Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Lower Level Retrofits?
10-15-2010, 02:00 PM
I've seen a number of players using the Excelsior at Commander level. On Tribble there was a Commander level version of the Nebula as well.

But how do I get access to these at Commander in the regular game? The C-Store descriptions only talks about the RA version, which I know you can also get at VA with the ship requisition. But what about the Commander version? Do I have to buy the Admiral version before the Commander version becomes available to my lower level captains?

I don't get it. Where are these ships?


Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
10-15-2010, 02:10 PM
The T3 Excelsior and Nebula can be purchased from the Shipyard store for Energy Credits. I think they're 135k each.

Edit: Just for those who don't know, the T5 Excelsior and Nebula refits can be gotten at RA. Only the Galaxy, Intrepid, and Defiant refits require you to be VA.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
10-15-2010, 02:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic_One View Post
The T3 Excelsior and Nebula can be purchased from the Shipyard store for Energy Credits. I think they're 135k each.

Edit: Just for those who don't know, the T5 Excelsior and Nebula refits can be gotten at RA. Only the Galaxy, Intrepid, and Defiant refits require you to be VA.
Oh, that explains it. I was thinking that it would be available for the Requisition slip, like the other ships are. I guess I have some saving to do.

And can they be gotten for the Ship Requisiion slip, or do you have to pay in Energy Credits like the lower level versions?


Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
10-15-2010, 02:45 PM
The T3s can only be gotten via energy credits. The T5 Nebula can be purchased for Marks of Exploration or through the c-store. The T5 Excelsior is only available through the c-store - though they might make it purchasable for Marks later. The ship tokens don't work for eitherT3 or T5 ships.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
10-15-2010, 02:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic_One View Post
The T3s can only be gotten via energy credits. The T5 Nebula can be purchased for Marks of Exploration or through the c-store. The T5 Excelsior is only available through the c-store - though they might make it purchasable for Marks later. The ship tokens don't work for eitherT3 or T5 ships.
That kinda sucks.

I have to waste my Requisition on a ship I don't even want and then pay for the one that I do. I hope they fix that. It seems unfair to me.

Thanks, Cosmic.


Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
10-15-2010, 02:52 PM
Take a T3 you don't want. Strip it down and sell off the gear. Use some of that money to help pay for the T3 Neb or Excelsior. It's not a big help but it's a few thousand free energy credits.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
10-15-2010, 03:10 PM
The retrofit is starting to get rather dumb. If Cryptic's STO team is hellbent on making every ship of every tier capable of being played at Tier 5... what was the point of level banding them and keeping thier abilities that limited then? It just smacks of bad design to me.

The Captain-tier ships already have to cope with the silly idea that they become temporarily inaccessible to thier captains during the Rear Admiral levels until the Vice-Admiral tier is reached. Meanwhile, the Galaxy Dreadnought, and excelsior appear to be working on another standard. They've tweaked their ships around, but not much of it even makes sense.

Following the same idea, there's no tangible reason why a player could not decide to grab his Miranda-class light cruiser and have it be viable at Tier 2, 3, 4 and 5. Why would it be just Tier 1 and Tier 5? Why could they not tweak the vessels - much like how the higher-level enemies operate even in smaller vessels - to be viable at higher level anyways? Heck, it's going to be the same deal with the Akira. Available at Tier 3 and 5, but not through the 4th... and it requires the player to actually change ships from Commander-tier Akira to Admiral-tier?

Giant lack of implementation foresight there. Especially considering how combat is mostly a DPS game, where the Akira is going to be expected to perform as well as the Sovereign, even though the Sovereign is the superior battleship between the two. STO brings along little concerns regarding recon, situational awareness, outmaneuvering and others which deprive the smaller vessels, scouts and science vessels with more credible ways to compete in battle aside from just PEW PEW PEW.

If a smaller cruiser like an Excalibur-class could venture out ahead at a significantly higher impulse/full-impulse speed than a sovereign could manage, while perhaps acting as the center support of a scout flottila of ships, or with the cargo room to pre-emptively deploy a minefield, the ship could retain a credible combat role in endgame PvP while not being the same powerhouse a Sovereign is.

Sorry, I ranted. It's just frustrating to see so much potential being untapped, simply due to an apparent lack of foresight due to adherence to level advancement mechanics which quickly become irrelevant as everyone reaches endgame fairly quickly.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
10-15-2010, 03:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoberraz View Post
The retrofit is starting to get rather dumb. If Cryptic's STO team is hellbent on making every ship of every tier capable of being played at Tier 5... what was the point of level banding them and keeping thier abilities that limited then? It just smacks of bad design to me.
The original intent was not to have all these refits. They came about because the fans demanded a way to keep playing their lower-tier ships. The system was put in place to fulfill the wishes of the fanbase.

Also, each ship was supposed to be out-leveled as you advance in your career; just as you see in canon. Only in Abrams-verse does Kirk go from being Cadet to Captain in 2 days. The need to please the fanbased caused the change, not lack of forethought.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
10-15-2010, 03:30 PM
You'd think, only Cryptic's people might also have in the first place made the game so that once you earned access to a ship, it would progress through the levels and remain a viable choice at endgame. It's not like they had not made claims that a Miranda would be 50% as powerful as a same-level Sovereign. Has that ever been the case? Hell no.

Fanbase feedback happened because they dropped the ball on that one, and the fix they're making is hardly more intuitive than a stopgap solution to the main problem - lack of scaling considerations across the board, or ways to apply roles to ship that would make the lighter ones useful in combat by other means than DPS.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
10-15-2010, 03:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoberraz View Post
You'd think, only Cryptic's people might also have in the first place made the game so that once you earned access to a ship, it would progress through the levels and remain a viable choice at endgame.
Again, that's not how it works in the IP. Kirk served on the Republic, Farragut, and finally the Enterprise. Riker served on the Pegasus, Potempkin, Hood, Enterprise, and Titan. It was assumed fans would want a similar progression of ships as they advanced. It's not short-sightedness. It's simply a design decision to emulate the IP.
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