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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
06-30-2010, 01:18 PM
Let me preface this by saying that I like WoW; it is (and probably will be for the foreseeable future) my primary MMO.

When WoW came out in 2004, it did not have ANY endgame content. The raid zones were built over a period of years. And today, it does not have "tons" of endgame raids - at least not that people are actually doing. Most people are simply running ICC (either in regular or heroic, 10 or 25 man) over and over. There is no reason to run any of the earlier tier raiding content. Raiding in WoW has been dumbed down to the point where a newly minted level 80 can run daily random heroics for a couple of weeks and then jump right into the top tier (ICC) raids right away and skip all of the prior stuff (ToC, Ony, Naxx, etc.) They just introduced a new 1-boss raiding zone today, Ruby Sanctum. So now raiders will be running ICC and RS during their raid times.. over and over.

Even though I am a semi-hardcore raider in WoW, I hope that STO does not follow this model. I would like to see "some" amount of raiding content, but I truly believe that this game lends itself to many possible endgame activities - PvP, group storyline quests, and probably other things.

TL,DR: We obviously all want new content to be released consistently, but STO does not necessarily have to follow the WoW raiding model to be sucessful.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
06-30-2010, 01:47 PM
I'd support this topic if the raids already in the game weren't such annoying pieces of ****.

Though if pre-endgame STO had more meat to it, I wouldn't care at all.

I've taken 4 characters through the entirety of the content now, something I've never managed once on any other MMO I've played.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
06-30-2010, 01:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by castmodean View Post
Probably not, but I guess that also begs the question, which I am sure is in a dozen other posts that I don't feel like trying to read in order to find the consensus of:

What do YOU want as far as content goes, and why do you think it will better the game if this vision is used.
I kind of like the ideas being posed by the dev team. The weekly episodes, if done right, could really be a hook for me.

I'm all about diplomatic corps too.

I want something different ... something that builds off of what we have here ... something that at least tries to stick with a sci-fi genre, a star trek feel, and I generally want to steer clear of "Onyxia with phasers."

I think the current STF's are too ... much like past Cryptic content? Zerg-y. But I think this game is helping the company (albeit a bit slowly) move forward.

The Diplomacy thing will really be a good benchmark for their evolution.

That being said, I understand a lot of players not only expect Blackwing Lair as end-game, they enjoy it.

It's just ... I feel that the perspective needs to be maintained. Cryptic doesn't make those kinds of games. They never have. So it's kind of ... a dead end? Or a brick wall? Or at least a huge obstacle? To try and complain that this game doesn't live up to that standard. It wasn't supposed to, you know?

Anyways, I'm weird. I am writing a back story for all of my B'Tran missions. So I actually LIKE exploring the B'Tran.

/shrug
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
06-30-2010, 01:53 PM
EXACTLY! Thank you for reading and actually understanding what I'm trying to get at. WoW is successful on many levels and its not always bad to learn why. I was there in the WoW beta and played for 6 months and I never saw all the content even though others said there was a lack of it. I made a Death Knight when the expansion came out and regardless of whether or not you like wow there is content. Oh, there is content. There is so much content in that game that its ridiculous.

One example of something that BLEW MY MIND AWAY - yearly festival events that take days to complete. The only one I participated in was the Midwinter Festival - you had to go to EVERY ZONE and light a pyre if it were in your territory or if it were your enemies pyre you had to destroy it (or something). Each "area" of the game gave you an achievement (like an accolade) and if you did an entire continent that got you another achievement. If you did EVERY ZONE IN THE GAME that had a pyre you got another achievement (and let me tell you it was HARD with a level 70 character running through level 80 zones to get a pyre lit, but it was worth it!). And then there were mini-games, like throwing torches and catching them, which netted to an achievement. And then there was Midwinter Festival SPECIFIC items you could only get during the 2 weeks the event was happening, including a pet and a midwinter outfit.

That being said - where am I? In Star Trek Online. Why? Because I LOVE Trek and I think this MMORPG is amazing. But it needs a lot of work with added content, RAIDS and extra butter like what I mentioned above. Fluff stuff and fun stuff that even maxed out characters can achieve.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Presbytier View Post
I do not believe the OP is trying to force anything onto Cryptic the only thing he suggested is look at how one game did see if their is anything about it that they think would make STO better and implement it. I do not understand why every time somebody makes a comparison to WoW ( which is one of the most successful MMORPG of all time) people get all bent out of shape.

Now I agree I do not want to see STO become a WoW clone, but their are allot of things that Cryptic can learn from more successful MMORPGs. For the exception of City of Heroes Cryptic has not had a single successful MMORPG. STO is still in its early stage so I would not call it dead yet. I do see allot of potential to it, but if they want to retain players they are going to have to give us something to do when we reach endgame. I personally believe they need to look at more social content( since socializing is one of the primary reasons people play a MMORPG), and make the classes more distinct to enhance Role Playing and a reason for players to create new character.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
06-30-2010, 01:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aslan_chShran View Post
...You need to start releasing game content at a STEADY RATE. I know you guys read these threads and I hope I can get a reply on this. We need game content.
There, I fixed it for you, because really, that's all you had to say.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
06-30-2010, 02:00 PM
Yeah but when it comes to THAT, that's the players own fault for skipping the early stuff. As a roleplaying I like to do ALL storylines, it doesn't matter that I've got suped-up weapons. Plus, you get achievments for beating EACH end-game boss so even if its been 'dumbed down' people who care still go and do it to earn the achievement.

Personally I love STO's difficulty slider and I hope using it you can keep ALL end game content fresh and difficult, even as you get better gear. There IS a certain point that gear gets so much better you can destroy the opposition regardless otherwise.... what's the point of better gear?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ariel74 View Post
Let me preface this by saying that I like WoW; it is (and probably will be for the foreseeable future) my primary MMO.

When WoW came out in 2004, it did not have ANY endgame content. The raid zones were built over a period of years. And today, it does not have "tons" of endgame raids - at least not that people are actually doing. Most people are simply running ICC (either in regular or heroic, 10 or 25 man) over and over. There is no reason to run any of the earlier tier raiding content. Raiding in WoW has been dumbed down to the point where a newly minted level 80 can run daily random heroics for a couple of weeks and then jump right into the top tier (ICC) raids right away and skip all of the prior stuff (ToC, Ony, Naxx, etc.) They just introduced a new 1-boss raiding zone today, Ruby Sanctum. So now raiders will be running ICC and RS during their raid times.. over and over.

Even though I am a semi-hardcore raider in WoW, I hope that STO does not follow this model. I would like to see "some" amount of raiding content, but I truly believe that this game lends itself to many possible endgame activities - PvP, group storyline quests, and probably other things.

TL,DR: We obviously all want new content to be released consistently, but STO does not necessarily have to follow the WoW raiding model to be sucessful.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
06-30-2010, 02:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by superchum View Post
It's just ... I feel that the perspective needs to be maintained. Cryptic doesn't make those kinds of games. They never have. So it's kind of ... a dead end? Or a brick wall? Or at least a huge obstacle? To try and complain that this game doesn't live up to that standard. It wasn't supposed to, you know?

Anyways, I'm weird. I am writing a back story for all of my B'Tran missions. So I actually LIKE exploring the B'Tran.

/shrug
They have a TON TIER TITLE in their hands, whether they want to or not they have to work toward "making those kinds of games" if they want to keep the subscribers.

btw you're not weird I do the same thing with one of my captains and I LIKE exploring too.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
06-30-2010, 02:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Aslan_chShran View Post
People badmouth WOW, but at least WOW has TONS of end game content.
How old is WoW again? How old is STO? Common sense is fun
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
06-30-2010, 02:05 PM
Wow is 5 years old. STO is barely 6 months old.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
06-30-2010, 02:05 PM
There are two types of content, good and bad. If you want content then pick two.
Time
Price
Quality

Design something quickly and to a high standard, but then it will not be cheap.
Design something quickly and cheaply, but it will not be of high quality.
Design something with high quality and cheaply, but it will take a long time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Project_triangle
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