Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Not convinced
07-04-2010, 02:17 AM
I read allot of threads on pvp and weather it's unbalanced or if it's simply that star trek's elite is only playing on one side. I'm not saying im great at pvp and I'm sure allot of elitists are going to say that I'm just a bad player and have a crappy ship, or am unexperienced because feds have so much pve content but I have played dozens of pvp match's ending in federation 0 -1 against klingons 15 with damage and healing looking high on both sides, so whats the problem? Maybe the klings are right they have all the elite players and theres not a single decent fed player in the game, simply all the federation players suck; but that doesn't seem very convincing to me. I've seen allot of very good fed players out there that can deal out the damage or support there team as well as the next klingon the only difference is it seems our ships are out classed, fed ships seem all around worse with less turn rate and a lower impulse modifier, some people might think that doesn't make a difference but it does mean less weapons bearing on the enemy and less chance of escaping and in addition federation doesn't have cloak, no ships with universal officer slots and it's cruisers cant mount cannons the only exception being the Galaxy - X dreadnought which has out of combat cloak and can mount cannons but only has a base turn rate of 3 (degrees per second), thats even lower then the far larger klingon carrier.

So I ask the question, is pvp unbalanced because we are simply outclassed?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
07-04-2010, 02:23 AM
There have been federation versus klingon matches where it ended 15-0 in the federation's favor. What happens is that most of the klingon players have played through the game twice, when they make their klingon character they have already reached RA5 on their fed character. You are also forgetting that Klingon ships have less hull as well as useless slots ensign on half of their ships.

The difference in experience and coordination can be seen in fleets especially where welly coordinated fleets can destroy other fleets on the same empire 15 - 0 likewise.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
07-04-2010, 03:02 AM
First I would like to say thank you Miogaruna for your dignified reply and I understand that most klingon players have played through twice and have a wealth of experience but that doesn't mean that fed players don't have multiple RA 5 chars as well and are equally experienced, I do realize that fed ship do have more hull but it doesn't seem to make much of a difference in pvp as ships seem to go down in a few seconds of cannon fire regardless of class or amount of hull and personally i would gladly give up the extra hull for more maneuverability, and as for useless ensign slots that seems like a toss up to me as a ensign of any kind has limited uses and both sides end game are stuck with at least one slot on the ship being a ensign only rank, with the exception of the klingon carrier and the klingon bird of prey.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
07-04-2010, 09:09 AM
A lot of the time, the problem is the Science Officer and or Science Ships for Feds. Simply, they are doing their job, or there aren't enough of them. The Science Officer is the only officer that can reliably detect cloaked ships within 10km, and the science ship can to most abilities available for breaking cloak (tractor beam, Charged Particle Burst, Gravity Well and I think Tyken's Rift). Honestly, there are a lot more Science / Science officers who don't use these skills effectively than there are ones that do.

Pre 1.2, the Fed ball was the way for Feds to survive FvK PvP, but with Scatter volley the way it is now, it's a death sentence during the Alpha Strike. If you haven't been able to interrupt the alpha strike (detecting them and break their cloak), you pretty much need a plan to bug out and them come back around outside of the scatter arc. Remember that a well placed ram by a cruiser can 1-shot a Bird of Prey.

So no, I don't believe PvP is unbalanced at all from the point of view of game mechanics. The perceived imbalance comes from the difference in experience and teamwork between Klingon and Federation PvPers. If you like FvK PvP, and you feel like you're getting rolled all the time, try and find yourself a good Science player and make friends with them. Even better would be 2 science players; nothing like seeing an entire ball of enemies lose 9k shields on all facings and have their cloaked disabled for 15 seconds
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
07-04-2010, 09:41 AM
I'm biased because I only play Klingon...but I must say that most Klingon players are absolutely fantastic - Feds not so much. I certainly die to select Fed players but in general most Feds play carelessly and have no teamwork. Basically the way they play gives me the win. I'm not doing anything special but a lot of Feds are really not cut out for PvP. I can mention specific instances if you like, but trust me - Feds are reeeeeally easy to kill.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
07-04-2010, 11:10 AM
The problem is that Feds have a lot of kirks and janeways, and not so many picards and archers. You can't just run into PVP and only worry about yourself, sometimes you need to plan or run away when you are outmatched. Sometimes the tac/esort guys need to toss a heal on the eng/cruiser healer, you need to work as a team.

Klingons have this ingrained in their playing, BoPs hit and run, other classes use strategy and teamwork, a typical fed escort will sit in a group of five enemies thinking it can burn them all down solo, it's not going to happen.

I usually only play pre-mades, and so I'm not often steamrolled by klinks, I use a voice chat, call targets, my healers call heals and let us all know when we are on our own for heals due to CDs. Our sci guys call dampening fields and who they are SNB'ing, our eng guys put EPS on escorts, you need to know when to use abilities and who to give them to, and typically most fed players don't realize this, they horde abilities for themselves, and PUG healers very rarely toss out heals, even if they are teamed up with people in the PUG.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
07-04-2010, 11:36 AM
The key here is that the average Klingon PvPer is pretty good, while the average Fed PvPer is not. But the good Feds are really good. They make my bottom hurt when I fight them.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
07-04-2010, 11:51 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kinjiru View Post
The key here is that the average Klingon PvPer is pretty good, while the average Fed PvPer is not. But the good Feds are really good. They make my bottom hurt when I fight them.
^ This.

Ten characters.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
07-04-2010, 05:24 PM
The fed ships are not inferior at all. You can't rig one the same as a Klink ship, they are however very effective is used right. One key to klink victory is aggresion, I almost never play my fed anymore... all my friends are klinks.
I ran a couple matches the other day, we feds still lost. You will also notice how many times I died. (I say I was running with the hey get the trader handicap) Point is though VICTORY FAVORS THE BOLD. Fed pugs almost always lack aggresion. A good fed team will rip a klink to pieces... we all know the best fed players, they are nightmares to play against. (Granted most of them mainly play their klink toons)

http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/7...0070311565.jpg
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
07-04-2010, 07:36 PM
Fed dont cry , next time Criptyc sell you shiep and officer Klingo and maibe you PVP problems solve .
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