's course it would be as much of a hit as WoW is today.

Becoming a jedi was a long and tedious process. It could take months to complete the trials to become a jedi.

Then, they release NGE and CU updates. Which dumbed down the game by a huge amount. It merged their great diverse class system (Which had unlimited possibilities) into 9 default classes. They also tried to implement a FPS aspect into the game with CU, that had no place. Some will argue that it's fine now, yet those are the same people who never played pre-NGE/CU and they are idiots.

Basically, SWG when it first released was a shining beacon of MMO gaming. It was by far the best MMO game I have ever played. When they patched it with NGE/CU, a MASSIVE amount of people left and the game died.

How does this game compare?

When SWG first release, it would emit a shadow over this game that STO could never get out of. STO doesn't compare one bit to SWG.

Post NGE/CU? STO wins that battle...
Lol so agree w/ this although I'm not a 6 yr vet, beeing a 1 yr vet and having friends who've played SWG from start have told me how great it used to be before NGE, you this the Atari Sale was bad, think about how people who worked long non-stop gamings hours to max out a jedi character only to have the Jedi class simplified to a huge extent and get a maxed character in a month if even. That's where SWG lost a s%^&-load of people and still suffers a bit even today. Oh course the graphics in SWG have improved (nothing close to STO's advanced graphics). People who have been inactive for a year or so on SWG usually come back for a day or two on SWG and realize the game totally changed for the worse for them and they leave for good-this has become a typical thing in SWG. Better prediction that SWG goes before STO lol, with TOR's release, SWG will get another hard hit.

Even now I'm getting more and more bored on SWG and come to STO instead SAme crap on my main server on SWG, exploiting imps come to PvP zones and kill PvP for a day or two and with the currupt GM's there, all this is allowed. Although PvP on STO here lacks, it's at least more fair gameplay than SWG lol.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
03-21-2010, 02:06 PM
I have played SWG from its launch and liek others before me stated, it was an MMO masterpiece. There was so much going for it, that again it would be as large as WoW is now. Unfortunatly, as with this game, too many people began QQing about this and that, that ultimately SoE decided it would be better to make it what it is now. STO has the same potential that SWG had pre-CU/NGE, all Cryptic has to do is stay they course, stop listening to QQers and make the game the way a Star Trek should be.

As to the OP question:

SWG-pre>STO
STO>SWG-NGE
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
03-21-2010, 02:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Balti View Post

[snip]

As has been previously stated, a game that could have been great was murdered on the altar of corporate greed. SWG was sacrificed because people in suits who don't game control the market. In the end it is ultimately about money, it always has and always will. I don't put so much of myself into MMO's these days, I don't commit myself like I did to SWG. With the death of SWG, a part of my youth died too. I don't think that is melodramatic, either. I think it killed a lot of people's illusions about what we do for fun. It is virtual, and it's make believe, and no one cares about us like you and me and the people who actually play. We are the only ones who care. SOE doesn't care. Blizzard doesn't care. Cryptic doesn't either. They want money, and that's it. Plain and simple we are a means by which to make cash. Don't ever let yourself think differently.

So, is this better? Worse? It's a game. SWG was a game. It will last until they stop making money. It's a place to waste time and it's better than television. SWG is dead. This isn't. It's fun right now, so let's just enjoy it before the good idea fairy fraks it all up.


Holy crap that's deep lol. Tip of the hat to ya
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
03-21-2010, 04:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The.Grand.Nagus View Post
Believe it or not, it isnt. They recently launched their official facebook page, and they have 6,500 friends. Considering the fact that most people who play an MMO dont even post on its forums(let alone join its facebook page), I think its safe to assume that number is only a fraction of its total playerbase.

In fact, if that number were only 1/5 of the total players, that means there are sitll 30k people playing, and 30k x 15 = $450k a month. In fact, its entirely possible that that 6,500 number could be closer to 1/10 of its overall players, meaning there are still 60k people playing, generating $900k a month.

By comparison, STO has 40k friends on its facebook, so if we were going with the 1/5 of playerbase logic, that would put STO's playerbase at around 200k. If the 1/10 logic, then 400k.
Not arguing with you on that, they still make money. But the SWG a lot of people initially joined into and devoted a LOT of time to- the one that could have been even more- it's gone. The SWG available now, it just is not the same game. The one I played, and still would, it's dead as yesterday.

It just makes me sad, you know? A lot of people won't ever get to see how great that game was! Eh.. but yeah, they still make money... but not off many of the same people who were the plank owners.

edit- man, "plank owners" like I'm all O.G. or something. I don't mean it to sound snooty. Just "old grognards" would be better there.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
03-21-2010, 04:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xenor-Nyiad View Post
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Holy crap that's deep lol. Tip of the hat to ya
Stone cold sober too! :p
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