Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 31
08-26-2010, 10:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilv View Post
From what I get in those statement it seems to me that all the ships will be brought in line w/ the Excelsior, so what exactly is the problem?
Let me ask you this. How long do you think we're going to wait until these changes take place? I seriously doubt we would see any change anytime soon.

Then there is the rebalancing that has to be done for PvP and PvE, which is going to take a month to properly iron out. So we are looking at the changes no earlier than the First Year Anniversary.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Victory275 View Post
What stick to the point you want to pick at? Everyone knows that of the three professions the tac ensigns are the least impressive. That said the fact remains there was fair trade off... 1 LTC for another. The AC is not the only T5 ship stuck with the unimpressive ensign tac BO station. But interestingly you, a fellow cruiser pilot, are really the loudest at declaring the Ex is OP because the AC has a tac ensign. Why aren't you griping about the Galaxy Retrofit or the SC? They have ensign slots for eng and sci. Regardless of if one ensign is slightly better or more useful than another... everyone in the game would prefer to eliminate them completely from T5 ships. But for now at least... we all get an underachiever.

Remember refits had a chance to break the mold but then no one could stop talking about how OP the defiant would be. Every attempt to move in the direction of eliminating T5 ensign BO slots has been met with QQ overload. What was your stance on those ships before they were changed? The only ones who had any right to gripe about it was the KDF players who didn't have equal ships for PvP.

As far as the HPs, you said they were the same... I just want those who read all this to know that isn't accurate. Whatever the difference... 700 hps can men the difference between life and death, victory and loss. Kinda sound like Vin Diesel there, LOL. " It doesn't matter if you win by 700 hit points or by 36,000 hit points; winning is winning!" Sorry couldn't help myself there.

So again, really, what else do you have other than you seem unhappy with the ship you love because it has a tac ensign.
Of course I'm angry about those too, becasue the Star Cruiser wasn't no better than the Sovereign until Cryptic messed with the abilities and made Aux Heal abillities superior, in which the Science Abilities like Hazzard Emitters and TSS, and made it the most powerful tank in the game.

The Galaxy-R, well Ensign Engineering slot > Tactical Ensign slot.

But unlike those two, they didn't replace the Sovereign as a warship, but the Excelsior DID! Better Tactical, better Ensign slot, better manuverability, same HPs. Can you blame me for being mad? The Ship I worked hard to master has gotten replaced overnight for the sake of greed.



As for the HPs, I don't know how much you PvP, but to a PvPer, 700 HPs difference isn't that much of a difference. And it's funny the Excelsior-Refit has just as much HPs as a ship that's 1/3 larger.


All in all, I'm tired of treating the players baddly and not even compensating. Instead we other players telling the Sovereign Captains, "TS! Deal with it!"

Yeah, until they get the same treatment, and then they are the one up in arms.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 32
08-26-2010, 11:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
Let me ask you this. How long do you think we're going to wait until these changes take place? I seriously doubt we would see any change anytime soon.

Then there is the rebalancing that has to be done for PvP and PvE, which is going to take a month to properly iron out. So we are looking at the changes no earlier than the First Year Anniversary.



Of course I'm angry about those too, becasue the Star Cruiser wasn't no better than the Sovereign until Cryptic messed with the abilities and made Aux Heal abillities superior, in which the Science Abilities like Hazzard Emitters and TSS, and made it the most powerful tank in the game.

The Galaxy-R, well Ensign Engineering slot > Tactical Ensign slot.

But unlike those two, they didn't replace the Sovereign as a warship, but the Excelsior DID! Better Tactical, better Ensign slot, better manuverability, same HPs. Can you blame me for being mad? The Ship I worked hard to master has gotten replaced overnight for the sake of greed.



As for the HPs, I don't know how much you PvP, but to a PvPer, 700 HPs difference isn't that much of a difference. And it's funny the Excelsior-Refit has just as much HPs as a ship that's 1/3 larger.


All in all, I'm tired of treating the players baddly and not even compensating. Instead we other players telling the Sovereign Captains, "TS! Deal with it!"

Yeah, until they get the same treatment, and then they are the one up in arms.
I haven't had a lot of play time lately, but yeah I PvP quite a bit. I leveled my main toon almost completely with PvP.

How many times have you gotten an escort into low single digit health just to have him healed back up. There have been quite a few times that hps have saved me too. I've been down to 2% just to have someone throw me heals or for mine to come off cool down. So to me, a pvper, 700 hps can make all the difference. If you can't understand why I see it this way then respectfully we will have to agree to disagree. Regardless you are upset, as you have said, and your assertions are biased because of it. You are trying to get something nerfed soley because you feel your ship has been deminished. Your right, the SC tanks better than the AC... I mostly fly the AC because I like how it looks better than the SC. I recommend that you fly whatever vessel you like the best and be happy with your choice.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 33
08-26-2010, 11:35 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
Let me ask you this. How long do you think we're going to wait until these changes take place?
The one comment I read used the word "months."

And since I know other stuff will crop up in the next few months, I'd say longer than that.

Which means the unbalancing extra powerfulness of C-Store ships like the Excelsior ... added to the forthcoming Nebula, Ent-J and TOS Ent Refit ... will likely create more havoc with this problem (especially since they're ALLLLLLLL cruisers! hahahahahahahahah).

It's truly becoming a comedy of errors here.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 34
08-26-2010, 11:56 PM
Yeah, "Months" sounds about right.


With the TOS Enterprise refit? Why? Last I checked, the TMP Consitution was the refit of the TOS Enterprise.

And are people sure the Enterprise-J is playable and not being just part of a time travel mission? Because it makes no sense with it being playable.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 35
08-27-2010, 12:23 AM
Your primary complaint here seems to be that the Ensign Engineer is superior to the Ensign Tactical.

If so then this is not an issue with the Excelsior versus Sovereign, but Engineering abilities versus Tactical Abilities.

Compare the ships side by side, they have the same weapons loadouts, same number of bridge officer abilities, the Excelsior turns a bit better but has less hull and crew. On paper, pretty balanced.



But for for whatever reason, Cryotic seems to have perhaps overvalued the strength of Tactical Officer abilities as you see less crew and/or less maneuverability with the Tier 5 ships with additional Tactical Officer slots. I think with all of the adjustments to how Engineering and Science officer abilities operate, the Tactical abilities need a similar re-evaluation.

If the Tactical Ensign abilities were to be brought in line with the Science and Engineering abilities, wouldn't that be a means to resolve your complaints with the Excelsior?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 36
08-27-2010, 01:01 AM
Sounds like it is time for Cryptic to make the Battle Crusier more customizable for BO slots
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 37
08-27-2010, 03:31 AM
I'm not a pvper so that's not really a worry to me. I am concerned about the high price for the ship though... It costs just as much as 1 month subscription fee. :-s
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 38
08-27-2010, 03:49 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
Let's stick to the Ensign slots, okay. The Engineering Ensign is far superior to the Ensign Tactical and everyone knows it.

Right now, the Sovereign has like 46300 HPs fully Speced, while the Excelsior Refit has 45600 Hps. And relaly 700hps in PvP isn't that much of a difference.
If the problem is that tactical ensign slot, you know what the real solution is - fix tactical ensign slots.

Otherwise, it doesn't matter if it happens to be the Excelsior Retrofit that is superior or that it is the Fleet Escort that is superior to another ship. Ships that are superior at their role than other ships of their role is bad for the game. That it happens to be that it's no longer jus the Star Cruiser that outperforms the Assault Cruiser but also the Advanced heavy Cruiser retrofit that outperforms it is not that relevant anymore.

BUt just because you saw an Assault Cruiser drop faster than an Excelsior doesn't mean jack. I've seen Cruisers drop faster than Escorts. Player skill, tactics and luck can just be that different.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 39
08-27-2010, 10:53 AM
i dunno guys... but i feel that the retrofits are actually more of a teir 6.. i mean they are meant for VAs and the original teir 5s are meant for RAs hence its not surprising that they are more powerful then the originals.. I mean if they were on par with the originals people will complain about it.

Further more Excelsior refit maybe powerful now but wait till they come out with the Sovereign refit or the prometheus refit.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 40
08-27-2010, 11:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by XMLiew View Post
i dunno guys... but i feel that the retrofits are actually more of a teir 6..
They're not. The Devs haven't even figured out where or how T6 will fit into the game yet. The refits and retrofits are all T5.

Quote:
Further more Excelsior refit maybe powerful now but wait till they come out with the Sovereign refit or the prometheus refit.
There are no plans for either of those to be refit.
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