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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
Not that I really mind. But, in References from Star Trek First Contact, and the TNG episode "Time's arrow" and the DS9 episode: In the cards, it's been stated that the Federation doesn't use money. But there are many forms of currency in this game.

It's never explained why they don't use money anymore. The usual conclusion is that replicators can make pretty much anything anyone wants- for free. But, even if they could make things out of pure energy, you'd still need people that run the power plants, fuel it and maintain it. Will they do it for free? Plus, there are many things that replicators can't make. What about things that are too large to replicate, like real estate? Or a personal ship/runabout
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
08-03-2010, 09:42 PM
They will do it for free, if there's enough energy to do it (energy credits represent this) or if you have enough merit to pull things as favors (starfleet merits represent this).

Engineers maintain the power plants and such that keep the people on ships and starbases alive, it's part of the job. Plus, as you've seen, pretty much anyone in Starfleet has the basic engineering training to do simple tasks.

Industrial grade replicators are mentioned in DS9 and they do replicate parts of ships (that are replicatable of course, I doubt Voyager's replicators could replicate the bioneural circuitry since it's alive nor could even the heavy duty replicators replicate an already constructed ship, that'd simply be too big and complicated).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3 True but
08-04-2010, 01:11 AM
100% true for canan but this a non canon timeline so anything gos. Plus they may add a rouge class sometime down the road and use credits, Wishfull think a 3ed netural group they can play on both sides.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
08-04-2010, 04:37 AM
the reason humanity gave up money is because after world war 3 we got the vulcans attention with a basic warp jump from cochran, now the vulcans being emotionless communists came down and made earth better with their tech and insisted money be done away with. humanity seeing the world being a better place without worrying about money got into the habit and it stuck in the federation that money wouldnt be needed, but you still need to have the energy or whatnot to get things specially made since in communism everyone only gets an equal share :p
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
08-04-2010, 08:56 AM
I could go digging for examples but i honestly simply can't be bothered. Essentially in TNG there's a whole host of examples of people using something to buy things. The same as in DS9 in fact, so basically what Picard said can be put down as movie logic.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
08-04-2010, 09:39 AM
The Federation DO use currency and this has been demonstrated a few times.

Anything we see saying they dont use money can either be rationalised as being propaganda or simply a change in 'definition / interpretation' of what money is. This is not the first time Star Trek has broken it's own ideals of a 'perfect society' or tried to push ideals that are simply beyond stupid outside of a fantasy setting.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
08-04-2010, 12:17 PM
EARTH does not use money. Starfleet doesn't use money. Planets that are members of the Federation may or may not use money. There was GPL on DS9 and maybe Bajoran money too because DS9 was a Bajoran station being administered by StarFleet. Anytime a Starfleet office bought something on DS9 using money it because the Ferengi, Cardassians, and Bajorans use money. On Earth, there is no money. (Mentioned several times in STTNG, ST First Contact, and Star Trek IV.)

Energy Credits are essentially for rationing the use of the Replicator. (For example, it takes 1000 energy credits for the replicator to make a Phaser Array.) Even though "energy credits" are used in STO, we still go to venders and "buy" items. This doesn't make a whole lot of canonical sense.

I propose that when on a Federation Starship, or a Federation Starbase, that the word "Buy" is never used in the interface. It should be replaced with "Replicate." This makes more sense in regard to Energy Credits, because that's what they're for. As a Captain you're essentially allocated a budget of replicator rations that you spend and trade in order for items to be replicated. (Kind of like carbon emission credits in the real world.)

So, that covers Federation "storefronts." How about alien ones? It's my opinion that alien merchants like the Ferengi, or merchants in Sector Space, or on the Promenade in DS9 use "Gold Pressed Latinum" for money. With merchants you actually do "buy" things - so actual money would make sense.

How would you make GPL? If you were to sell an item from your inventory to an alien merchant you'd get GPL.If you win at Dabo, you'd get GPL. If you Recycle items from your inventory either while at space or at a Star base, you'd get energy credits.

This would add a new dynamic to STO's economy. You'd need to put thought into where you'd want to sell/recycle your items because Star Fleet people won't take GPL, and will only give you EC in exchange for recycled items. Alien vendors won't accept EC, for purchases but might offer GPL OR EC when they purchase items from you. (Note that a vendor might give you 10 GPL for an item, OR 250 ECs depending on how the economy would work.)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
08-04-2010, 12:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by wraith1977 View Post
EARTH does not use money. Starfleet doesn't use money. Planets that are members of the Federation may or may not use money. There was GPL on DS9 and maybe Bajoran money too because DS9 was a Bajoran station being administered by StarFleet. Anytime a Starfleet office bought something on DS9 using money it because the Ferengi, Cardassians, and Bajorans use money.
Quick canonical correction:http://memory-alpha.org/wiki/Deep_Space_9

One of the most historically, politically, and strategically important space stations in the Alpha Quadrant, Deep Space 9, originally known as Terok Nor, was an orbital space station constructed by the Cardassians in orbit of Bajor. Under Federation administration following the Cardassian withdrawal, DS9 became a vital commercial port and defensive outpost because of its strategic location near the mouth of the Bajoran wormhole. It later became a key tactical location in the Dominion War.

Terok Nor was built by the Cardassian Union between 2346 and 2351. (DS9: "Babel", "Wrongs Darker Than Death or Night") Its original purpose was to serve as a refinery for uridium ore that was mined from Bajor's surface. Therefore, Terok Nor had extensive ore refining and transport facilities that occupied the large docking pylon structures and was built to accommodate up to seven thousand humanoid-sized people. (DS9: "Sanctuary") The station also served as a command post from which the Cardassian Prefect of Bajor, Gul Dukat, would oversee the military aspects of the Occupation. Like the planet it orbited, the station operated on a 26-hour day. (DS9: "A Man Alone")

In 2365, Gul Dukat took the unusual step of appointing a non-Cardassian as the chief of security aboard Terok Nor. Odo, a shapeshifter discovered on a derelict ship near Bajor some years before, had ties to both the Cardassians and the Bajorans on the station. (DS9: "Necessary Evil")

In 2369, the Cardassians decided to withdraw from Bajor after fifty years of occupation. Unable to move the station across interstellar distances, they were forced to leave the outpost in its high orbit. Before departing, however, Cardassian soldiers rampaged across the station, removing or destroying a large portion of the station's equipment and killing several shop owners. (DS9: "Emissary")
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
08-04-2010, 08:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by J-Sheridan
The Federation DO use currency and this has been demonstrated a few times.

Anything we see saying they dont use money can either be rationalised as being propaganda or simply a change in 'definition / interpretation' of what money is. This is not the first time Star Trek has broken it's own ideals of a 'perfect society' or tried to push ideals that are simply beyond stupid outside of a fantasy setting.
all too correct.....
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
08-04-2010, 08:27 PM
If you're going to say the federation uses money, you gotta cite where this happens.

And yeah, energy credits are replicator rations, like on voyager.

The interesting bit is that you don't need money to have an economy. Merit and favor based are much fuzzier but they still work. I think a good example is that famous terraformer who was trying to light off a sun; I think this was on DS9. Because everyone has stars in their eyes from his sheer awesomeness, even Starfleet is willing to back him.

If you want a modern example of a merit/favor based economy you can look at Hollywood. A star or director makes a really high grossing movie and in order to keep them happy a studio is willing to subsidize their pet projects. But that only works for so long before more blockbusters are demanded. And the more cred you have the more you can attract top tier talent for all aspects of a project.
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