Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
06-05-2010, 04:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fallout-Heretic View Post
Dude,...weve fought numerous times...you are not the end all and be all of escort dps...you were a liability in that game...it dosen't mean you don't do awesome dps but the point is even fully buffed ready for engagement any competent cruiser can nullify your attack...that's my point...why fly a escort that needs taking care of when you can fly a cruiser with 10-20% dps but doesn't need taking care of?
The escort got top heals and damage, while being focus fired to death by the other team, with 4 cruisers? That what I call fail on the cruisers part. Escorts are a integral part to the game now, despite all the moron PvPers saying they're a liability. Escorts STILL have damage above and beyond cruisers, IF they can stay in the game. A single escort fending for itself in a sea of cruisers. Apparently the other team knew how to heal. Pity you guys didn't.

EPIC CRUISER FAIL.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ramp4ge View Post
I don't know how limited it is when you get a 6-beam broadside Assault cruiser with EP2W III and Beam Overload. That's a whole lot of burst. And isn't limited to 45*.

And now that EPS consoles don't fill up everyone's engineering console slots, I've seen some maneuverable cruisers..
You actually use EPtW 3? I can't think of a bigger waste of BO space.

And Maneuverable cruisers is an oxymoron.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
06-05-2010, 05:20 PM
cheers Xigent. I pvp with this guy regularly and Xigent is top notch escort player. If he says he wasn't getting heals you can believe it
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
06-05-2010, 05:23 PM
Now..I am just reading the original posting here. I think that most who side up with me, know that I tend to throw heals at escorts quite often. Personal opinion, the new patch means - cruisers and escorts NEEDS to work together. Whoever does that - wins. Cruisers need the escort to provide the dps, escorts need the cruisers to stay in the fight long enough for the cumulative dps to add up.


Now - I ever get an escort calling me a ****** *FOR ANY REASON* - including them feeling I am not healing them enough -- will not get jack-squat-sh*t from me. He will be lucky if I don't get sensor jammed, end up targeting the escort and will just keep firing.

Should I get a friendly request from an escort type - "Hey...can you heal me up a bit more" or "Can we duo up ?" or anything like that -- guess what -- heal city. They will get everything I got.

So - to the escort in question - if you called your teammates '*******' - even if they really were not helping you out - then you don't deserve crap. If you didn't do this, fine.....but if you did, then you reaped your rewards.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
06-05-2010, 05:25 PM
This post has been edited to remove content which violates the Cryptic Studios Forum Usage Guidelines ~Stormshade
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
06-05-2010, 05:43 PM
I hardly respond to any threads in the forums, but felt I needed to say soething here.

I am an escort/tac player. In my battles my team is my supports. I do top knotch dps, as my team keeps me alive. My healers keep me alive in almost all circumstances, which in turn keeps my aft alive. I would never change to any other type of vessel. An escort does require a "mass" of heals. However, the faster you take another vessel down, the less heals you need. So, I would focus more on your build, and how to make more "pew-pew" power and leave the heals to your team.

Remember one thing, there is no "I" in team. So, a well molded and equipped team will survive the best. Perhaps find a group to pvp with constantly, that way you learn one another's moves.

My healers do their job, and I do mine.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
06-05-2010, 06:45 PM
OP,

I am a healing cruiser pilot as my main. I've fought with Xigent in multiple matches, both on his team and against him. While I'm not the best healing cruiser in the game (I think Faithborn holds that title), there are multiple experienced PvPers out there that have fought with me who will tell you I do have some inkling as to what I'm doing when I fly a healbot cruiser. I also have an interesting perspective in that I play quite a bit with my Klingon tac/BoP (both pre and post patch) and I tend to be pretty successful with him as well.

A few points:

1. Xigent is, on a bad day, a good escort pilot. He is capable of putting out a lot of damage (which is his primary job as an escort) and he is also more than capable of putting out a lot of healing...something most escorts never even think about.

2. Xigent knows how to fly with a healing cruiser. Despite the fact that I haven't PvPed on his side too often, in my experience he knows EXACTLY what he needs to do in order to both apply maximum damage to a target and remain in a position where teammates can cover him with heals. And my experience with him was before the patch, when a good number of my heals were 5km range (extend shields and HE) as opposed to the post-patch nerf of extend and the increased range of HE and Aux to SIF.

3. With very few exceptions, if an escort outheals a cruiser, the cruiser has failed...miserably.

4. I know a PuG does not necessarily have the best tools available to it to foster teamwork, but that doesn't mean the PuG can't fight as a team. Xigent (and dare I say, all DOB members I've run into in a PuG) know this. They know that with no voice comms they have to be careful about remaining in a position that allows the healing that a support cruiser or sci can provide. At the same time, they know that when using voice comms if they have to branch out a little bit, they can.

5. Escort without support, thy name is Target.

6. Escort with support, thy name is Mars, God of War. This is true even post patch.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
06-05-2010, 07:24 PM
I have been in a few PvPs myself. I only fly Escorts. Rare is the time I regret that choice. It is a matter of the team and how they gel together. Do I get dropped? Sure.... but I do know that more times then not I can fly into that sure trap and flush out the game so the big and slow boys can get nice targets who focus on me or.... as I loop out of range have to retarget losing time then I normally come back in again. I see an escort as a dodge and waeve thing.... get hit fly out... let them target you because at best they get a shot or two off. Then you are out of range and they have to focus on the others attacking them... Then fly back in again.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
06-05-2010, 11:26 PM
Ugh...where to start...First off, Xi, in said 15 cracked you did not have most healing...you didn't even break 100k. All those defending the escort for outhealing a cruiser have been misinformed. I'm not arguing with the majority that an escort teamed with a healbot can still do great damage, I am arguing that in general if loaded and specced right a cruiser can do maybe -10 to -20% the dps of the escort. I've played numerous games where as a cruiser I have out dpsed the other escorts. That should not happen. (BTW cruisers can do burst if loaded right)

Regarding the cracked game, Player deaths in that particular scenario is very important. You win or lose based on player deaths. If other players can't get a heal off on that escort he dies which moves us closer to losing. That IS a liability when said player cannot survive on his own with out constant team heals.

Another poster had mentioned that all cruiser games are boring...that's my point. Why are you seeing all cruiser games??? 20 players all choosing the same type out of 3 choices, that really defies probabilities.
I guess i'll add some suggestions instead of just negativity, why not increase the speed of an escort so he can dive in and then escape, his increased speed lends itself to hit and run patterns. As it is, escorts can do that now (and should) but generally only when evasive is up. A general increase in his speed will up his longevity and allow him to escape more often, thus requiring less heals from his team. One of the biggest problems of healing an escort is the inability to stay within 5km of escort for an extend shield, so most of the healing is engy, sci team or hazard emitters which do nothing if he's focused.

I see alot of posters loving the escort still, and i'm happy for you guys, rock on. But I truly believe that over time most serious pvpers (unless always teamed) will end up shying away from escorts because the nerfs have really been fatal for escorts. Star Trek is about diversity, next time your in a pvp match count the escorts...If the nerfs have been fair then you should see a bunch of them. But i bet you wont. Anyway, please try to stay constructive, I'm not bashing Xi, i'm just trying to point out what i see as a flaw in the most recent patch.^^
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
06-05-2010, 11:51 PM
Hmm... I think you're missing the point of the escort healing. If the escort is even racing a cruiser on healing the cruiser is doing something terribly wrong. Escorts are primarily damage, cruisers are primarily defenses. Even if you build a cruiser for offense you're not going to do nearly as much damage as an escort if you both live. Additionally, you've said that you have beaten escorts on dps. That simply isn't possible unless the escort pilot was horrible, the escort pilot spent the match flying back to combat, or went afk.

To further the point of deaths actually mattering, if that escort had been properly supported then he would have caused significantly more damage to the opponents. Two dps cruisers cannot produce the same damage that an escort and support cruiser can. If your worried about deaths actually mattering, consider that a heal specced cruiser is going to stop slot more damage than two dps cruisers. Deaths don't matter until the 15th one. Whether you had 2 deaths or 13 deaths doesn't matter, the end result is the same. Deaths only determine how badly you beat the opponent.

Finally cruiser only matches are ****ing stupid. Neither team has the damage to kill the other team unless they all think they're captain Kirk
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
06-06-2010, 01:41 AM
I think the OP is missing one point. If there was no escort in his team, but crap healing cruisers, they would have lost. The least healing cruiser would have been targeted and vaporized. They probably only won, because the escort pilot did survive as much as he could, not because the cruisers were better.
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