Captain
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,520
The excel is an excellent ship for a reason. It's a battleship, built by Starfleet to be its first ship designed for war. That meant the design has to be simple, it has to be effective, capable of holding its own in border wars and easy to build.

It's been updated a few times over the decades to bring it in line with technologies.

The Defiant was built along the same idea, but smaller, cheaper and faster.

That's why those two ships are excellent for tactical-oriented situations.

So, if you'd look at canon and the manuals, you'd understand why those two ships are solid.

The Defiant is a hunter-killer, designed to kill Borg but turned out to be effective against the Dominion.
The Excel is a capital ship designed to kill other capital ships, more specifically Romulan and Klingon.

There's no compromise, they're meant to be battle-oriented.

Now if you take the Galaxy, the Sovereign or other Federation ships, you'd see that they compromise abilities to do other things. They're multimission explorers. While the Galaxy was considered a heavy cruiser, it was not easy to build. It was expensive and had its weaknesses. However it could handle prolonged engagements away from the Federation. The Excel cannot. It has to kill its target quickly and stay close to supply lines. Same as the Defiant. The Sovereign is an upgraded version of the Galaxy but more meant for deep space patrols. It's more of a battleship than an explorer.

So say I was an Admiral and had to decide what I wanted to have my fleet comprised of, I'd decide on several things. Say I was an admiral assigned to a border where I had just one starbase that was well supplied but the border was tense and tend to have a few shooting matches, I'd deploy my fleet as thus

Sovereigns to the border colonies, commanding a squadron comprising of a Sovereign as the flagship and a few Defiants to serve as escorts. I'd have a science ship such as an Intrepid or a Nebula plus a supply ship for the Defiants. They'd explore, monitor the border and engage anything that crosses. Regular supply runs to keep the Defiants well armed and rotate its crew.

Galaxies on their own, doing deep space exploration and patrols. To show the flag.

Closer to the starbase and the larger colonies, I'd have Excel cruisers and Defiants plus whatever else ships I can get. I'd deploy the Excels on regular duties and use their speed to get to the outlying colonies quickly if my Sovereigns are facing problems.

In naval concepts, I'm treating Sovereigns as carrier groups, Galaxies as nuclear submarines and Excel as battle groups.

Carriers are capable of inflicting great damage, but they're meant to hit and run or oversee invasions. They're not meant to do prolonged engagements. Nuclear submarines are sent for long patrols, on their own but have the ability to inflict a great deal of pain and suffering if necessary. The Russian flagship once was a submarine. Battlegroups are ships that are powerful, meant to fight all-out wars. The admiral of a carrier group thinks in a protective method. That admiral also is able to oversee relief efforts, host high ranking government officials and deal with a host of issues. The admiral of a submarine (or captain) is trained in three things; to explore, to keep the crew from getting bored and to asset any targets that they come along. Battle group admirals don't care. You're a threat, you're blown out of the water. Moving on.

That's why Excels are a solid ship if you're shooting targets up. Its job is to get in, engage the target, rip it to shreds and return to base. There isn't much compromise in it. It's cheap, quick and cheap to build; makes for great deployment to protect high value targets.

If I had to select my ship to command, for headed to the front lines, I'd take command of a Sovereign. It's large, well armed and impressive to look at. It's more stately, and more advanced but I'd take a few Excels as escorts to protect my ship while I oversaw the battle.

tl'dr; Excels are great ships to have around, but I wouldnt keep my flag on them.
Delta Rising will cause the graphic errors that will cause your game to crash if you're a member of the Leper fleet. If you remember your game crashing to desktop whenever a season or expansion was released, well it's going to happen again. Check out the tribble bug reports and comment there.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,825
# 2
08-14-2014, 05:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deaftravis05 View Post
The excel is an excellent ship for a reason. It's a battleship, built by Starfleet to be its first ship designed for war. That meant the design has to be simple, it has to be effective, capable of holding its own in border wars and easy to build.
What are you talking about?

About the other things, please don't mix real naval concepts with Star Trek ships, it never ends well and is totally flawed too.

I simply assume you where not trying to troll or mock ppl with this, i suggest to get informed about things first before posting stuff like that.



No offense meant.

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T6 Guardian Class design / A 25th century Ambassador refit
Captain
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,520
# 3
08-14-2014, 05:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by yreodred View Post
What are you talking about?

About the other things, please don't mix real naval concepts with Star Trek ships, it never ends well and is totally flawed too.

I simply assume you where not trying to troll or mock ppl with this, i suggest to get informed about things first before posting stuff like that.



No offense meant.
1. Star trek is mixed with naval concepts
2. I used naval concepts as an analogy in terms of fleet deployment, not how they fight.
3. It was designed and built while the Federation was at war. It's a warship. The Defiant was built purely just for war. The Federation had meant to deploy the excel as an explorer when peace came. The Defiant has no intention of not being used for war.
4. Yes the Excel was built as a testbed for transwarp. That's the prototype, not the design widely used.
5. Nice try.
Delta Rising will cause the graphic errors that will cause your game to crash if you're a member of the Leper fleet. If you remember your game crashing to desktop whenever a season or expansion was released, well it's going to happen again. Check out the tribble bug reports and comment there.
Career Officer
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,892
# 4
08-14-2014, 05:45 AM
This thread belongs in Ten Forward.
-32nd Vipers- PvP Team

We'll settle this the old Navy way. First guy to die Loses!
Captain
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 515
# 5
08-14-2014, 05:53 AM
The concept of ship as we are all running star ships through virtual space aka holo-deck. I think of my Risian Luxury Cruiser as Battle-Ship (aka F21 Destroyer / Arleigh Burke class destroyer)..
Time will only tell!
Captain
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,520
# 6
08-14-2014, 06:02 AM
you think of a ship with a big pool that floats in oceans as a battleship???
Delta Rising will cause the graphic errors that will cause your game to crash if you're a member of the Leper fleet. If you remember your game crashing to desktop whenever a season or expansion was released, well it's going to happen again. Check out the tribble bug reports and comment there.
Captain
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,825
# 7
08-14-2014, 06:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by edalgo View Post
This thread belongs in Ten Forward.
indeed

/10char

-> -> -> STO players unite and say NO to ARC <- <- <-
T6 Guardian Class design / A 25th century Ambassador refit
Captain
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 2,649
# 8
08-14-2014, 06:26 AM
The Excelsior is a battleship? Source please.
Kathryn S. Beringer - The Dawn Patrol

Solaris build - Veritatum Liquido Cernene
Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,116
# 9
08-14-2014, 06:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by deaftravis05 View Post
The excel is an excellent ship for a reason. It's a battleship, built by Starfleet to be its first ship designed for war. That meant the design has to be simple, it has to be effective, capable of holding its own in border wars and easy to build.

It's been updated a few times over the decades to bring it in line with technologies.

The Defiant was built along the same idea, but smaller, cheaper and faster.

That's why those two ships are excellent for tactical-oriented situations.

So, if you'd look at canon and the manuals, you'd understand why those two ships are solid.

The Defiant is a hunter-killer, designed to kill Borg but turned out to be effective against the Dominion.
The Excel is a capital ship designed to kill other capital ships, more specifically Romulan and Klingon.

There's no compromise, they're meant to be battle-oriented.

(...)
Literally nothing you wrote is supported by any canon or secondary (i.e. tech manuals) sources. Don't confuse STO with Trek canon. Which is ironic, because that's what this thread is supposed to be about.

The Defiant was designed to be a mobile defensive platform against Borg, probably used in squadrons akin to how BoP's operate, but never saw action against them because the design was flawed and only later saw action against the Dominon when it was meant to be an upgrade over runabouts for stationary defense (see DS9 manual).

The Excelsior was a big success, but it was a Starfleet Cruiser, not a battleship. It's officially classed as Explorer.

Once fully integrated into the fleet, the Excelsior's sister ships were used for a variety of mission profiles, ranging from deep space exploration and terraforming missions, to patrol duty, to courier and transport runs. (Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country; TNG: "Tin Man", "The Drumhead", "Brothers", "Allegiance"; DS9: "Homefront", "For the Uniform", etc.) - MA.
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Captain
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 1,415
# 10
08-14-2014, 07:57 AM
Excel is not a battleship. She is the successor to the Connie. She does everything the connie was designed to do, just with transwarp. When transwarp failed they put a more standard warpdrive she was easily a match for the ktinga and has a long reign as the flagship class before losing to Ambassador about 50 years later. Thus hundreds to maybe thousands have been built and it became a work horse for the fleet. Lakota did to the ship what the refit did to the Enterprise but even after that refit the Connie was retired 2 decades later. In universe DW was likely it's last major war since many were lost and were likely replaced by newer designs.
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