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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 41
05-20-2010, 10:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by superchum View Post
So what you're saying is you'd rather STO be a sci-fi version of Second Life?

I mean, I get that people like EVE and all. But sometimes a square peg isn't going to fit into a round hole.
Nope, Second Life was just an example of a sandbox game. I don't want STO to be anything like Second Life. However, I'd prefer to see no-boundaries exploration and fleet/player crafting of larger ships/bases like EVe.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 42
05-20-2010, 10:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconical
The issue is that Cryptic cannot afford content driven gaming. They've proven that, again and again. The forums here are full of people saying "there's nothing to do!" It's happening in STO like it happened in COH and CO. It's a fact that as a mid to small sized MMO maker, they simply cannot make the "big content" MMO...
QFT 10 char.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 43
05-20-2010, 10:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren_Kitlor
We all loved SWG but before SWG's NGE/CU, it was already dying and, yet, somehow based on one of the bestselling intellectual properties ever.
SWG still had a loyal user base of hundreds of thousands of players, which means that even when it was "dying" it was more successful than STO has ever been (or is ever likely to be, given its present course).

and SWG itself could have been vastly improved from where it was. They made a lot of mistakes with the way they handled space combat and jedi (neither was even in the game at launch) as well as being extremely inattentive to bugs. That SWG managed to top out around 500k users without space combat or jedi, with buggy game play and a relatively small budget I think shows what the potential is. That STO has (to my knowledge) never even sold 500k copies, despite having an equally impressive IP (and equally unimpressive budget), speaks volumes.

I'm not in any way saying, btw, that STO should become EVE or that it should become SWG. I'm saying that moving forward, the only way it's going to succeed is by retaining customers, and the only eay to retain customers without a huge budget for content, is to provide a fundamentally enjoyable experience that doesn't rely on hand crafted content to prop it up.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 44
05-20-2010, 10:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconical
No, because EVE doesn't have the budget that WOW has and has always had. What CCP got, that you don't, is that you have to work within the limitations of your budget and make the best game that *you* can, even if it's not the best/biggest/most successful game that any one could ever make.
Do you think WoW was born with the budget it has now? I playtested WoW to launch. Believe me, it didn't have a huge budget while being developed. Eve has gotten 300k fans in 7 years. That's a fine feat but WoW has gotten 11 million in 5 years. This is because more people prefer whats WoW has to offer then what Eve does.

Quote:
Nah, you're still not getting it.
I am getting it. You're just not liking the answer. People play to the style they prefer to play to. Eve's done well but it's not the preferred style of play within the industry. Believe me as I business man I completely understand that companies go with what works. There's a reason why MMOs emulate WoW rather then Eve: fans have a preference.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 45
05-20-2010, 10:23 AM
I think I'd rather agree they're trying too hard to be WoW with the Raidisodes and content grind. I've been secretly hoping they won't try to clone WoW's end game... because I don't play WoW... because I hate that style of end game......
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 46
05-20-2010, 10:25 AM
one small thing, this could never happen in sto for one reason and one reason alone

sto has the fishbowl syndrome and can't get much further away from the sandbox model that eve has.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 47
05-20-2010, 10:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic_One View Post
Do you think WoW was born with the budget it has now? I playtested WoW to launch. Believe me, it didn't have a huge budget while being developed.
It had a pretty big budget during development. Different economy, different times.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 48
05-20-2010, 10:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cipher_nemo View Post
Nope, Second Life was just an example of a sandbox game. I don't want STO to be anything like Second Life. However, I'd prefer to see no-boundaries exploration and fleet/player crafting of larger ships/bases like EVe.
The United Federation of Planets is probably the wrong intellectual property to try and force a player driven ECONOMY onto.

The Ferengi Alliance, maybe. But not the UFP.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 49
05-20-2010, 10:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic_One View Post
Do you think WoW was born with the budget it has now? I playtested WoW to launch. Believe me, it didn't have a huge budget while being developed.
Reports have WoW's pre launch cost at around 70-80 million dollars, which makes it the most expensive MMO (and I think all time most expensive video game of any kind) up until The Old Republic (which is rumored to have a budget around 150 milliion).

Quote:
Eve has gotten 300k fans in 7 years. That's a fine feat but WoW has gotten 11 million in 5 years. This is because more people prefer whats WoW has to offer then what Eve does.
This is like saying that Avatar has so many more viewers than The Hurt Locker because thats what people prefer. Maybe that IS what people prefer, but it's an irrelevent discussion if you don't have a billion dollars to spend on a movie.

I know that if I have a small budget to make a movie, then I better spend that small budget on a great story instead of massive special effects, unless I want my movie to be 5 minutes long.

Quote:
I am getting it. You're just not liking the answer. People play to the style they prefer to play to. Eve's done well but it's not the preferred style of play within the industry. Believe me as I business man I completely understand that companies go with what works. There's a reason why MMOs emulate WoW rather then Eve: fans have a preference.
You're still not addressing the actual discussion, only say "well I prefer " or "people prefer..." without even bothering to consider whether that preference even makes sense in the real world of small budgets.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 50
05-20-2010, 10:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iconical
. That SWG managed to top out around 500k users without space combat or jedi, with buggy game play and a relatively small budget I think shows what the potential is. That STO has (to my knowledge) never even sold 500k copies, despite having an equally impressive IP (and equally unimpressive budget), speaks volumes.
I agree with a good chunk of what you are saying, but I do have to call you out on this. do you have the proof on the number of Sub for SWG, and STO. if so please provide a link. ( you must always post proof to make your argument better, and definitely before stating it like it is a truth. )
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