Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
I've always considered myself something of a passive trekkie, in that i don't really make any effort to watch any of the shows, if there is nothing better on i will watch, and i never downloaded, bought or attended any trekky things. However there have always been a few things that made me chuckle, particularly regarding the Klingons, and also some of the "Quantum mechanics" that the writers used to used to justify an otherwise crazy storyline.

I understand that there are probably thousands of hardcore trekkies that play this game and read these forums, and so i am risking invoking the wrath of the volcano gods in posting about this but im sure reasonable grown ups will be able to see the amusing side or perhaps correct me on any missunderstandings.

Im fairly sure that there isnt an episode of TNG or DS9 that had Worf as a primary character, where he didnt start spouting some twaddle about Klingon Honour, but he always seems to be contradicting himself.
To quote a couple of things although not word for word:

"There is nothing more honourable then to die in battle"
"There is nothing more honourable then victory"

Now correct me if im wrong, but that pretty much ties up anything involving violence in an neat little bow that says win or lose fighting is honourable.

Also i would like to point out that half the stuff that the Klingons do in the shows is anything but honourable by any definition of the word. Picking on the small, picking on the weak, generally being arrogant, and thats just Worf himself

Onto quantum mechanics

Im no physicist, but i like to think i keep up to date on a certain amount being an engineer by trade, and a bit of a geek at times.

When time travel was first approached by the original Treksters, they kept it nice and simple. Dont interfere too much with the past, or you will knacker the present. Although lets face it, Kirk and his gang did plenty of things that should well have totally borked the space time continuum

Things got a little more complicated in TNG, with ever more obscure Quantum theory being spouted, usually by Data, most of which was complete rubbish, that was made up to justify that particular storyline, and on occasion, Q would come along and mess about with his Godly power and "Erase" anything that may or may not have changed the course of time, having been persuaded by Picard at the last minute that the human race weren't complete turds (a thoery which i have myself yet to be convinced) And i Quote "Dammit Q, where's the Monopoly!?!" (p.s i know its annomaly, but i think monopoly is funnier)

Then with DS9 and Voyager it all goes to hell in a hand basket with Time travel stroylines being thrown at us left, right and chelsea, In fact, the writers themselves even give up hope of trying to invent more quantum mechanics and instead create an FBI of time travel, (whose actual name escapes me at present)

and in the latest franchise (which im sorry to say i find nausiating to watch) things go a bit more bonkers.

You might be asking yourself at this moment, what my actual point is about this. Really just to say i find it funny, that they probably have more trouble thinking of convenient pretend quantum mechanics to justify the storylines then they actually do writing the stories themselves.

Im certainly not going to start writing letters to the producers with nerd rage letters about insignificant details and such.

I should mention that its not just the Klingons that have these paradoxial standards either, they are just the easiest target as they are the loudest.

Also they have rotten teeth and bad breath, and eat worms.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
07-11-2010, 02:17 AM
Okay. *Cracks knuckles* I'm bored as all heck and no one else has touched this yet.

Quote:
Im fairly sure that there isnt an episode of TNG or DS9 that had Worf as a primary character, where he didnt start spouting some twaddle about Klingon Honour, but he always seems to be contradicting himself.
To quote a couple of things although not word for word:

"There is nothing more honourable then to die in battle"
"There is nothing more honourable then victory"

Now correct me if im wrong, but that pretty much ties up anything involving violence in an neat little bow that says win or lose fighting is honourable.
Any culture that spews any honor BS uses it as a mere crutch and hides behind it as an enabler to allow them to do any number of horrible of things, meanwhile if the enemy did it right back it'd be a dishonor.

Quote:
Also i would like to point out that half the stuff that the Klingons do in the shows is anything but honourable by any definition of the word. Picking on the small, picking on the weak, generally being arrogant, and thats just Worf himself
Pretty much. Then you see something like Undiscovered Country and see how bad just two Federation Operatives can take them out by doing something as simple as knocking out their gravity and you can't help but laugh at how pathetic they are. Oh, and that whole Khitomer thing. Don't get me started on the Tribble thing, though I will admit that it was funny... at first.

Quote:
When time travel was first approached by the original Treksters, they kept it nice and simple. Dont interfere too much with the past, or you will knacker the present. Although lets face it, Kirk and his gang did plenty of things that should well have totally borked the space time continuum
Ah... good times. Wait, who am I kidding, TOS was like the worst thing I ever seen, though the movies (Save TMP and Final Frontier) were okay. Aside from the Whales (which needed to happen... I guess) and the Guardian of Time I don't really recall many time episodes, though I could be wrong.

Quote:
Things got a little more complicated in TNG, with ever more obscure Quantum theory being spouted, usually by Data, most of which was complete rubbish, that was made up to justify that particular storyline, and on occasion, Q would come along and mess about with his Godly power and "Erase" anything that may or may not have changed the course of time, having been persuaded by Picard at the last minute that the human race weren't complete turds (a thoery which i have myself yet to be convinced) And i Quote "Dammit Q, where's the Monopoly!?!" (p.s i know its annomaly, but i think monopoly is funnier)
TNG was okay when it was Q doing something time-related seeing as how "Q-magic" made it acceptable. But the episode with all the bridge crew playing cards and time continuing to loop with next to no change until Data saved them all was horrible, though the one other episode with time loops was epic seeing as how Picard shot himself to death, which was hardcore. Imagine, killing a time copy of yourself! this is also about when I should remind you that like 90% of all the science in Trek is either warped or made up on the spot and it's kinda one of those "sit back and accept it or change the channel" deals, which I could personally do until Enterprise showed up and became a characture of all this riding in a clown car.

Quote:
Then with DS9 and Voyager it all goes to hell in a hand basket with Time travel stroylines being thrown at us left, right and chelsea, In fact, the writers themselves even give up hope of trying to invent more quantum mechanics and instead create an FBI of time travel, (whose actual name escapes me at present)
Yeah. Yeah it did. DS9 was usually pretty good about it, the Tribble episode was freaking amazing and was easily explained with the Orb, and again either you subscribe to the "magic" or you don't. At least this one is partially explained. BTW it's Department of Temporal Investigations. With the exception of the Two-parter with Braxton and the episode where Voyager crashes in the Beta Quadrant and a future Harry Kim and Chakote save them all I loathed what Voyager did to the timeline. HOWEVER the writers even started picking fun with likes like:

"When I was in the academy I swore I would stay away from time travel" - Janeway
"However Braxton was right, you do show up on our grid way too many times" - DTI agent
"Harry if you want my advice about time travel, don't try to understand it". - Janeway

Heck, even Harry the more grown-up and professional version of Wesley Crusher found a flaw in one of those episodes and Janeway like verbally dives on him mid way through to prevent him from breaking the fifth wall.

Quote:
and in the latest franchise (which im sorry to say i find nausiating to watch) things go a bit more bonkers.
If you mean Enterprise, yeah I agree. It was horrible. Temporal Cold war... no. NOOOOOOO

If you mean Star Trek XI aka Star Trek 2009 aka Star Trek, I would disagree, it was fairly straight forward aside from the doubious idea that a Black Hole kicks you back in time and through a dimensional wall, but really who is to say. Beyond that it's called Science fiction for a reason.

Quote:
You might be asking yourself at this moment, what my actual point is about this. Really just to say i find it funny, that they probably have more trouble thinking of convenient pretend quantum mechanics to justify the storylines then they actually do writing the stories themselves.
As I just said. It's called Science Fiction for a reason. Not all the science is going to add up and so long as it at least sounds either probably or isn't so absolutely flawed that I go "Uh waaaaaa??" over it then I can dig it. But I agree it is beaten like a dead horse.

Quote:
Im certainly not going to start writing letters to the producers with nerd rage letters about insignificant details and such.
Nope, just a website of fiercely loyal fans that'll do unmentionable things in reconciliation. Great tactical move.

Quote:
I should mention that its not just the Klingons that have these paradoxial standards either, they are just the easiest target as they are the loudest.

Also they have rotten teeth and bad breath, and eat worms.
Indeed they do have bad breath, eat worms and have rotten teeth.

I'd personally point out the Cardassians, as as race they seem Schizophrenic. In TNG they are shown as bad guys, and in the beginning of DS9 they are kinda inbetween. Then BOOM EVIL... BUT WAIT! Here comes an episode where Sisco and Jake sail on solar rays and get a fireworks display when they arrive in the Cardassia system!

In short my point: this has and always will be trek. Take it or leave it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
07-11-2010, 11:11 AM
yes trek has some paradoxs, yes trek writing has been insufferable, yes the *******s gave us wesley " fricken" crusher, and all the other trash we just dont care for. but i love it.
sometimes i dont want to think, i think tooo much most of the time and my brain needs some nice soft pap.
and trek could do that, it was your schmoo, it was whatever you wanted it to be. Smart, sexy, rediculous.

we all see what we want to see in star trek and not one person is wrong.......except Wesley" fricken" Crusher. They shoulda chucked him to a penal asteroid with breasts tattooed on his back.

i mean whats the alternative?
in the 60's there was doc who and only if you liked in the UK.
In the 80' when TNG came on there wasnt much to compete with it, there was doc who reruns from the UK.
and night rider, and a string of really awefull sticoms.
in the 90's there was babylon 5, i loved that show but the acting was terrible. and doc who reruns over here new ones if you lived in the UK, but you also got red dwarf, and that was awesome. tek war? earth the final conflict? andromeda which i loved. Lexx?
in the new millenium we were choking on sci fi, seemed like a new sci fi show was coming out every week for a year or two there. and all that was really good about them was no one cared, exceptions being firefly and battle star galactica.

if you dont like sci fi, grab a snack and pretend to walk with a ring for a few books *****ing about how hungry you are and deep down how hot mr. frodo really is.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
07-12-2010, 04:32 AM
TEXT WALL!

MY EYES!
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