Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
06-15-2010, 07:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
There is keybinding system in STO. I use it for defense and offense... here is a good forum posting on the subject.
http://forums.startrekonline.com/showthread.php?t=66110

If you run 2 Emergency to Shield powers you will always have a min 25% shield resist running... think about it 45 second cool down, 30 second resist... in fact you have overlap and higher resist for a short time. )
on top of the 10% you probably have so BTssS2 doesn't rip your shields completely off because you set your shield power to at least 41, that means all incoming damage is reduced by 35% before calculating shield damage, and therefore before calculating bleed through against hull resists. So if you're not running a resilient shield to automatically cut all bleed through in half, that means you're only taking 6.5% of the total damage done, to your hull, while your shields are up, and that 6.5% is probably also resisted by at least 30% if you're not a total noob, bringing it down to roughly 4% of the total damage done actually hitting the hull. Now, in a situation where the aggressor is using a burst skill that even through reduction can do enough damage to break a shield facing, any remaining damage beyond stripping the shields applies directly to hull, after being reduced by shield resists. So let's say someone is using two copies of BO3 (expensive as hell) first they have to sneak up and hit the first copy 19 seconds before firing. Then they sit around waiting for 15 seconds before using their other buffs, then they decloak and hit 2-3 MORE buffs, and then fire torps, then the beam overload that's been ticking away all that time, then another beam overload, then usually a ramming speed on top of it since even all of that is no longer enough to thump a cruiser before the damned things hit one of their several copies of RSP, heal to 100% hull in one second, and return fire from behind an impenetrable wall of engineering skills that never seems to end. Until this 1.2 patch, killing a target as fast as you possibly can and then moving on to the next one was the ONLY survivable way to play ANY klingon ship, including the cruiser.

Because of your exact complaint, which was fixed by 1.2, they cut the spike damage on beam overload by about 85%, which makes it nearly useless for escorts, but EXCELLENT for supplementing the extremely long term I-Can-Always-Kill-Anything-Because-I-Never-Die assault cruiser which doesn't even need 15% as much damage output as an escort to have the the same value on a team. A cruiser can just stop shooting while everyone else is shooting, heal them until their heals all run out, and then when everyone else pops they can take over, switch power to weapons, and finish the damn fight alone.

If that's your idea of fun, maybe I could interest you in a nice solo console game like Command and Conquer or Max Pain, both of which are about playing god and slaughtering everything in sight. In a game with balance, however, you are NOT SUPPOSED TO LIVE FOREVER AND ALWAYS KILL EVERYONE YOU MEET.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
I hope it helps... a lot of players simply need to examine there setup. I have changed my setup 100s of times and I will continue to do just that.
Excellent advice. Adapt.

Stop looking for "the one best way" because we (in particular the names appearing on this forum who are discounting your experience and rejecting your claims, almost all participate regularly on tribble in testing events with the devs, and are the very people who discussed these changes with them at great length, and showed them why things were broken at sometimes personal expense of buying a respec just to make the point) made damned sure it doesn't exist anymore.

There are highly specialized extremes in dozens of different directions, which gives you VARIETY and DIVERSITY, you know, the slogans of the United Federation of Planets.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
Bottom line there are tons of options to put together a build that will survive an alpha strike.

I can pop a bad build in 3 seconds no doubt.... and I have run into guys that I could dual for 2 hours and still be stalemated. Piloting matters no doubt... but even a master needs the right tools to do great things.

(Another tip... I know a lot of dps dealers are using AOE powers like Scatter... consider keeping a scramble on hand, watching a swooping dps ship tear a hole in their own is worth it)
You're a lot more compassionate with these people than I am. I bore them to death with hours of technical jargon and in-depth explanations of the situational uses of a given set of specific powers, and techniques for using sets of 2-3 powers in "combo sets" and I have to tell you, I don't use ANY keybinds or macros and there is more than one fleet leader that has met me and my fleet on the battlefield who will tell you they're surprised by that fact. Because of the constant lag, I doubt it would matter if I did. 100Mb download speed and I get lag, who'd have imagined it. It's especially bad for three hours after the kids get out of school, maybe cellphone texting is clogging up the internets with 2 billion copies of "lulz" per minute.

Anyway, the general consensus for this guy to "just quit whining and learn to play the game" seems pretty valid to me, sorry to be so BLUNT, but I don't want to dull my axe trying to chop stones.

BTW, I'm not responding to what Husanak said, I'm supplementing it for when the OP reads this. I almost completely agree with Husanak, almost. I completely disagree with the OP and all his supporters. I have to tell you honestly here, I have only played by escort twice since the 1.2 patch because I'm just too busy doing 0 damage with my science build, god it's fun. (not sarcasm, I really did not expect science to work like it always should have, but it does now! OMG I LOVE SCIENCE!)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
06-15-2010, 07:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keldor
You're a lot more compassionate with these people than I am. I bore them to death with hours of technical jargon and in-depth explanations of the situational uses of a given set of specific powers, and techniques for using sets of 2-3 powers in "combo sets" and I have to tell you, I don't use ANY keybinds or macros and there is more than one fleet leader that has met me and my fleet on the battlefield who will tell you they're surprised by that fact. Because of the constant lag, I doubt it would matter if I did. 100Mb download speed and I get lag, who'd have imagined it. It's especially bad for three hours after the kids get out of school, maybe cellphone texting is clogging up the internets with 2 billion copies of "lulz" per minute.
I save the techno babble for my wife. lol
I know not on topic but ya, The lag is almost unbearable somedays. I mean I download at 2.6 megs a second and upload almost 1 and I get lag.... but I digress.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keldor
BTW, I'm not responding to what Husanak said, I'm supplementing it for when the OP reads this. I almost completely agree with Husanak, almost. I completely disagree with the OP and all his supporters. I have to tell you honestly here, I have only played by escort twice since the 1.2 patch because I'm just too busy doing 0 damage with my science build, god it's fun. (not sarcasm, I really did not expect science to work like it always should have, but it does now! OMG I LOVE SCIENCE!)
I agree I pulled out my fed sci that I hadn't played in over a month the other night... and had a BLAST. Too the op... try a sci ship... talk about controling the battle.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
06-15-2010, 10:33 PM
I do use key-binds...and I cant count on more than 2 skills activating properly at teh same time. if I have any weapons firing, or if I was just pressing the fire button, its possible I'll only get one to activate.

only if Im not doing anything else can I count on 3-4 skills activating...whats the odds that in a fire fight, I wont be doing anything else so i can maybe get the 3-4 skills to activate.

The poor UI still means I have to repeatly push the bound button for my combo'ed skills in order to get then to all activate...but will it be on time? My experience is no.

So the current binding system is still ineffcient, because it still requires that the skill activate simulataneously or nearly so, but as individual items...so they can conflict/interrupt each other. The answer is to remove the conflict, or allow for a single pre-queued actiavtion, but place them on stand-by. That way, the activation conflict is resloved ahead of time...just like the attack buff activation conflict being taken care off before actually firing them.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
06-16-2010, 12:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cocoa-jin View Post
I do use key-binds...and I cant count on more than 2 skills activating properly at teh same time. if I have any weapons firing, or if I was just pressing the fire button, its possible I'll only get one to activate.
I will agree the current bind system isn't perfedt. However it is easy to plan around the issue.

Here is my stupid power shield setup... On my bind tray I order the powers I want poping first... normaly I don't want them all at once and then be left with nothing after someone manages to live past my counter attack, or god forbid they subnuc me.
I order #1 EMPTS II... then #2 EMTS I (They won't go at the same time anyway just run the better one first)
# 3 Transfer Shield strength (If I start mashing my disribute shield button I can probaly use the extra resit)
# 4 Aux to SIf (why not its up every 15 seconds)

I know when I'm playing my fed escort I have a few less options for survival... my bop has so many shield heals its silly really.

A lot of PvP relies on reflex.. 1.2 has given everyone more reaction time. There are still a handful of players that work hard to make sure you have as little reaction time as possible. No matter how fast you are or how quick your Boff skills activate there are great attack stradagies that will take you down. Working in the current system it is very possible to out heal MOST attacks... not really all and I hope that never happens, balance dictates that sometimes your going to pop.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
06-16-2010, 11:14 AM
I have several defensive binds, under most situations they work fine...but against the massive Alpha Strike Burst form a Tac X III combo, these bindings arnt enough to counter it all.

I used to have a 4 skill bind that never activated more than two during a fire fight...freqently only one. To improve the activation of just two skills during the bind, i broke the 4 skills into two sperate two skill bindings. I then set the bind to activate each skill twice. So I have set to activate two skills as A, B, B, A. This improves the liklihood of both skills activating. The idea is if skill #1 actiavtes, but skill #2 is interrupted, skill #2 still gets another chance to activate, plus added security for skill #1.

But lets be honest, this type of ineffieceny is not going to counter a Tac III Alpha of 2-3 offensive specials.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
06-16-2010, 11:25 AM
Quote:
There is no one button answer to HYT, C:RF and/or BO ot TSS: Shields...but they can be delivered in one push of a button by the attacker.
Yes, there is. It's called RSP.

You can also use Jam Sensors defensively (as most Escorts no longer run Science Team). If you are an Engineer captain, you can use RSF + EP:Shields for virtual shield immunity. You can use Brace for Impact to survive the HY volley before your shields come back up.

Or you could just have an ally capable of healing the damage.

All I'm reading in this thread is how, in a magical 1v1 situation where you're not ready to be attacked, you got annihilated by an Escort. For every such situation, there are five where I attack a target and that target gets heals from himself or a teammate, pops RSP, or simply turns and runs away. All of those are effective ways to counter damage.

The bottom line is this: healing way outstrips damage right now. If you're dying to burst in a ship that is capable of loading powerful heals, like your Carrier, then the problem is one of the following:

1. Your BOff power choices suck
2. You were attacked by multiple people
3. Your powers happened to be on cooldown when you needed them
4. Your reaction time, equipment, or powers of observation suck.

Damage doesn't need nerfing. Learn to play better, please.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
06-16-2010, 08:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildfyre010 View Post
Yes, there is. It's called RSP.
RSP doesnt help when your shield arc is down...its a defense that need it to be up before the first volley drops your shield arc. Meaning you need to know its coming.

I was blind sided and only caught eye of the target just before the salvo hit. My shield arc was immeadiatly knocked down, RSP was useless until I could it up. I was down to nearly no hull by the time I got EMG PWR to Shields and then RSP up.

Yes, RSP is a counter, but we will always be prone to not being able to respond to the excessive Burst the TAC III combos can unleash...unless we can queue up the required defensive skills to activate them all at once also, just like attackers can do by queueing up BO III and/or C:RF III and HYT III...and then release them all at once at us.

Reading my posts, you'd see my skills werent on cool down, my Emg shields and then RSP were up just after 2nd salvo hit...not bad considering I didnt even realize I was getting hit with such a high burst until nearly 9k of shield arc dropped from the first salvo...if you do the math, you could tell me how slow my reaction time was.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
06-19-2010, 07:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cocoa-jin View Post
The game can barely handle the simultaneous use activation of two skills...so if Im hit and my shields drop, I activate Emg Shields to get a sliver of shield which immediatly drops to the next incoming shot of cannon and/or HYT III...Im down to near zero hull bfore RSP can even activate.

The actual amount of damage is tankable(mainly because of RSP), but the speed in which its inflicted is the issue...the game's interface is ill-equipped to allow the player to respond/re-act to the burst. If I had RSP already I'd have been fine, but the time required to recognize the loss of the shield arc, then to activate Emg Shield, and then RSP is longer than the time it takes to get the two salvos of Cannons/Beam Overload and HYT III to strike.

I have the required skills, I use them well...but 1.5 seconds is not enough time to pull off with the delayed, slow, or mis-activation of our specials. Even with multiple skills bound to a single button, we frequently have to push the button two or more times to get them all to activate.

So you can try to pawn the fault on me like I dont know the game...but when you get ambushed by a new-comer in the fight from your blind side, a 1.5 secs window to respond to multiple issues/failure is basically a death sentence.

Its not the lack of skills or the know how for using them thats the issue...its the constraints imposed on us in order to respond in time...the faulty UI and burst thats excessive enough to exceed the mechanics(mainly time and the ability to respond to multiple issues simulataneously) of defending against it.

basically, your suggestions were a waste of breath because you apparently dont see the real issue.
Nothing is fair in war!

Did you hear the Japanese comlain and whine when 300 planes descended on the Yamato? Did Admiral Nimitz say you know thats just not fair the Japanese sneak attacking us at Pearl Harbor like that.

Seriously though yes this is happening to myself as well i get frustrated a bit too but thats just it this is fleet skirmishing and people just get gang banged all the time. Unfortunately the interface at least for me makes it a little bit disorienting when you react to being fired upon at times. I'm pretty used to it now and I react pretty darned fast but still sometimes it's just not fast enough and I'm like damnit I hit the dang power I'm getting charged with having used it and I'm still dead. But thats just a fact of life. Answer this how many times have you been in a cruiser seen an escort coming in on you ahead of time and then just proceeded to crush him like a bug? At least thats what I do I grab him in a tractor throw RSP up dampening field then I activate EPW Tac1 and BO him and follow up with High yield. Or I'll SNB him even if I'm in arc, or I'll bust out photonic fleet on him whatever. Sometimes he still gets the kill even thats just the way it is. They can balance it till people are blue in the face and there's still not going to be everything nice and even steven.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
06-20-2010, 11:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Osiris301 View Post
Nothing is fair in war!

Did you hear the Japanese comlain and whine when 300 planes descended on the Yamato? Did Admiral Nimitz say you know thats just not fair the Japanese sneak attacking us at Pearl Harbor like that.

Seriously though yes this is happening to myself as well i get frustrated a bit too but thats just it this is fleet skirmishing and people just get gang banged all the time. Unfortunately the interface at least for me makes it a little bit disorienting when you react to being fired upon at times. I'm pretty used to it now and I react pretty darned fast but still sometimes it's just not fast enough and I'm like damnit I hit the dang power I'm getting charged with having used it and I'm still dead. But thats just a fact of life. Answer this how many times have you been in a cruiser seen an escort coming in on you ahead of time and then just proceeded to crush him like a bug? At least thats what I do I grab him in a tractor throw RSP up dampening field then I activate EPW Tac1 and BO him and follow up with High yield. Or I'll SNB him even if I'm in arc, or I'll bust out photonic fleet on him whatever. Sometimes he still gets the kill even thats just the way it is. They can balance it till people are blue in the face and there's still not going to be everything nice and even steven.
the crew of those ships didnt have thier hands tied by an UI that only let me them respond one at a time. The problem is the restrictions the game puts on our response...until that is resolved, the burst they put out should be adjusted.

We have the tools to off set the burst, but we dont have a UI or crew model to allow us to use them in the same way attackers can stack BO skills to hit us all at once. We are effectivly handi-capped by the UI/model. They basically handed the TAC side of the game a loop hole that insta-pops others because we cant respond to the threat.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
06-21-2010, 05:52 AM
I think they should make STO polictically correct and not have any competition, hurt feelings or basis of ranking one player above another. Nerf gaming I say, all this having to learn to play is hampering my ego and dammaging my personal measure of selfworth.
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