Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
08-09-2010, 03:46 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhodes85 View Post
"I don't like the idea of Klingons being able to fight anyone at any time - nobody should be forced into PvP if they don't want it "

Erm...you really don't play many online games I take it.... The reality is its not the 'omg!! everyones going to get slaughtered a hundred times if they leave spacedock!!!' that you are likely thinking. Even the most hardcore pvp games, like Meridian59 (which has completely unrestricted pvp) don't function like that. Will you get attacked? yes, occasionally. But the fact is it only means you would have to learn to use your head and to protect yourself. It would also encourage players forming fleets and pave the way for possible future expansions of pvp content. That aside what do you really care if you are 'forced into pvp' in a game that has literally no penalty for death? Just curious is all.
Because it's a pain in the ass. Unlike Klingons, we actually have a lot of stuff to be getting on with because we aren't primarily a PvP faction. Also I don't see why Brigadier Generals ambushing new players as they try and make their way towards the S.S. Azura is a good thing. Neither is not being able to go anywhere without a fleet tailing you to 'protect you'.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
08-09-2010, 04:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DekuScrubby View Post
Because it's a pain in the ass. Unlike Klingons, we actually have a lot of stuff to be getting on with because we aren't primarily a PvP faction. Also I don't see why Brigadier Generals ambushing new players as they try and make their way towards the S.S. Azura is a good thing. Neither is not being able to go anywhere without a fleet tailing you to 'protect you'.
isnt the federation supposed to be about protecting the weak? i think a ton of players would spend all die (at no risk) to hunt down the offending klingon. and the dude who died and just had to click "respawn" 15 seconds later, he would get over it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
08-09-2010, 08:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhodes85 View Post
That aside what do you really care if you are 'forced into pvp' in a game that has literally no penalty for death? Just curious is all.
It's not dying that's annoying, it's being forced to do stuff you didn't want to do that's annoying. Perhaps they had a limited amount of time to play, and whatever they had planned is shot to hell because some kid thought it'd be fun to gank them?

It boils down to player choice, and how they want to spend their time in the game. Not everyone finds the tension and excitement that comes with being perma-flagged enjoyable.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
08-09-2010, 09:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EmoeJoe
isnt the federation supposed to be about protecting the weak?
Yes, this is a great idea. Any high level Klingon who wants to PvP can go to Sirius and grief low-level players, and I have to waste my time fulfilling your need for attention instead of doing what I'm paying fifteen bucks a month to do, so that other people can level to do what they want to do.

I can't wait to see a five man team of Lt. Generals chasing down a lone Miranda that has no chance of escaping or fighting back, so that someone will come and fight them, so that they can prove how big their e-manparts are when they win / spout racial epithets and accuse the other people of cheating or being OP when they lose!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
08-10-2010, 09:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lysander_X View Post
Yes, this is a great idea. Any high level Klingon who wants to PvP can go to Sirius and grief low-level players, and I have to waste my time fulfilling your need for attention instead of doing what I'm paying fifteen bucks a month to do, so that other people can level to do what they want to do.

I can't wait to see a five man team of Lt. Generals chasing down a lone Miranda that has no chance of escaping or fighting back, so that someone will come and fight them, so that they can prove how big their e-manparts are when they win / spout racial epithets and accuse the other people of cheating or being OP when they lose!
/signed
so true...
especially when it comes to the e-peen thing.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
08-12-2010, 06:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhodes85 View Post
"I don't like the idea of Klingons being able to fight anyone at any time - nobody should be forced into PvP if they don't want it "

Erm...you really don't play many online games I take it.... The reality is its not the 'omg!! everyones going to get slaughtered a hundred times if they leave spacedock!!!' that you are likely thinking. Even the most hardcore pvp games, like Meridian59 (which has completely unrestricted pvp) don't function like that. Will you get attacked? yes, occasionally. But the fact is it only means you would have to learn to use your head and to protect yourself. It would also encourage players forming fleets and pave the way for possible future expansions of pvp content. That aside what do you really care if you are 'forced into pvp' in a game that has literally no penalty for death? Just curious is all.
Sorry, but I find being forced into the Deep Space Encounters to be bad enough....specially when you get attacked before you get the chance to warp out again.

I only play the PvE part of this game and I'm enjoying it, not everyone wants to show off their ego by ganking people.

Oh and before you say that I haven't played many MMO's or never played a real PvP MMO, let me tell you something:
I have been playing Lineage 2 for 5 years that has a completely open PvP system and a severe death penalty (exp loss + debuff). You can get attacked and killed by anyone at any time at any place (except towns).
My PvP count in that game is under 20 kills while many other that has played allot less than me can have 20.000+ kills.

btw the death penalty used to be allot worse and by that I mean: exp loss and a great chance of dropping 1-10 random items from your inventory (including armor and weapon) and in Lineage 2 it can take months to be able to afford a new armor or weapon.

And trust me, there is no fun at all to be ganked over and over again by a max level char when you are low level.,,and to insult you even more they even say "good fun" to you after 1 shooting you.


There is a reason why many MMO's have 2 different servers setups (PvP and PvE).

In STO that could be done by having PvE instances and PvP instances.
With an option in the social window where you set team preference and stuff that let you set your play style to PvP or PvE so that the server knows if it should port you into the PvP instances or into the PvE instances...I know mine would be perma set to PvE.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
08-15-2010, 02:01 AM
First let me say, I'm not a PvP player (and by that logic I'm not good at it)

But, this seems like a GOOD idea to me, if implemented with some restrictions.

I think it would actually feel very Star Trekkish. The ratioanle behind: This is supposed to be a real Star Trek world. Federation is at war with Klingons.
Now, when you fly through Pi Canis, or Eta Eridani - you're crossing Klingon neutral zone, you're almost in Klingon space (if not already). But you don't feel any anxiety about 2 BoPs decloacking dead ahead, you are not worried about anything bad happening to you. If you want to RP patrolling Klingon borders, you just need to jump onto first open DSE you find ;-)

It would be good to have this additional suspense to game (and I'd welcome it and maybe even start learning PvP because of it )

SO here is my idea:
- Allow Klingons to Eta Eridani, Pi Canis, Regulus andf Psi Velorum (they are supposed to be invading Romulans, aren't they?)
- Keep some Federation safe heavens - SIrius, Alpha Centauri, etc
- (the other sector blocks let's leave them as they are, in future will be populated by other faction(s))
- Provide rewards for participating in this stuff (no idea exactly on how - emblems, marks, etc???)
- Limit the level difference which can attack and be attacked (I'm sure even many VAs would then instead of grinding in B'Tran go to hunt Klingons in free sector space). In the beginning, maybe focusing on allowing this for endgame chars might be an initial option to test it out and avoid level differences popping up.
- Attack 1on 1 only - I know this is something that would have to be thought out much more, by now I don;t see any reasonable way how to mitigate the X on 1 unwinnable situations...(this is a weak point, I admit)


As mentioned, it would need some thought, but would be next step towards bringing this to a live Star Trek world, instead of running around green box (B'Tran) and popping through holes to see who's there (again B'Tran ) - I hate B'Tran I really do (why must most of the reward-related stuff go on there...???)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
08-15-2010, 02:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by voniatko View Post
First let me say, I'm not a PvP player (and by that logic I'm not good at it)

But, this seems like a GOOD idea to me, if implemented with some restrictions.

I think it would actually feel very Star Trekkish. The ratioanle behind: This is supposed to be a real Star Trek world. Federation is at war with Klingons.
Now, when you fly through Pi Canis, or Eta Eridani - you're crossing Klingon neutral zone, you're almost in Klingon space (if not already). But you don't feel any anxiety about 2 BoPs decloacking dead ahead, you are not worried about anything bad happening to you. If you want to RP patrolling Klingon borders, you just need to jump onto first open DSE you find ;-)

It would be good to have this additional suspense to game (and I'd welcome it and maybe even start learning PvP because of it )

SO here is my idea:
- Allow Klingons to Eta Eridani, Pi Canis, Regulus andf Psi Velorum (they are supposed to be invading Romulans, aren't they?)
- Keep some Federation safe heavens - SIrius, Alpha Centauri, etc
- (the other sector blocks let's leave them as they are, in future will be populated by other faction(s))
- Provide rewards for participating in this stuff (no idea exactly on how - emblems, marks, etc???)
- Limit the level difference which can attack and be attacked (I'm sure even many VAs would then instead of grinding in B'Tran go to hunt Klingons in free sector space). In the beginning, maybe focusing on allowing this for endgame chars might be an initial option to test it out and avoid level differences popping up.
- Attack 1on 1 only - I know this is something that would have to be thought out much more, by now I don;t see any reasonable way how to mitigate the X on 1 unwinnable situations...(this is a weak point, I admit)


As mentioned, it would need some thought, but would be next step towards bringing this to a live Star Trek world, instead of running around green box (B'Tran) and popping through holes to see who's there (again B'Tran ) - I hate B'Tran I really do (why must most of the reward-related stuff go on there...???)
this is ingenious and i agree right now most of the pvp oriented players which i consider my self one of are bored with the current pvp system at first it was always 5 vs 1 now its "you are not in the queue" or there isn't any one even in the ques so it will never start. right now i have degraded to flying around Kerrat hoping that some sort of team will form and actually have a battle which so far has only happened 1 time in a week and believe it or not a good 1/3 if not 1/2 of the player base is pvp oriented and are very disgruntled with the pvp system
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
08-15-2010, 03:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by voniatko View Post
It would be good to have this additional suspense to game (and I'd welcome it and maybe even start learning PvP because of it )

SO here is my idea:
- Allow Klingons to Eta Eridani, Pi Canis, Regulus andf Psi Velorum (they are supposed to be invading Romulans, aren't they?)
- Keep some Federation safe heavens - SIrius, Alpha Centauri, etc
- (the other sector blocks let's leave them as they are, in future will be populated by other faction(s))
- Provide rewards for participating in this stuff (no idea exactly on how - emblems, marks, etc???)
- Limit the level difference which can attack and be attacked (I'm sure even many VAs would then instead of grinding in B'Tran go to hunt Klingons in free sector space). In the beginning, maybe focusing on allowing this for endgame chars might be an initial option to test it out and avoid level differences popping up.
- Attack 1on 1 only - I know this is something that would have to be thought out much more, by now I don;t see any reasonable way how to mitigate the X on 1 unwinnable situations...(this is a weak point, I admit[/i]
  • There are PvE things that Feds need to be doing in those sector blocks. If I had been attacked every step of the journey to the Regulus system at Lieutenant Commander I would have given up. Klingons don't really have anything but PvP to be doing.
  • It's not about the level difference. Let's say someone isn't specced out properly and doesn't have all-purple mk XI's on their ship. AKA someone who isn't interested in PvP and shouldn't be forced into it if they don't want to. They're ambushed by an experienced PvPer who had grinded or spent a whole lot of money on super-powerful weapons and BOff powers etc, but because they're the same level the game deems this a fair challenge. This wouldn't make it more Star Trekkish. It would make it an almost solely PvP game.

EDIT: The only way I could see this working is a) with one dedicated sector block, open to both factions that holds this kind of 1v1 open PvP, or b) if there was a way to 'opt out' of all incoming challenges (which would no doubt lead to hilarious Klingon forum posts about "Feddie cowards" who don't want to play PvP with them )
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
08-15-2010, 12:29 PM
/signed

I don`t really care if KDF characters won`t access the Federation quest line but it would be nice if we can roam around federation territory, even as "pirates". I love my Orion and would love to go to the Federation planets and points of interest such as Risa, Vulcan, Andoria, DS9, etc. for roleplay and social purposes.

The thing is this....it can be done and has been done during open beta. The devs removed the filtering so KDF characters are able to go to Federation territory. They were flagged for PVP of course but I think if they remove the flag, it should be fun.

Ideally it should be free, but I would be willing to pay for it via C-store if that gives Cryptic the incentive to make it happen. I`m sure there will be a lot of whining if that is the case but meh...if there is a demand for it and people willing to pay, you can`t really blame people for cashing in. Plus its a small price to pay for the countless joy of the ``go anywhere`` feature....
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