Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
06-08-2010, 02:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurrican View Post
That is your opinion, but tell me what is your build for a support attacker cruiser? It use to be pretty simple and now not so much if you still want to use extend shields.

Also please explain why you think it is good now please.
Because shield resistances don't suffer diminishing returns, so stacking 50% resistances on paper is quite literally halfing damage. Throw a few TSS skills and suddenly that shield resistance just passed 100%, meaning that the shields take NO damage, and only bleedthrough hits the target. If that doesn't say "attack someone else" then not much else will.

Extend Shields pre 1.2 was one of the few shield heals strong enough to warrent bringing in the world of TSS spam, simply because if they DIDN'T tss the target it was nearly impossible to kill them. If the person received 2 different extends (of different levels so they stack) then the only way to actually kill that person was quite litterally to drain his shields or stun the extender. ES is also immune to SNB due to the channeled nature of the skill.

Combined with the fact that the heals of pre 1.2 had super powerful resistances/durations and rediculously long cooldowns, you had to change targets as much as possible to avoid those skills.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
06-08-2010, 02:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dekkameron View Post
Actually.. Extend shields the skill refers to literally extending your shields to cover the other person. If this skill was accurate then any damage the "healed" person would take would go directly onto your shields and leave the other person unscathed. A bit like a bodyguard throwing themselves in front of a bullt shouting "NOOOOoooooooo!"
Indeed, And itīs even worse. The extended shields should be weaker overall, that was even on the shows at some time, i think a ship does only extend its shields if the recipient had none anymore, which is also not represented in this ability.

As for the fun over fact explanation, why not simply chose names for skills that fit. lol. No one forces the cryptic designers to choose skill names that are illogical and than to state itīs fun.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
06-08-2010, 02:55 PM
Extend shields has become weaker but not worthless.

Try to see it another way.Everybody agrees that Rotate Shield Frequency is an awesome skill.If u compare the stats of Extend Shields 3 with RSF u will notice that its actually the same skill.

ES is like casting a RSF to an ally.So why do most people consider ES worthless and RSF awesome?Is it just because it was so strong (OP more likely) before and now it is more normal?

I dont believe that ES is awesome , but it is usefull , since u will usually use it along with an Engi Team , AUX to Sif or HE skill to reduce incoming damage as much as possible.

So i believe it is a normal skill now , which for me is a good thing about the future of this game.

As for the naming schemes of the skills , thats a whole different matter , they indeed need to get better in that.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
06-08-2010, 03:21 PM
I use ES2 and Transfer shield str 3 when someone is focused, if they pop EPtS so much the better. This can be handy if i am waiting on cooldowns from ATSI 3 or an HE 2 ET 2
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
06-08-2010, 06:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by faithborn
Because shield resistances don't suffer diminishing returns, so stacking 50% resistances on paper is quite literally halfing damage. Throw a few TSS skills and suddenly that shield resistance just passed 100%, meaning that the shields take NO damage, and only bleedthrough hits the target. If that doesn't say "attack someone else" then not much else will.

Extend Shields pre 1.2 was one of the few shield heals strong enough to warrent bringing in the world of TSS spam, simply because if they DIDN'T tss the target it was nearly impossible to kill them. If the person received 2 different extends (of different levels so they stack) then the only way to actually kill that person was quite litterally to drain his shields or stun the extender. ES is also immune to SNB due to the channeled nature of the skill.

Combined with the fact that the heals of pre 1.2 had super powerful resistances/durations and rediculously long cooldowns, you had to change targets as much as possible to avoid those skills.
Can you link me a dev post that says shields do not have diminishing returns? I have tried searching using forum search and google and nothing about shield having or not having diminishing returns pop up.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
06-08-2010, 07:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurrican View Post
Can you link me a dev post that says shields do not have diminishing returns? I have tried searching using forum search and google and nothing about shield having or not having diminishing returns pop up.
No, because Snix said it in game on the tribble server. If you wanna test it yourself though;

Quote:
Originally Posted by edgecase
The math in this case is simple: % damage reduction to shields is NOT multiplicative, and NOT subject to diminishing returns like all other forms of resistance in the game.

Rotate Shield Frequency (Eng Captain ability) = 48% shield damage reduction
Emergency Power to Shields II (any ship can get this) = 32% damage reduction
125 shield power (100 base + EPtS bonus) = 25% damage reduction

48 + 32 + 25 = 105.

That's right, invulnerable shields. It didn't even require a cruiser, just an Engineering captain.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
06-08-2010, 08:17 PM
Hmm does require a bit more work but thanks for the info faithborn, iI have to admit now that ES isnt worthless anymore. If they ever change shield resistance to have diminishing returns it will be though.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
06-11-2010, 12:03 AM
it needed to happen...extend shields was way over powered. it was the best support skill becauae of this.

now it seems to be more in line with what the actual feature was in canon. gj devs.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
06-11-2010, 06:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hurrican View Post
2.1k shield heal per second for 30 seconds with 44% resistance down to 208 shield heal per second with 42% shield resistance is quite the nerf. Suffice it to say i will no longer be using this skill as we cannot even see what the soft cap for shield resistance is and even if we could it wont even at the full 42% its more likely to add 20% given the diminishing returns. Anyways gg on nerfing one of the best support abilities in the game I guess my cruiser will just have to stock up ion self heals nows.
I love how people who complain about their ship that was never intended to play the support role can't play the support role as well as it did before. Get a grip. Deal with the changes and modify your builds and/or strategy.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
06-13-2010, 02:48 PM
As a science ship captain, I can say Extend shields is uselss for me now, because Cryptic has forced me to run full AUX to be of any use now, and since Extend Shields is based off of Shield Strength, it's effects are so minuscule if used, I'm opted to use other skills.

Before 1.2 the Skill was great, now I don't see why anyone would waste a slot on this skill.
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