Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
08-16-2010, 01:16 PM
When I buy anything I tend to look for a deal. Maybe I am a cheap that way. But I have never seen the C-Store have a sale on anything, to me that's just a bad store idea. To me things like the C-Store are for F2P games, some P2P have a few transactions you can make, like name changes and server transfers but not nearly as much as the C-Store (for all cryptic games). I bet it drives more people away from the game than it makes in money. Think if even just all the cosmetic stuff was in game how much better it would look at first glance to a new subscriber. I am willing to bet that most people are huge fans of TNG if nothing else in star trek. Yet you have to pay extra for a TNG uniform, what? The 2 worst things in the C-Store are ships, mostly refits and respecs. Why discourage people from trying new specs and ships that will keep them interested in the game and thus play longer?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
08-16-2010, 01:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigduckie
Ducks? where?





Unfortunately to me it seems that you are complaining about being poor, cheap or both. ive seen so many darn fed dreds that that honestly i dont think the price must be that bad.
I am not poor, I just find it unreasonable to expect someone to pay more for a ship than the actual cost of the game. If people buy than fine, but is it really to much to expect a decent quality to cost ratio.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
08-16-2010, 01:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shingi
frankly, i wonder what people's problem with the C-Store is..

the general argument i see given is "that stuff should be covered by our monthly sub and should be free"

normally given by people who are willing to shell out the price of a full new game on an expansion to a game (which is also made at the same time using the money from the monthly subs)

yes, its a form of generating revenue, and i'd rather see content thats in the C-Store drip-feed into the game bit by bit over time in a way that allows you to chose what you want to have and what you dont than have it all lumped together in a package i HAVE to buy all of to get the bits i want a year after launch.

its the model the whole MMO industry is using now, and just as when expansions started happening not everyone is going to be happy about it.. i accept that, i just wish others would accept that not everyone hates it and move past it.
The only problem with that statement is that it assumes that Cryptic will never put out an ST:O expansion pack that we'll have to buy. They'll STILL have a retail expansion at some point... that we'll have to buy ON TOP of the C-Store revenues...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
08-16-2010, 01:17 PM
I will say the retro ship unlocks are unnecessary and a cheap way to make extra cash. i personally would take those out, the rest are fine
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
08-16-2010, 01:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Presbytier View Post
This is complete PR propaganda. I highly doubt that this defunct game cost them so much to make that they actually need the C-Store to break even. When you count box sales, plus the subscriptions and the Lifetime_Subs do you really expect me believe they are not making enough of a profit to run this game?
ok you have not actually heard what im saying because im not asking you to believe their are not making enough profit to run the game

first off games cost millions. simply saying they have sold some box sales and got some subs does not automatically mean they are rolling in profit

and i did not and no one else has ever said that they cant run the game on the subs and box sales. im saying there is only a finite amount of profit and funding from subs. you can have a certain amount of content with that (ie season 2), but this is star trek and there are a million things people want from the shows. you cant have all of that on the sub and box sales alone. if you want everything now, you have to pay extra.

does this all require a little bit of faith that cryptic tell us the truth and that all the profit from c-store is not buying them fancy cars, then yes. i choose to believe them
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
08-16-2010, 01:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain_Revo
ok you have not actually heard what im saying because im not asking you to believe their are not making enough profit to run the game

first off games cost millions. simply saying they have sold some box sales and got some subs does not automatically mean they are rolling in profit

and i did not and no one else has ever said that they cant run the game on the subs and box sales. im saying there is only a finite amount of profit and funding from subs. you can have a certain amount of content with that (ie season 2), but this is star trek and there are a million things people want from the shows. you cant have all of that on the sub and box sales alone. if you want everything now, you have to pay extra.

does this all require a little bit of faith that cryptic tell us the truth and that all the profit from c-store is not buying them fancy cars, then yes. i choose to believe them
Than why is it that other P2P games run just fine with no C-Store even games like Age of Conan( which does not have a large subscription base anymore) don't need a C-Store to operate. Not to mention what do you actually think it cost to make this game?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
08-16-2010, 01:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Presbytier View Post
What is an even bigger annoyance is the cost. It cost $6.25 for 500 points those costumes cost 280 points. so after I buy those items I would have to spend another $6.25 to purchase anything else worthwhile since i would only have only 230 points after the initial purchase.

Also why does the Federation Dreadnuoght cost more than the game? I can purchase this game at Wall-Mart for $19.99, but that ship will cost me $25 since it takes 2000 points.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Presbytier View Post
I am not poor, I just find it unreasonable to expect someone to pay more for a ship than the actual cost of the game. If people buy than fine, but is it really to much to expect a decent quality to cost ratio.
The Dreadnought was originally for those that got 5 people to try and purchase the game. People complained that everyone should be able to just purchase the ship. So, there you go.

Is the price high...yes it is, and it should be. Cryptic putting that ship up on the store for a lesser price would've been a slap in the face to those that earned it through the referral program.

Regarding the C-Store in general. I really haven't seen anything in the store that I see as a "must have." I purchased the Caitian-playable race simply because it brought some added fun to the game...but that added fun wasn't necessary for me to enjoy myself with STO.

The only complaint I could sort of agree with is the character slot debate, as I agree. I've played other games that gave a lot more slots to start out with. I think a good compromise would be grant an extra 2 character slots to anyone who has a character reach the Vice Admiral rank (a one-time gift).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
08-16-2010, 01:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Presbytier View Post
Very few MMOs charge for additional character slots; in fact most MMOs that I have played start you with at least ten slots. Personally after I used up my free pre-order I have not purchased any other Cryptic points and have no intention to. F2P use an in-game store very few P2P use such a model. I guarantee Cryptic made enough money on Lifetime-subs to run this game for 5 years or more.

This is an overly general statement I would like to see proof that this is the model for the NA market(I understand that in Asia this is the model). None of the major MMO companies use such a model as extensive as STO.
WoW uses a micro transaction store for cosmetic items.
Guild Wars
DDO (had one before going F2P)
i also believe one has been announced for the forthcoming starwars MMO

i'd like to see the proof you have that STO can run for 5 years solely on the lifetime subs that you obviously have to make your guarantee there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jakyre View Post
The only problem with that statement is that it assumes that Cryptic will never put out an ST:O expansion pack that we'll have to buy. They'll STILL have a retail expansion at some point... that we'll have to buy ON TOP of the C-Store revenues...
what it means is they can take on an extra hand or two, so instead of only being able to spare the resources to put cosmetic updates into the expansion they've got the budget to get that stuff in once its ready and still fund the expansion. the players dont have to wait for the not-so-important stuff expansions normally bring and the revenue keeps those extra hands employed.


i'm also still waiting for someone to explain why giving players CHOICE is the most evil thing ever...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
08-16-2010, 01:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shingi
WoW uses a micro transaction store for cosmetic items.
Guild Wars
DDO (had one before going F2P)
i also believe one has been announced for the forthcoming starwars MMO

i'd like to see the proof you have that STO can run for 5 years solely on the lifetime subs that you obviously have to make your guarantee there.



what it means is they can take on an extra hand or two, so instead of only being able to spare the resources to put cosmetic updates into the expansion they've got the budget to get that stuff in once its ready and still fund the expansion. the players dont have to wait for the not-so-important stuff expansions normally bring and the revenue keeps those extra hands employed.


i'm also still waiting for someone to explain why giving players CHOICE is the most evil thing ever...
Nope Bioware has made no announcement as to its subscription model. And the GW store is mild compared to the C-Store. DDO has never been successful. It is not choice what it is saying is that just buying and subscribing is not good enough for us to make content for you. When you compare the overall quality of STO to the price it leaves something wanting.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
08-16-2010, 01:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Presbytier View Post
Than why is it that other P2P games run just fine with no C-Store even games like Age of Conan( which does not have a large subscription base anymore) don't need a C-Store to operate. Not to mention what do you actually think it cost to make this game?
ok im going to say it again because your not hearing me

this game does NOT need the c-store to operate.

the c-store gives them more money to make MORE stuff that the fans want because star trek is such a huge IP that there are tons of things that people want put into the game as soon as possible

it would run perfectly well without the c-store but you would not get as much

if age of conan added a c-store they could produce more stuff, but adding it does not mean that without it the game would fail

i do not know the numbers but last time i heard the game cost 15 million to make, that could be true it could be false. i have no idea how much it takes to continue making it
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