Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
04-22-2010, 02:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolphoenix
I got a couple of ideas. First I notice I can start firing almost as soon as I hit the decloak button. shouldn't there be a delay in transfering power to weapons, at least until the ship is completely decloaked?
Nope, doesn't seem to be canon.

Quote:
Cloaks are suppose to use a tremendous amount of power, yet I can come out of cloak with weapons already fully charged. Perhaps only allow weapons to charge 60-70 percent of max while cloaked.
That's why your shields are down.

Quote:
Klinks can nuke a fed ship, they decloak and hit one shield together. Hgw about allowing fed ships to do something like a double shield? Example - shield double front, at a cost of say half of other three shields?
I think the real solution is to just to reduce burst damage. . Enough that whatever counter-measures you have can be activated or your friends can help you, enough that the extra shields and hull points the Federation ships have can actually make a difference.
If you don't have counter-measures or friends for help - well, that's too bad, you better load up counter-measurse and make some friends.

I think "nerfing Cloak" itself is the wrong approach. Reigning in damage outputs would help the game a lot more, and cloak _has_ to be a worthy advantage to have. Worthy enough to actually create different tactic for factions with cloaks then those without, and how they deal with each other.

For the most part, it actually does that already. The "Fedball" is a reaction to cloak, it seems. (That said, the Fedball seems to be generally beneficial - of course staying close together is a benefit if you have limited range heals!)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
04-22-2010, 05:59 AM
sheesh, another "imbalance" topic
at the moment there is a attempt to balance out insane damage spikes caused by stacking consoles/abilities increasing dmg without a DR. On the other hand resistances won't stack like this (there is a DR)...thats it.
A cloak is a cloak, it doesn't really cause any damage to federation ships. And it is making things more interesting (paranoia etc. ) FvK is a different approach compared with FvK. Thats it.
I think talking about "imbalance" is very difficult, because everyone may think of his "own balance" somehow.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
04-22-2010, 06:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizhel
You dont get what i mean. --You have to sacrifice One thing for something else ,you wont get the Damageoutput of an Escort +Heal of a Cruiser/+CC of a Science.

You want to do Damage? Then you will have to use the Com Slot for Tactical BO and for sustained damage like an escort chaining Attack patterns you will have to use the Lt Com Slot for Tactical too. Leaves you with 2 Lt Slots left for anything else.

You want to really use CC science abilities then you will have to use at least the Com Slot for Science (2x VM or maybe 1 VM and some Tyrkens Rift or FBP). In doing so you will sacrifice your damageoutput far below that of an escort. You gain in exchange some more survivability because of the CC so youre some kind of science escort. Kind of jack of all trades but not really good at anything. You also can make it a full science which in return takes away any real damageoutput except for FBP as Guns on its own without some kind of Damagebuff dont do that much damage.
you could not be more wrong, i dps just fine, i have good survival, if i wanted to add some cc i could do so with only a minor loss of survivability and no loss of damage. and while i mihgt be able to add more sustained damage by using more stations for tac i really dont see the need, infact as far as i am concerned to many tac stations is a disadvantage
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
04-22-2010, 08:05 AM
having a key bound to rps and wait for it....
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
04-22-2010, 01:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolphoenix
ok both sides have access to the same weapons, skills, and I imagine the basic ship stats are similar if not the same. However, the klink side does have something the fed side doesn't.
Hi newbie, bad analysis.

Klingons have 4 ship choices at BG5, Feds have access to 6 choices at RA5. Half of the Klingon ship choices have 1 fewer bridge officer than all 6 Fed choices.

Access to the same equipment is somewhat disingenuous, but you might be too new to understand. Until Season 1 Klingons had enormously limited access to equipment - even the PvP venders were broken for MK X gear. Feds have long had a variety of options for access to better equipment, and still do today.

The basic ship stats are not the same, perhaps you need to take a closer look. Federation Cruisers have 39,000 hull, Science ships have 27,000, and Escorts have 30,000. A Bird of Prey has 24,000, a Raptor has 27,000, a Klingon Cruiser has 36,000, and a Carrier has only 28,000 hull - 2000 less than a Fed Escort!

The Carrier is the Klingon Science ship, but has a turn rate of 4. The powerful science abilities are forward facing, meaning it is not easy to use them with a Carrier. Where were you when Feds were crying about the Galaxy class only having a turn rate of 5? Big Fed ships were upgraded in turn rate - but not the Carrier - which still stays at 4. The Carrier depends on NPC fighters/siphons etc.. which will operate at "normal" difficulty after the patch. Hmm..

Fed Escort Captains have the choice of an extra Engineer OR extra Science bridge officer. Fed Cruiser Captains have a choice of an extra Tactical or Science bridge officer. Note that means both Cruisers and Escorts have the choice of an extra Science bridge officer - and tier 1 science bridge officer skills are the best in the game. Klingon Cruisers have no choices, and are required to have a 3rd Engineer bridge officer - while Raptors have no choices either and are required to have an extra Tactical Officer. Too bad for Carriers and BoPs - they only get 4 Bridge officers which is, as noted earlier, one fewer than EVERY Fed RA ship.

There are ZERO options for an Ensign science bridge officer at BG level for Klingon ships, even though Hazard Emitters, Science Team, Polarize Hull, Jam Sensors, Mask Energy Signature, and Tractor Beam are all viable Tier 1 Science skills available to Feds - not Klingons.

If you think all things are the same, then you aren't paying attention. It is clear as day there are a number of specific details that make each ship type unique.

The variety of options on both sides are good for balance, not bad for balance. Explore the variety with more depth and you will find things are about right. The only places in STO where balance doesn't exist is where the options are limited - like countering certain very powerful abilities. As more options for countering very powerful abilities are made available, these powers will be more balanced.

I personally don't think cloak is overpowered, but I also hate the nerf the DEVs made to stealth for Tactical in ground PvP - and I don't even play a Tactical character. It isn't overpowered if there is a reasonable defense, and right now (at least for me in my Star Cruiser) I feel like I have reasonable defensive/offensive options against cloak that can make it painful for the cloaked guy (you really need to read up on options for detecting a cloaked ship if it is that much of a priority).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
04-22-2010, 02:02 PM
while both sides have good and bad points
stealth vs hull
universal BO spots VS +1 assigned BO spot
the feds do have one thing the klingons do not have
D.O.B.


Teamwork > all other factors
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
04-22-2010, 04:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ardept View Post
you could not be more wrong, i dps just fine, i have good survival, if i wanted to add some cc i could do so with only a minor loss of survivability and no loss of damage. and while i mihgt be able to add more sustained damage by using more stations for tac i really dont see the need, infact as far as i am concerned to many tac stations is a disadvantage
Well when i see you out there you are using your tac officer so true you got the advantage of your self buffs from beeing a tac guy

You got the ~20-25sec burstdamage and thats all but once that is expired your dps drops until the CD is back up. So as long as the fights are as short as they are at the moment and burst is all that counts Tac officers in BoP have an advantage over the others. As for me ,im Science ,my BoP wont do that much damage without the second Tac BO also i wont do that much burst as you do.

So ,i might be partly wrong regarding beeing a Tac Officer in a BoP but put in an engineer or a science and the dps isnt as high as it is with your Tac.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
04-22-2010, 04:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Arizhel
Well when i see you out there you are using your tac officer so true you got the advantage of your self buffs from beeing a tac guy

You got the ~20-25sec burstdamage and thats all but once that is expired your dps drops until the CD is back up. So as long as the fights are as short as they are at the moment and burst is all that counts Tac officers in BoP have an advantage over the others. As for me ,im Science ,my BoP wont do that much damage without the second Tac BO also i wont do that much burst as you do.

So ,i might be partly wrong regarding beeing a Tac Officer in a BoP but put in an engineer or a science and the dps isnt as high as it is with your Tac.
not really used my sci since before the patch changes so is difficult to say how it would compare now, however i hit 1mil damage on my sci long before i hit 1 mil on the tac tho that is not a lot now, i found that the loss of apa and fomm (which were both lower values then) was more than made up for by a 75% debuff and preventing the target from shooting back. whether i could match my damage now as a sci i dont know for sure, would have to get used to the class again, but before it was a lot higher and oddly quite fast as i never had to contend with rsp or heals etc but also crf was bugged and hit harder. might dust it off at some point and see.

However you were on about the ship, not the captain, and uni slots are worth a lot however you stack it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
04-23-2010, 10:00 AM
Cloak is fine... Let the klinks keep their alpha strike ability. I have other things to worry about, such as my tricobalt mine chasing cloaked ships!

Tricobalt Mine : OH HAI!
Me : Go Tricobalt! GO!
Cloaked Klingon Ship : OH SHI- *POP!*

Hilarity ensues.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
04-24-2010, 09:02 AM
Bottom Line:

Klink BoPs are:

Faster and more maneuverable than Fed Escorts,

Have universal BO slots,

Have a real Hull and Shields,

Appear to be able to mount 35 cannon at once,

Have VM and SNB AND RSP!

Battlecloak.

FIX:

Give all fed Escorts tier equivalent BoP stats!

Maybe even a cloak. Battlecloak?

Of course then no Klings will play because they can't cheat then.

Maybe Cryptic can offer them badges to play with the Feds...
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