Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
09-22-2010, 08:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndarielHalo View Post
...But this one simply broke through that plateau due to its tediousness, obliqueness, and dogmatic lack of potential (you either win or you fail and have to start over, no matter what you actually say to the Breen)
Whatever you choose to say to the Breen obviously does matter, you either succeed in the mission, or fail it and have to restart it.

I've never seen any mission in any persistent online multiplayer game where missions aren't of that binary nature, and I doubt you're going to say that you'd prefer failing the mission means you can't ever re-start it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
09-22-2010, 08:08 AM
If that were the case, I'd rather have a failure be an actual FAILING, like with the post-Cure fleet missions, where you fail if you can't save friendly ships fast enough, or the like. Here, you just fail because you arbitrarily, subtly insulted a Breen with a response action that was almost identical in tone and message to the right choice. It may as well have said "You suck" "You're awesome" "You're great" and picking "You're great" will fail you
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
09-22-2010, 08:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndarielHalo View Post
...Here, you just fail because you arbitrarily, subtly insulted a Breen with a response action that was almost identical in tone and message to the right choice. It may as well have said "You suck" "You're awesome" "You're great" and picking "You're great" will fail you
I don't think that's the case at all but I can't at the moment recall the exact lines. In essence, I remember reading the warning my BO gave me, and reading the options very carefully and avoiding any option that sounded to me like it'd make the Breen feel challenged and move the conversation away from the information the Breen seemed quite happy to divulge to me.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
09-22-2010, 08:21 AM
Like I mentioned several times before, it doesn't exactly seem clear WHAT will insult the Breen. The bridge officer's warning essentially is a stereotypical archetype of a species that would apply to Klingons, Kazon, Spartans, Samurai, Romans, Jaguar Warriors, Jem'Hadar, any and every generic "Proud Warrior Race Guy" (TVTropes reference!)


So then exactly how is it insulting to the warrior race guy who shows OPEN DISDAIN FOR HIS SUPERIOR OFFICER to ask him WHY he didn't QUESTION his orders, or why he was killing CIVILIANS? It might be something he'd never think of doing, being Proud Dumb Warrior Race Guy, but if that's honestly insulting, then his life must suck horribly, because he'd get a whole lot of insults thrown at him.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
09-22-2010, 08:34 AM
As MMO Gamer Chick says:
"One of your bridge officers will pop up at some point to remind you to be tactful when interrogating the Breen prisoner, but the right dialogue options are very obvious. Unless you seriously missed the point or are so socially impaired that you can’t see why calling someone a “dishonorable failure” will **** them off, you really can’t screw this up."
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
09-22-2010, 05:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordOfPit View Post
Unless you seriously missed the point or are so socially impaired that you can’t see why calling someone a “dishonorable failure” will **** them off,
This seems spot-on. I got this mission right the first time. OP is just sore he had to repeat it and couldn't solve everything with his phaser. Compared to the Vulcan diplo mission and some of the First Contact ones, this was cake.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
09-22-2010, 05:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by P.R.O.P.H.E.T.
This seems spot-on. I got this mission right the first time. OP is just sore he had to repeat it and couldn't solve everything with his phaser. Compared to the Vulcan diplo mission and some of the First Contact ones, this was cake.

Like I mentioned several times before, it doesn't exactly seem clear WHAT will insult the Breen. The bridge officer's warning essentially is a stereotypical archetype of a species that would apply to Klingons, Kazon, Spartans, Samurai, Romans, Jaguar Warriors, Jem'Hadar, any and every generic "Proud Warrior Race Guy" (TVTropes reference!)


So then exactly how is it insulting to the warrior race guy who shows OPEN DISDAIN FOR HIS SUPERIOR OFFICER to ask him WHY he didn't QUESTION his orders, or why he was killing CIVILIANS? It might be something he'd never think of doing, being Proud Dumb Warrior Race Guy, but if that's honestly insulting, then his life must suck horribly, because he'd get a whole lot of insults thrown at him.

Here, you just fail because you arbitrarily, subtly insulted a Breen with a response action that was almost identical in tone and message to the right choice. It may as well have said "You suck" "You're awesome" "You're great" and picking "You're great" will fail you
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
09-22-2010, 06:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AndarielHalo View Post
Like I mentioned several times before, it doesn't exactly seem clear WHAT will insult the Breen.
Two things will insult the Breen, if you directly mock him, for example: "Your failure is well deserved", or if you directly challenge the validity of his actions. The whole idea is to dance around the issue and cause the Breen to little by little tell you what happened. That's why I started slow with "What's your story?" and lead on to an even subtler question like "What information could the Breen be seeking from a Deferi civilian ship?" see?

Some of us figured it out right away and although once memorized the mission is easy to complete in a few minutes, the first time around, the dialogs are subtle enough to confuse people who are probably used to solving things with Phasers and Bat'leths
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
09-22-2010, 06:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordOfPit View Post
the dialogs are subtle enough to confuse people who are probably used to solving things with Phasers and Bat'leths


You insult me. Behaving like a smug jackass isn't helping anything or getting your point across.


Like I mentioned several times before, it doesn't exactly seem clear WHAT will insult the Breen. The bridge officer's warning essentially is a stereotypical archetype of a species that would apply to Klingons, Kazon, Spartans, Samurai, Romans, Jaguar Warriors, Jem'Hadar, any and every generic "Proud Warrior Race Guy" (TVTropes reference!)


So then exactly how is it insulting to the warrior race guy who shows OPEN DISDAIN FOR HIS SUPERIOR OFFICER to ask him WHY he didn't QUESTION his orders, or why he was killing CIVILIANS? It might be something he'd never think of doing, being Proud Dumb Warrior Race Guy, but if that's honestly insulting, then his life must suck horribly, because he'd get a whole lot of insults thrown at him.

Here, you just fail because you arbitrarily, subtly insulted a Breen with a response action that was almost identical in tone and message to the right choice. It may as well have said "You suck" "You're awesome" "You're great" and picking "You're great" will fail you
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
09-22-2010, 07:38 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by phlyto View Post
I take it you didn't do any of the other diplomacy missions, then? This one was actually less annoying than the other ones. All you had to do was pick the most neutral option.

It's not like you had to run all around Vulcan a half dozen times because you picked the more blunt approach.
THAT mission made me very sympathetic to Nero. I kept hoping he would show up and blow up Vulcan,putting an end to my misery!
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