Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
07-23-2010, 09:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vennie22
I have a vague feeling on the back of my mind guys, that someone has a deep and strange obsession with every organization of players that directly or indirectly includes the acronym "PVP".

Has anybody else felt anything similar lately?
I think the OP was posing a hypothetical question, we all know that as long as there is pvp, there will be groups who specialise in it.

I think the OP's question should be treated as such - Hypothetically.

And so far the majority are cool with pvp focused folk.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
07-23-2010, 11:33 AM
No game has ever totally separated the group queues from solo players in a PvP context. The closest one has come is WoW, where people who queue as a group are more likely to be matched against other groups; that is, the queueing algorithm is intelligent enough to match group against group when possible.

That only works when you have a very large number of people PvPing. STO does not. Separating group queues from solo queues would destroy PvP in this game completely. It's a horrible idea. Learn to play and win, rather than trying to change the game to suit your personal preference.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
07-23-2010, 11:47 AM
I think the question ultimately boils down to this:
Would PvP be better without people really interested in PvP?
I guess that's a variant of "If a tree falls in the wood and no one is around, does it make a noise?"
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
07-23-2010, 12:06 PM
I think we all know the poor op is pretty much on a crusade against anything he feels gives anyone else he plays against an advantage over him. BOPS Vent Organizatios... I forget everything he feels is Over Powered but I'm sure there is more.

STO is NOT a hard game to do well in. I am not saying it doesn't take skill to be very good... but it does not take a ton of skill to be competitive.

The ops posts are not completely unintelligent which is why its so frustrating that he seems to refuse so much good advise he has gotten on these forums.

The idea of a smarter que system that would pull teams over pug if possible is not a terrible idea... if the game pop would make it work. Which right now it does not.

I would much rather get a game when my fleet is not around and I have qued up myself then having the teams queing up and me never getting a game. I would rather be the one pug player on the team and have at it.

A fleet VS pug is not always a face roll... yes the pug will very rarely win. However there are degrees of winning. Thanks to the current que system I have been in plenty of 5 on 2; 4 on 3 or the odd 4 on 1.
I never give up and if I can finnish one of those with a score like a 15 to 10 loss... I consider it a victory. It can also be fun. In any event I'm am straying from the topic the op threw down.

NO we do not need any divisive que system.
Yes I would PvP just as much... there are so few klinks; I would team with the same people anyway. lol

If this game ever reaches a population that would suppot a smarter que system that would pull teams and still allow pug people to get a match when then want one... then cryptic can look into a smarter que system.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
07-23-2010, 12:14 PM
I'm setting myself up here but I have to ask Azurian 2 questions.

Are you refearing to Fed OR Klink fleets?

Are you sure the people you are having issues with are even in the same fleets ?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
07-23-2010, 01:26 PM
Both.

As for your second, lets put it this way, nobody likes getting curbstomped. And people tend to actually have fun in PvP when people are even.

PvP fleets vs PvP Fleets
PuGs against PuGs
1 on 1s

But I've yet to see a PuG enjoy fighting a PvP Fleet. It's usually ends up people throwing in the towel, not respawning, or suicide attacks.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
07-23-2010, 01:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
Both.

As for your second, lets put it this way, nobody likes getting curbstomped. And people tend to actually have fun in PvP when people are even.

PvP fleets vs PvP Fleets
PuGs against PuGs
1 on 1s

But I've yet to see a PuG enjoy fighting a PvP Fleet. It's usually ends up people throwing in the towel, not respawning, or suicide attacks.
Well I am not saying I don't see your point... to a point. (I think that makes sense)

I think that the real issue is Expectations. If you do PvP once in a while you can't expect to win 50/50... or even 25/75. I know your post wasn't about balance... however not being able to win more then a 1/4 or your matches when you very rarely do something is not odd behaviour. I very rarely play basketball I'm not going to go down to the local gym for a pickup game and expect to be MJ. That dosn't mean I can't have fun playing.

We have all been in uneven matches number wise, hopefuly the 2.0 que is better that way.
However being mis matched in numbers or skill is no reason to stop playing and give up.

As I mentioned in my previous post people should Change their Expectations. Consider getting a couple kills on a good team a victory.

One type of match we all remember the most are matches where the other side pulls a few suprises and swings a few kills. Against another team we know pretty much what to expect. A pug that pulls things together (even if only for a moment) and scores a good blow is a TON of fun.

I have also been on the other side of things where I am playing a few pug matches for fun and run into a team or a semi team of targets. Giving those teams a workout for their win is fun as well, you don't have to have ultimate victory for PvP to be FUN. That is what we are here for after all.

Anyway, thanks for answering my questions. You do seem intelligent, keep practicing and trying new things. I am sure you have the ability to be competitive, and more competitive players in this game will do the most to fix the issue you are perceiving. (ie. If the majority of pugs start having one or two competitive players... fewer people will feel steamrolled)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
07-23-2010, 07:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
Both.

As for your second, lets put it this way, nobody likes getting curbstomped. And people tend to actually have fun in PvP when people are even.

PvP fleets vs PvP Fleets
PuGs against PuGs
1 on 1s

But I've yet to see a PuG enjoy fighting a PvP Fleet. It's usually ends up people throwing in the towel, not respawning, or suicide attacks.
I understand what you are saying ... but IMHO it is not the fault of the well organized fleet ... they should not be punished for doing a good job at what they do. Yet to a degree that is essentially what you are sugggesting. (at least from a certain stand point of view)

I may be the fartherst thing from the kind of player I want to be on this forum .... yet , I still respect their skill and team play.

IMHO a part of the problem is that there are not enough ques with LARGER numbers available.

I DO agree with the idea that PvP should be "tiered" ... matching rank with rank. ie: RA-5 (current top rank) with RA-5. OR: Captain with Captain. Other wise you end up with a very lop-sided out of balance que.

Also: the larger numbered ques would have a tendancy to be more forgiving where there is perhaps an imbalance of player "classes" (ie: not enough healer types). IMHO this is ALSO where smaller ques that have all (or mostly all ) one fleet within that que. A well ran fleet has a balance of players in each category and usually do a pretty good job at those stations. IF the QUE were for 25 to 40 players ... that same quild or fleet would still be there .. BUT it would be a PART of that que .. and not totally dominating it. IMHO that would even the odds a bit. It is unlikely that there that many guilds that large.

these are just my thoughts and opinions. It should also be noted that I have no problem with fleets sticking togeather in PvP. I use to be active in that very thing. It is fun !

I will return to PvP ... I just need to get past the initial reluctance.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
07-23-2010, 10:24 PM
ROFL people wonder why all the good pvpers leave this game.......
OP - L2P
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
07-24-2010, 05:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by akumarev
ROFL people wonder why all the good pvpers leave this game.......
OP - L2P
Can you elaborate? To my knowledge, the amount of noteworthy PVP players that have left is exactly zero.
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