Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 31
09-10-2010, 09:57 PM
I really didn't raise any questions as much as I made statements about the issues we ran into trying to create a 'MEGA Fleet'. I do want to reiterate that this concept you have brought up has been tried many times and in many games. All of them that I knew of and even participated in imploded due to internal conflicts and then the main group splintered back into samller groups.

Again, I wish you luck in your endeavors, but I have a feeling that initailly you will have some success in gaining members, however after a little bit of time, attitudes and rumors will circulate and your group will ultimately fail. I would hope it wouldn't and wish you would prove me wrong, but time and experience has shown this is not possible without an actual command structure and some form of voice for the little people in the group.

Another issue I raised is that the KDFA has taken long and drawn out steps to gain the trust of the developers and even Dan Stahl. You will have a hard road ahead of you to gain the trust of them and prove that you can do more than offer complaints about the faction.

Finally, although the "chillax" attitude is nice when individual gaming, that won't fly when dealing with several individuals with feelings and emotions that contradict that of the leader of the group. Incorporating already formed fleets is a good idea...we did it too and yet it still failed due to the large amounts of people involved under just one leader.


Interesting flaws I've noted so far in your thread....

You have yet to say in your mission statement just how you intend to save the Klingon Empire.

You state you do not want to lead this group but you want to set it up only and then be hands off? Although the altruistic nature of your answer is refreshing, I can not help but go back to facts of nature that any "baby" someone creates they have yet to back away hands off.

You have yet to state what the command structure of your proposed fleet will be.

You have yet to state how you will deal with the banking situation in game and how its limitations will be worked around for such a massive fleet undertaking.

You have yet to state how you will interact with Cryptic studios or even if you have a connection to them at all.

You have yet to state in the proposed mega fleet if the current fleet leaders will be involved in the command structure (again not yet even posted).

You are asking for people who are interested to reply but you have yet to offer them anything substantial as to the plan...it's like holding a box up and asking " Who want this?" and there is nothing in the box...no prize.

You stated that you have three fleets so far combined but you haven't posted what those fleets were (names) nor has anyone from this combined fleet came on to answer any of the questions.

You have side stepped all the questions that were raised by others posting in this thread. In effect, you seem a bit on shaky ground as you don't seem to have any answers to even the most basic questions.

I hope for your sake and those in your mega fleet you can come up with some answers to these problems. Since you have stated that you will no longer be seeking alliance with the KDFA we wish you well and luck as anything that improves the Klingon faction is appreciated but I see a long upward climb for you.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 32 Questions & Answers
09-11-2010, 10:48 AM
Hello and thank you for posting in the Klingon Project thread.

Your posts will be addressed in the order they were recieved in sets.


The Rules

ADDRESSING POSTS
-Posts will be addressed in the order they were recieved
  • Posts will be addressed in sets for organizational purposes
  • After, you are welcome to go 'to the end of the line' and await the next set if you need to
  • Please note, repeat questions will simply be referred to previous posts in accordance with the
    forum guidelines
-Expect only that your questions will be answered and a 'discussion' will not ensue, however I will attempt to be detailed and comprehensive with responses as long as the posts are within these guidelines

APPROPRIATE NATURE OF POSTS
-If you think that your post is even slightly inappropriate you have time to edit it before it reaches the front of the que, at which point it will either be addressed or disregarded if it is seen as fitting the requested guidelines
-Post pertaining to the more volatile posts that have come before which eventually culminated in the enforcement of the forum guidelines will be considered null
-Please keep this in mind when posting as they will only be referred to this section of the rules.
-Posts not relevant to the progress of The Klingon Project as a whole fall into this category
-You may also refer to the STO forum guidelines if you have any confusion concerning the general rules of forum conduct

-If you absolutely feel the need for your post to be addressed if it did not fall within the afformentioned guidelines or feel that it was not fully addressed, you are welcome to send it to my personal inbox, please note that The Klingon Project is on a rough timetable and we are progressing with it in only our free time.



Your Service Representative

Who am I speaking with?
Hello my name is Tal and I am your service representive. In both my personal life and professional life, my focus and skills pertain to interpersonal and intercultural communication, and facilitation of contracted projects.

Why am I speaking with you?
Think of this project in these terms. The project is a hotel. I am the front desk clerk and/or a concierge. You are checking into the hotel or calling to ask for information on area, or availability. Like in a hotel, my job/task leaves me as the person you will be in contact with the most. Unlike the real world, requests to see the manager due to issues with your stay at the hotel will be denied as I have been given full discretion with this task. If the fleet leaders do wish to speak up, that is at their own discretion.

I report to the uppers with findings and reccomendations based on those findings for them to make final decisions regarding whatever issue is being discussed. Given my background I am best suited to this task and in all honesty I wouldn't wish it upon it anyone else due to the stresses involved despite the end-rewarding experience.

In my gaming experiences, my tasks have generally been in a support role in regards to facilitating the continued progress and running of clans/groups/fleets (specifically pertaining to three servers on NWN
(4 player guilds within that game, as well as an area builder, npc and custom content designer on their associated building teams), ROK Starcraft Channel (competions of Starcraft 1 broadcasted in the Republic of Korea), Freesky Online (2 alliances).

I would like to note, that I do not feel this resume is needed, however some people do insist on credentials. I request that people not think of me as that guy with the resume, but rather as that concierge/front desk clerk that's going to get you from point A to point B as efficiently as possible.



Lastly, this is The Klingon Project's thread. We will work within STO's forum guidelines. Your posts will be addressed soon. If you do not see a response to your post as quickly as you would like, please bear with me and wait as I am answering them off forum to be posted as one set.

Thank you,
Tal





Edit: edited for grammatical purposes
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 33
09-11-2010, 11:14 AM
Posts To Be Addressed: Set 1

Valtesia

Thunderbyrd 1

Fotimor

Thunderbyrd 2


You have approximately 24 hours from now to finish edting your posts. At 1300 hours tomorrow (est) I will quote the posts as is and begin reading them thoroughly and formulating appropriate responses.

Thank you,
Tal




edit: grammatical purposes
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 34 Dude dont think
09-12-2010, 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LEONHART View Post
Hello and thank you for posting in the Klingon Project thread.

Your posts will be addressed in the order they were recieved in sets.


The Rules

ADDRESSING POSTS
-Posts will be addressed in the order they were recieved
  • Posts will be addressed in sets for organizational purposes
  • After, you are welcome to go 'to the end of the line' and await the next set if you need to
  • Please note, repeat questions will simply be referred to previous posts in accordance with the
    forum guidelines
-Expect only that your questions will be answered and a 'discussion' will not ensue, however I will attempt to be detailed and comprehensive with responses as long as the posts are within these guidelines

APPROPRIATE NATURE OF POSTS
-If you think that your post is even slightly inappropriate you have time to edit it before it reaches the front of the que, at which point it will either be addressed or disregarded if it is seen as fitting the requested guidelines
-Post pertaining to the more volatile posts that have come before which eventually culminated in the enforcement of the forum guidelines will be considered null
-Please keep this in mind when posting as they will only be referred to this section of the rules.
-Posts not relevant to the progress of The Klingon Project as a whole fall into this category
-You may also refer to the STO forum guidelines if you have any confusion concerning the general rules of forum conduct

-If you absolutely feel the need for your post to be addressed if it did not fall within the afformentioned guidelines or feel that it was not fully addressed, you are welcome to send it to my personal inbox, please note that The Klingon Project is on a rough timetable and we are progressing with it in only our free time.



Your Service Representative

Who am I speaking with?
Hello my name is Tal and I am your service representive. In both my personal life and professional life, my focus and skills pertain to interpersonal and intercultural communication, and facilitation of contracted projects.

Why am I speaking with you?
Think of this project in these terms. The project is a hotel. I am the front desk clerk and/or a concierge. You are checking into the hotel or calling to ask for information on area, or availability. Like in a hotel, my job/task leaves me as the person you will be in contact with the most. Unlike the real world, requests to see the manager due to issues with your stay at the hotel will be denied as I have been given full discretion with this task. If the fleet leaders do wish to speak up, that is at their own discretion.

I report to the uppers with findings and reccomendations based on those findings for them to make final decisions regarding whatever issue is being discussed. Given my background I am best suited to this task and in all honesty I wouldn't wish it upon it anyone else due to the stresses involved despite the end-rewarding experience.

In my gaming experiences, my tasks have generally been in a support role in regards to facilitating the continued progress and running of clans/groups/fleets (specifically pertaining to three servers on NWN
(4 player guilds within that game, as well as an area builder, npc and custom content designer on their associated building teams), ROK Starcraft Channel (competions of Starcraft 1 broadcasted in the Republic of Korea), Freesky Online (2 alliances).

I would like to note, that I do not feel this resume is needed, however some people do insist on credentials. I request that people not think of me as that guy with the resume, but rather as that concierge/front desk clerk that's going to get you from point A to point B as efficiently as possible.



Lastly, this is The Klingon Project's thread. We will work within STO's forum guidelines. Your posts will be addressed soon. If you do not see a response to your post as quickly as you would like, please bear with me and wait as I am answering them off forum to be posted as one set.

Thank you,
Tal





Edit: edited for grammatical purposes

Dont think you can make your own forum rules your Project has been rejected by the Fleets of the Empire move on!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 35 Ha DEVs
09-12-2010, 08:08 PM
Time to close this thread or move it to a more appropriate area this is not a fleet it is in the wrong area. I will be reporting this thread you all should do the same.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 36
09-13-2010, 12:50 AM
1.0 Addressing Valtesia's Post


Thanks for the post, what I'll try to do is separate your questions/statements from your post without taking them out of context.

Question 1:
How do you handle problems if your fleet is too big?
The size of the fleet correlates to the types of problems you would have to deal with, in turn many of those problems require a lot of time to deal with.
A governing group of people is a good idea, but it won't work.


Answer 1:
To start off, what brings our fleets together and why the members get along well is due to having a similar fleet ethos and therefore similar members that drive each group. Each fleet can best be described as such:
  • -relaxed atmosphere = chillaxed
  • -family atmosphere = rather than act like a group of ruling generals, we treat the fleet structure and fleet members as family, for some reason this evokes a sense of courtesy, fun, and an amicable and helpful attitude in most fleet members. It reminds us all that this is just a game and it doesn't matter of you're a fed or a Kling, because it shows us that we are all just players. The players in our fleet are there to have fun, if they want something strictly pvp and being number one, then there are fleets for them (for example, GoD = Glory or Death which has blown my healer tank into oblivion more than once. The reason I like them is they do that as klings and they do that as feds... and there doesn't seem to be a biased as to their targets in pvp. Much respect for them).
  • -relaxed rank system = promotions and ranks aren't base on seniority and also aren't taken too seriously (ie "I'm the ruling council, respect me!"... rather promotions are given depending on activity and amicable nature, there is no competition to be 'the 2nd in command, the high council general, etc etc.
  • -goal: our goals aren't to be the 'ruling group' of the Klingon faction, they aren't to be the biggest fleet, they aren't to be the most etc etc. Our goal is to enjoy one another's company, this breeds happy people, which in turn creates happy gaming, which in turn could become something infectious for the faction. How much fun one has depends on themselves, but if one is surrounded by 'loved ones' friends family, then they are more likely to partake in the good attitude. Our goal, simply put, is to have fun without the politics and without the drama. Those that are the opposite of these traits will eventually show themselves out the door. It is their choice to either go quietly or go in a burning flame (the latter of which is easily dealt with with help of a boot button).

That said, the way this is set up is in a very hands-off manner. No micro-managing, no strict monarchy. The best example in regards to being 'hands off' as opposed to 'strictly regimented' is something the US government did a while back. Actually it is only partially true, the majority of the end-story is actually urban legend, but it makes the point.

There was a legal brothel somewhere out west who's license was obtained by the government. Over the course of a few months the government implemented various rules and regulations in regards to the running of the brothel. In the end all the managed to do was run it bankrupt. Seriously how hard is it to make money from something that has been around since the times of the Romans and Greeks and before. I do take this time to apologize to anyone that fines that example offensive, as it was not my intent.

This last one is actually my favorite: The Military Brownie Recipe, a 26 page instructional guide.

Was all that necessary? Not really, but they tried to plan for everything. Too much management trying to nip every little problem possible. That's isn't our style. In comparison, our style of is more like the 4 instructions on the back of a Betty Crocker instant brownie mix.

In short, we're just not worried about it. We'll set the fleet up with everything it needs in regards to items, information, general help, and be hands-off with the rest. The members can take care of themselves and are pretty self-sufficient. If they ever have a question or need something specific they'll ask. Numbers aren't an issue for us.

As for my experiences in regards to groups, it isn't all that important, but they can be found in the Questions & Answers Information Guide just a few posts previous to this. From my own personal experiences I have run into some base examples on how some game servers are run:
1- Rules rules rules micromanaging = Sure every fire is put out before it has the chance to develop, but then again you also prevent growth and barely nothing will develop and the server will die a slow death
2- Must keep players happy, give them everything all the time, must be attentive all the time = the server peaks, then everyone gets bored and it dies suddenly

The third type is somewhere in between, and that's what we'll go for except it would be more transparent. It would embody an old Greek saying "moderation in all things" I prefer moderation in most things, but then again I'm not from ancient greece.

Sorry, it seems I digressed a little, but I'm thinking you understand the comparison. It is somewhat difficult to pull the core question out of someone else's post, but hey I try.

Question 2:
You do bring up an interesting issue and that is what I like to call Toxic Players, which can be quite detrimental to the health of a fleet.

Answer 2: I refer you to a repost from John Tesh's Website

Quote:
Managing Toxic People in Your Life
Here are ways to manage the toxic people in your life...

We’ve all had run-ins with jerks, needy people and takers, toxic people who don’t care about normal social give-and-take. So here’s how to manage the toxic people in your life, courtesy of Dr. Matt Goulston, an FBI hostage negotiation trainer. We got these tips from Bottom Line Personal.
  1. First, let’s deal with the jerk. The magic word that’ll stop them in their tracks is “Huh?” This sends the message that what they’re saying doesn’t make sense, and signals that you’re not going to invest any energy in the conversation. It’s useful when a jerk says something completely ridiculous, but acts like they’re being perfectly reasonable. Like, they insist on splitting the bill 50-50 when their meal was twice as expensive as yours. If that doesn’t do the trick, say something like “I can see how this is good for you. Tell me how it’s good for me.” If they stall or change the subject, say, “Since it’s not clear how this is good for me, I’ll have to say no.”
  2. Needy people! Toxically Needy people expect constant help and attention. They’re like spoiled children who always try to get you to listen to them, but no matter how much you do for them, it’s never enough. So, if you tell a Needy person “no” – say, they want to go hang out at a club half the night, and you want to sleep – because you have work in the morning. You’re going to hear the usual whine: “It’s not fair!” Pause and calmly say “’It’s not fair’ only means, this isn’t what you want.”
  3. The final type of toxic person you need to deal with: Takers. The Taker always asks you for favors but never has the time or energy to pitch in when you need help. So, make a mental list of ways the Taker could help you. The next time they ask for a favor, say “Sure! And can you help me out by....” If they balk, say “I assume you don’t mind doing a favor for me in return, right?” Insist on a quid pro quo every time they ask for a favor, and you’ll either get a lot of chores done or the taker will soon move onto an easier target.
That list doesn't cover all problem players, but it encompasses a good deal.

---

Question 3: Why haven't the fleets in the Klingon Project spoken up?

Answer 3: I recommend to the groups just focus on what's going on in game, continue to have fun, plan the mergers, and let me take the brunt of whatever's coming our way. I had suggested this after the first 'posting incidents' early in our 'fleets/project' thread. Bringing more people from our group into the mix would only create more targets for people who might feel threatened, competitive, or otherwise. That would eventually result in a giant flame war. As the way things currently are, any flames or trolls are easy enough to extinguish since there is only one person dealing with them, and since you can only truly control yourself and not others it is much easier for one person to control themselves (me) and prevent things from getting out of hand.

We are being careful, because it is unfortunately quite obvious that there are people out there that for one reason or another want to see us fail. More than likely they would do anything to make that happen. It is our best interest while we are combining fleets to not reveal those involved until after the process is complete. At which point the names of the groups involved will be listed. It is unfortunate that these silly steps are being taken, however they are deemed necessary for The Klingon Project's own well-being.


I hope I managed to answer your questions well enough, I'll admit it did take a good deal of thought to give you response that might satisfy your post. If you feel I missed something or just wish to continue talking about your post, I refer you to my personal inbox as it is open to the public.

Thanks again,
Tal



PS The other posts in Set 1.0 will be addressed shortly.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 37
09-13-2010, 12:51 AM
1.0 Addressing Thunderbyrd's Post 1 of 2

Well Kudos on your KDFA's progress with players and Cryptic .

Now to site your second post I now realize these aren't questions you have, however I would like to clarify some misconceptions as they might paint those involved in the Klingon Project in a poor light. For the sake of simplicity I'll label your notes as Q and mine as A even though they aren't questions as you say.

Q: One fleet will not work with the amount of players in game.

A: To clarify we are not making one fleet for the whole faction, we're making one fleet for those interested in joining together as one fleet (their reasons might range from like the general idea, their fleet being dead or a ghost fleet, other).


Q: If the group is run by one person then the group will sway towards that person's will.
You say you don't want to control the others, however, whomever will be in charge (you or someone else) can create/enforce rules on all individuals. Not everyone will feel like their voice is being heard.

A: We don't think our group will sway to one person's will. We're not worried. This is cited in my response to your compatriot. Found HERE.


Q: There is no reason for a redundant 'Klingon Project' when a group already founded and running exists.
Creating an inroad that the development team will recognize as legitimate took us a long time to cultivate.

A: But we aren't redundant. We may have similar goals, that being the betterment of the klingon faction and the increased enjoyment of players, however we are different in our methods.
Your Group- Uses a group of representatives to talk to Cryptic.
Our Group- Laid back, if a person wants Cryptic to addressed something, let them. Their voice, in our opinion, is strong enough to talk and Cryptic is attentive enough to listen... and does not require representation through a group of people.
Your Group- Works together via a group of separate fleets.
Our Group- Will work together as one fleet.



I hope I addressed your concerns(?) well enough.
If you have any confusion on my response or would like to pursue it further, my personal inbox is available to you. If I have drawn a misconception about your group in my response, I apologize and you may pursue that issue further via my inbox as well.

Thanks again,
Tal
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 38
09-13-2010, 12:52 AM
1.0 Addressing Fotimor's Post

Unfortunately this post pertains to prior posts that were instigated by this unexpected post
Found Here
that stated incorrect and ill-informed things. That beginning eventually culminated into something inappropriately posted by one of your compatriots and was eventually censored via a moderator.

That being said, furthering the issue would not follow this thread's guidelines and would only open up a can of worms later on. Misunderstandings happen, but it's water under the bridge.

In any case, this is all that is needed as a response to address your post so that we can all move forward from this together.

If you absolutely feel the need to have me further address this, my personal inbox is open to you.

Thanks again,
Tal
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 39
09-13-2010, 12:52 AM
1.0 Addressing Thunderbyrd's Post 2 of 2

Thanks for the tips from your experiences and the well wishes. They are noted, but we are not worried.

Most of your questions are answered HERE. As for the others they aren't necessary to answer. We have our plans, they will and are being implemented, and do not require the approval or critique of those not involved with the project. Just to note admissions are closed as combining 3 fleets is a feat in itself.

We will try and make sure to succeed in regards to the project, and your well wishes are much appreciated.

If for any reason you wish or feel the need to pursue your post further, my personal inbox is open.


Thanks Again,
Tal
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 40
09-13-2010, 01:15 AM
Ok. From the amount of opposing reactions, it seems to me that your little project has failed?

You do however claim that your project is moving forward and that you have supporters and alot of them (at least that is the impression i get from reading your posts).

Now anyone can go ahead and make claims that they have supporters and that they are laying foundations here and there, but:

How can people know it is true? List your supporters (fleets and or (preferably) people) for the opposing force to see.
If you can post a long list, then you will have won your case I think, if you can't... Well... I think you know what will happen then.
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