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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
I’ve been sitting on this idea for a while, mainly figuring it is a good idea but not likely to be added to the game. However, the few times I bring it up, people seem to like the idea, and I figure it is about time I let it meet some true scrutiny.

Below is an open world PvP system which I believe borrows the best from Pirates of the Burning Sea that adds a unique flare to gameplay when placed into the STO structure. Let us discuss the idea:
Background: Pirates of the Burning Sea Influence and Port Control.

As not all STO players may be familiar with the Influence and Port Control PvP aspect of Pirates of the Burning Sea (PotBS) I will briefly explain. The game is set up in ‘rounds’ with ports belonging to each of the five factions. In game, we call this phase, when everything is default, the ‘map.’ A faction may then begin to attack shipping, blockading, etc outside another factions port in an attempt to ‘flip’ the port. This results in a red circle be applied to the map around the port. This circle denotes open Pirate PvP which means anyone of the pirate faction can be attacked openly, or pirates can attack openly. (Privateers are able to as well.) With continued effort, you make the red circle larger, with a darker circle on the inside, which is true open PvP, and the area is in contention. From there, a port battle will be ‘scheduled’ for a certain time and the fate of the port will shift. For each port taken, and length it is held, a faction gains influence points, once they hit X number of points, that faction wins, and the map flips, IE returns to the default set up, with a grace period to allow all sides to rebuild.

Star Trek Online: Influence Control

First, sector space would need to be physically larger, at least in the contested neutral zones, basically any sector which has red and blue on the map. The war should be over the neutral zone as that is what all the in game lore sells. Granalda station should be moved to a similar but opposite position as K7 as well. (Reason will be mentioned later.) I would also recommend combining all Klingon/Federation border regions into one giant neutral zone.

Now, we have our new sector neutral zone. Each planet in it can be contested: Exception, Drazana, K7, and Granalda. Each planet is assigned an array of resources they produce, and leaving those systems are NPC transports assigned to X faction. A player of opposing faction may choose to attack these freighters, but doing so puts out a general distress call in the area, allowing the freighters faction to respond and help. If the attacking for wins, they gain access to the cargo of the ship, and the planet begins to shift towards open hostility/contention.

If we say 1000 points are required for a planet to flip into contention, at about 200 points, the planet would shift into conflicted status, and raiders can openly attack each other near the planet, or other non-raider ships. Raiders are defined as escorts, raptors, and birds of prey. Each defeat of a ship sends the contention counter up or down depending on who is killed/surrendered. Once the planet hits 500 points, it is open season and all ships can only engage in PvP in the influence sphere around the planet. At 750, am assault is locked in and scheduled 12-20 hours from the point of when it hits 750, or the nearest prime time +/- 2 hours to that time range. From that point, 250 points are earnable by both sides. The more points each side gets, the more advantages they will have when the assault begins. Things like extra NPCs, extra defenses, so on so forth.

Assaults should be limited to 20-30 players on each side, with a pre-mission briefing phase to discuss attack plans, and nominate the ground leaders.

Once the assault begins, it will start in space, where the objective is to remove defensive emplacements that would hinder a ground assault. Things like orbital point defense that would shoot down shuttles, and shields. Once the defenses are down, the attacking fleet must launch and defend shuttles with invasion forces on them. The amount of shuttles they have is dependent on the amount of points they have going into the assault. Once all shuttles have been deployed and landed or been destroyed. The assault moves into ground combat. If no shuttle makes it to the surface, no ground battle happens.

The ground battle will begin on a large urban map or the ‘planets capital’ the number of assaulting NPCs will be determined by the number of shuttles that landed. Ground NPCs are divided into four groups, with each group being led by a player, who was selected in a pre assault ‘briefing.’ These four players will direct the target areas of assault, by the NPC units. If all capture points are taken by the attacking force, the battle is over, and for 24 hours the planet is being occupied. Occupation means no resource generation for those 24 hours. After which, a three day period will begin in which the planet can not be flipped again. After those three days it is open again. If the defending side wins by defeating all players or NPCs, or by holding onto at least one defense point for a certain amount of time. The planet will skip the occupied stage, and the three day grace period will begin.

Now, the challenge is to make assaulting the planets something to get players involved in, and also to make fighting in space exhilarating and risky. With this, we come to those new resources I mentioned. These resources can be converted into specialized equipment that can be equipped onto Starships. If a starship is destroyed, they lose all of this equipment, however if they just surrender and are allowed to limp home, they get to keep the equipment. Defeat, rather it be destruction or surrender, will always result in a critical wound applied to the ship. Defeat will result in all critical wounds being applied, and you will ‘respawn’ back at the capital of your faction, and be unable to enter PvP for 1 hour. Furthermore, any resources you have purchased or looted can be removed from your cargo bay if you are defeated.

Effects on PvE:
To avoid dragging in players who have no desire to be involved in this type of play at all, there is an opt out, which is on by default. These players can fly through red zones unmolested, however they are unable to purchase, or even have in their inventory, resources, or the crafted equipment mentioned above. In order to gain access to that stuff, they have to flag, they do not have to participate in PvP though, they just need to be careful in the red, or avoid it, if they do not want to. Missions will go unchanged regardless of who holds the planet, which only makes since in the neutral zone as most of the Fed missions do not depend on the planet being a fed planet.

The New Equipment and Resources
The new equipment, and resources should be game changing. The equipment should make a noticeable difference to a ship it is equipped on. Below is some examples meant to illustrate this. At the same time, the equipment needs to depend heavily on resources obtained from the planets in the neutral zone, and be expensive. It is something you should mind losing.

There will be a resource market on Drazana, K7, Qo’nos, and Earth. The Drazana and K7 markets will have all resources your faction has access to at 25% markup. For each additional planet your side holds with the same resource, 2% is knocked off that price, but can not drop below 0%. Qo’nos, and Earth, which can never end up in the red, have a 50% mark up, which can be reduced up to 25%. The cheapest way to buy resources is directly from the planet that produces it, but this could also be the most risky.

If your faction does not have access to a resource, you may buy it from Drazana at a flat 75% markup.

The new equipment would have its own slot on ships, and cruisers/carriers would have the most slots, while birds of prey the fewest, and everyone else somewhere in between. The number of slots between cruisers should vary, Assault and Star Cruisers should have the most, with the Excelsior, and Galaxy Refit slightly less than the assault and star cruisers. Same applies for science and escorts as well, and will apply to Klingon retrofits, however the Gorn, Nausicaan, and Orion ships should be on par with their standard brethren.

Production of this equipment can only occur on an ‘industrial’ world, Memory Alpha, Earth, Qo’nos, another Klingon planet, and then several spread throughout the new neutral zone. Equipment will cost 25% more to produce outside of the neutral zone.

At the same time to cost, an individual would only be able to 'produce' a certain number of tier 4, 3, and 2 devices a week... unlimited tier 1. (Something like tier 4=1, 3=3, 2=5, 1=unlimited.)

Tier 4 would be extremely expensive, and would have a major effect. By extremely expensive, I mean they have fleets in mind when being produced. Tier 3 would be expensive, but possible for a solo player grinding a lot, tier 2 is high end for the solo gamer, and basic level stuff for a fleet, and tier 1 is easy as pie to get. Each device would be unique per ship, IE you can only equip one of each on a ship.

Examples of what I have in mind:

Enhanced Warp Corp: Tier 4: Provides +15 to all power settings, acts like an EPS Flow Regulator as well. 25% shield regeneration rate. Cost 4,000,000,000 EC plus resource cost.

Advanced Warp Corp: Tier 3: Provides +10 to all power settings. Cost: 12,000,000 plus resource cost.

Overpowered Warp Corp: Tier 2: Provides +10 to all power settings, hull damage resistance is reduced 10% to simulate the overloading conduits. Cost: 900,000 plus resource cost

Upgraded Warp Core: Tier 1: Provides +2 to all power settings. 400,000 ec plus resource cost.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2 Seconded
10-18-2010, 11:32 AM
Greetings,

Razor Fleet supports this and the other threads for some sort of Open World PvP system.
PotBS has a fine one, as does EVE. The ideas, working and theoretical are out there.
I would like to strongly reiterate to the devs that we want this to happen and soon.

Yours in 'The Way' Plasma,
Star*Dagger
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
10-18-2010, 04:54 PM
well done. this deserves more eyes than it will get.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
10-18-2010, 04:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClingingMars View Post
well done. this deserves more eyes than it will get.
I totally agree.

It's a shame because I see so many fantastic ideas from players on a variety of subjects, but they get no play because they are properly posted in the correct forum, instead of being posted in the General Discussion.

And you never have any idea if the devs even saw the ideas, or if it got buried so quickly, or became so old, that they simply didn't look at it or they considered it a bad idea because it got no love from the rest of the forums.

These are some great ideas OP, and I hope others get a chance to read this as well.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
10-18-2010, 05:46 PM
Smells like EVE Online.

Gief!!!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
10-18-2010, 05:47 PM
Make it so!!!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
10-18-2010, 06:06 PM
This is, quite frankly, a spectacular suggestion. I generally hate PvP--especially the current system. I play PvE a lot, because I enjoy the story, and avoid PvP at all costs.

A system like this one--where there are clear objectives, benefits, and drawbacks to success and failure beyond "I blew you up, and got some points" makes me want to engage in PvP. A system like this would definitely be worth playing.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
10-19-2010, 09:26 AM
Finally got around to reading this whole thing. Fantastic ideas!

Some things to consider:

A large part of your plan relies on player cooperation. This is good, in that it would help foster a better community and bring players together, and generally improve PvP team work; but bad, in that it might never happen. For instance, how would the four ground leaders be chosen? With lots of arguing and epeen waving, if they ever got chosen at all.

Unfortunately, not everyone would be like kkragenbrink, and move to PvP because of a super awesome system in place. There would still exist many that avoid PvP, and they would want items at or near equivalent power levels. Whether or not you/we think they should get them, the developers would probably want a way to get something similar into the PvE reward scheme.

The same applies to crafters, who would be jealous that a really cool crafting system is available only through PvP.

I like the idea of new slots in the ships, especially a warp core slot. But 4 billion EC, really? Thank goodness this idea is still a work in progress :p

Anyways, lots of good stuff here, let's keep this thread active, maybe something like it will pop up sometime!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
10-19-2010, 09:47 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Felderburg View Post
Finally got around to reading this whole thing. Fantastic ideas!

Some things to consider:

A large part of your plan relies on player cooperation. This is good, in that it would help foster a better community and bring players together, and generally improve PvP team work; but bad, in that it might never happen. For instance, how would the four ground leaders be chosen? With lots of arguing and epeen waving, if they ever got chosen at all.

Unfortunately, not everyone would be like kkragenbrink, and move to PvP because of a super awesome system in place. There would still exist many that avoid PvP, and they would want items at or near equivalent power levels. Whether or not you/we think they should get them, the developers would probably want a way to get something similar into the PvE reward scheme.

The same applies to crafters, who would be jealous that a really cool crafting system is available only through PvP.

I like the idea of new slots in the ships, especially a warp core slot. But 4 billion EC, really? Thank goodness this idea is still a work in progress :p

Anyways, lots of good stuff here, let's keep this thread active, maybe something like it will pop up sometime!
Couple of notes in response:

The new items are available for those who do not PvP. They have to flag for PvP yes, but since PvP can only take place in a 'red' zone it is a matter of avoiding the red zone. Those items are meant to be rewards for taking risks. If they don't flag for PvP there gameplay as it is now does not change at all.

Crafting, again the crafters do not need to be involved in PvP, merely flagged. They can obtain the resources from K7, Ganalda, Drazana, Earth and Qo'noS, or the individual planets which will not always be red. Or they can be the fleet crafter, after all only one tier 4 per week per player, a fleet will want a lot of competent crafters, who uses the fleet communal resources to make the item.

As for the high price... the 4 billion is not even including the resource costs, it is meant to be prohibitive for the individual player. Tier 4 and Tier 3 equipment are really meant for fleets to produce. Tier 1 and 2 are something an individual player can make. A lot of the system as fleets in mind, as well as faction organization.

As for the ground leaders, I see your point, harking back to my experience in PotBS we never had much argument over who was 1st leader, 2nd leader if first was spiked out, etc... of course I was in one of the less populated nations and it was normally the same 20 or so people each time so we worked together well. If the ground leaders are not chosen by the end of the briefing period, they will be chosen randomly. The entire point of them is to have the NPCs there so it feels like a massive invasion, but not them just running around willy nilly, but actually with some tactical direction. As I envision the ground leaders staring at a map most of the time, telling ground troops where to go I figure that would not be a position for the 'blank' waving crowd.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
10-19-2010, 12:35 PM
Maybe you could reward those people who perform the best in the space portion by allowing them to take BOs down to the planet. The number of people who get to take BOs is determined by how many shuttles make it. The lowest performers in space get to take one redshirt, the best get to take 4 BOs.




As far as "flagging" goes, it seems that someone who flags, but doesn't actually PvP, still gets the same stuff, but for a much higher EC cost? And with no chance for it dropping/looting it from freighters/whatever? I guess that's a good way to handle it, but it still seems like there's reward for no risk. Sure, it's a more expensive reward, but... I don't know. I'm on the fence for that idea.




Another thing, just to clarify: this isn't "open" PvP, correct? Everything is instanced or limited to a specific area?

What I'm seeing is this: the freighters leaving are more like current DSEs, you go up to them and jump 'em. This creates an instance that anyone can enter, which is a goal oriented escort ships/stop the escort PvP map. I would suggest that this be open a pretty good while, or if it is short, make it count for only a few points, since it would be easy for someone to get on in the dead of night and kill freighters while the enemy faction was sleeping. There should also be some defensive versions, with NPC attackers - the defenders shouldn't have to wait for a PC attacker to open an instance to be able to shift the counter their way.


Following a certain amount of these freighter attacks, escorts, raptors, and BoPs can attack anyone near the planet. I assume this would happen in concert with a HUGE pop up warning, saying "You are entering a disputed system, warning, danger Will Rikerson" etc., and the pop up would occur a good distance away, to allow time to stop.

I also assume a new instance would open when a raider attacks. Would this instance be only the raider and its victim? What if either of them is on a team? Would it be an open instance, with a glowing DSE cloud, that anyone could enter? Would just be a free for all, one kill wins, or would it be an arena style PvP match?

This is certainly an interesting idea, and it does fit within the "canon" role of ships, but perhaps it gives too much influence to one style of ship? Again, on the fence on that particular point. Perhaps you should jump right away to the open PvP?


After that, there's assault prep, in which the faction with the most kills during the final stage of limited area open PvP gets more NPCs, and then the assault itself, which I think you've outlined pretty well.



Final points: add a neutral zone pop up, which lists all the systems, their resources, and their status of contention. Also, the "surrender" mechanic would have to be added in the game. How would it work?
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