Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21 P.S.
09-29-2010, 05:29 PM
Reactionary - Knee jerk reactions are bad.
Poorly thought out - Potential consequences are worse than the problem that inspired this idea.
Exaggerated - The occurrence of this is limited and the need is over stated.
Pointless - Literally. If one side does nothing the entire match no one gets anywhere, ever.
Grief - One teams scores a win and disappears to wait it out.
Defense v Defense - Tanking to outlast the clock is a valid tactic but shouldn't be the ultimate way to win an arena.

I see where you are coming from. When I first started I was worried a lot about Klinks hiding, taking too long to start fighting just like this. It just never came to be the wide spread issue I was worried about back then. I don't like it because it's an artificial way to end the match that isn't needed.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
09-29-2010, 05:46 PM
I see your point, and its very true I said aswell that having a timer could mean that someone could get a kill then camp it out untill the timer ran out but @Cursix posted a cool idea to combat that. Balancing issues is always a pain and is always gonna favour one faction this is why I made this post to see peoples Idea's.

Yes I was a bit miffed about the match and wanted to see other peoples comments and views on the matter I didn't want to weight the topic to heavily at the start so kept it nice and brief and then as it progressed more info would come out.

After @Arizhel posted here we had a nice chat online and had a cool discussion about it and done some pvp whereeee I died alot and he died... well once... I think, lol (bet he'll come back and say "No Riamu, I never died you had to earn the right to kill me" lol

back to the idea's a time system with some score balancing might work and some revels could work, maybe...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
09-29-2010, 06:16 PM
The flaw in the timmed decloak ideas is this....

Why should a cloaker be punished for his opponants lack of knowladge in regards to the game. EVERY ship in the game has the ability to decloak a target.

Klingons in general pay for cloak with reduced stats in regards to hull and shield HP. Why whould our one advantage (cloak) be nullified because a fed team refuses to use the Multiple tools the devs have already given them to combat cloak.

Now if you where to perhaps suggest map removal after say 20 min of no damage or healing... and a replacement player added from the que... I would imagine this would possibly be acceptable. Not something I think is needed, however the amount of times such a rule would be invoked would be rare to the extreme.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
09-30-2010, 05:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
Now if you where to perhaps suggest map removal after say 20 min of no damage or healing... and a replacement player added from the que... I would imagine this would possibly be acceptable. Not something I think is needed, however the amount of times such a rule would be invoked would be rare to the extreme.
This seems like a solution for all kind of griefing and AFKing. I like it.

What are the risks and drawbacks? (Except for Griefers and AFKers )
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
09-30-2010, 08:37 AM
in my opinion a time limit on pvp matches is a horrible imagination.
one or two weeks ago i have been in a pug capture & hold match, which took nearly 90minutes.
it was one of the best matches i've ever had. on both teams everyone knew what to do and how to act.
imho it was the perfect match and everyone typed in zone chat, that he really enjoyed it.
a time limit would destroy such a match.

sure, a long match can also be something horrible, but i would suggest, too, just to leave the map in such a case and enter another pvp match, hoping it will be a better & more interesting one.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
09-30-2010, 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
The flaw in the timmed decloak ideas is this....

Why should a cloaker be punished for his opponants lack of knowladge in regards to the game. EVERY ship in the game has the ability to decloak a target.

Klingons in general pay for cloak with reduced stats in regards to hull and shield HP. Why whould our one advantage (cloak) be nullified because a fed team refuses to use the Multiple tools the devs have already given them to combat cloak.

Now if you where to perhaps suggest map removal after say 20 min of no damage or healing... and a replacement player added from the que... I would imagine this would possibly be acceptable. Not something I think is needed, however the amount of times such a rule would be invoked would be rare to the extreme.
My suggestion doesn't aim to punish the cloaker per-say. The idea is when there is no combat for 5 minutes (or longer), start having a small 'ping' on the map to give players an idea where the other players (regardless if cloak or not) are. Sort of like marco polo, except it is done with a bit of randomness and it cannot provide you a pinpoint location nor a target lock.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
09-30-2010, 10:31 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cursix
My suggestion doesn't aim to punish the cloaker per-say. The idea is when there is no combat for 5 minutes (or longer), start having a small 'ping' on the map to give players an idea where the other players (regardless if cloak or not) are. Sort of like marco polo, except it is done with a bit of randomness and it cannot provide you a pinpoint location nor a target lock.
My point is this... you ALL have the capability already to find cloaked ships. Why should your fed ball only have to wait a few min then get to move on mass toward your target. In order to find cloaked ships you need to loosen your fed ball a bit. This can be risky... why should it not be.
The cloak is paid for with hull and shield (a risk)... in order to "pull" a ship out of there main defensive advantage perhaps you should use the tools in game that require you to also loosen your defensive advantage to fully utilize. (just my opinon anyway)

Your idea is far from the worst I have heard... some have suggested mass decloaks which is over the top.

Your suggestion has more merit then those.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
09-30-2010, 10:49 AM
But why does a Fedball have to break up? This is forcing a tactic on the fed side where as my idea does not. Just because the fedball now has an idea where you are, does not mean they will get you as they have to first get to the area noted on the map than engage anti-cloak measures to try and detect you. All the while the you can be moving away as you saw the fedball approach you from 20km away. Of course, this could turn out differently and cause some escorts to break from the fedball to rush to the area where the ping said there is ships.

And why is it that Klingons can't attack a fedball anyways? There is nothing stopping you from approaching the ball at any angle you choose in your group, decloaking and attacking (with de-cloak damage buff) then retreat. And if we are speaking of BoPs having less hull, that is not only to pay for the Battle Cloak, that is for the universal slots they get. And that less hull does not seem to harm the majority of BoPs I go against, they always have several different hull resistant abilities on when they cloak, thus even the HYII I've thrown at or the focus fire from several feds at the same does not take them down.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
09-30-2010, 02:08 PM
I find it funny that they have to make one of our ships drag away so it can get focused by 5 ships on the other side... popping it before it gets a skill off. That is a stupid strategy IMO and any half witted fed would not follow that. I propose a better strategy, Learn to use teamwork and actually fly other ships than the BoP... seriously, that is almost all I see people playing with in PvP on the klink side. I agree with the OP in that a timer has to be implemented in matches. How this will work, I dont know. But something has to change. this hide and cloak nosense is B.S.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
09-30-2010, 02:30 PM
Why does the Fed ball have to break up? Why does the Klink have to decloak? Lots of people are good at finding the cloak ships, on both sides, and that really changes how things play out. If you want to sit in a tight ball and wait for something to happen that's up to you, but if a Klink wants to hang back until that ball unravels that's up to them.

I don't think that anyone is claiming that the Feds should go back to randomly flying around the map, that truly would be stupid and suicidal. But loosening the ball can bait a trigger happy BoP () and a well placed sensor scan or CPB (just for example) can put you on the offensive very quickly. It's like was said earlier, the cloaked ships, baring a bad respawn, are NEVER very far away from the ball, even if they aren't shooting at that moment. Don't like waiting? Find them.

This bit complaining about Hide and Seek is garbage though. You can't expect every ship in the game to fly like a cruiser, or worse, that everyone in the game fly a cruiser (we are already pretty close sometimes). I'm all for Hit and Run, whether cloaking is involved or not, regardless of faction. However, I'd venture to say that in the interest of sportsmanship people shouldn't run off for 5 and 10 minutes at a time but that's been rare in my own personal PuG experience. If you don't like that someone who has lower shields and hull can pop in and out of a fight then stop them from doing it. Besides, a time limit certainly isn't going to stop that and might just make it worse.
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