Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Hard To Port!
11-17-2010, 05:00 PM
So, when I jump off the upper deck of ESD, I injure myself. (though not enough, truthfully) Yet, when going full speed with my ship and I collide with another ship, asteroid, or ESD... nothing happens. How can my captain collide with ESD at 50m/s and injure himself yet my ship collide at 5,000,000 m/s and not cause a scratch?

Is there a reason the ships don't register collision damage? Is there a chance to see this in the future? For Season 4 or Season 5 maybe?

I just think it would add an interesting dynamic to the game and would make PvP entertaining...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
11-17-2010, 05:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
So, when I jump off the upper deck of ESD, I injure myself. (though not enough, truthfully) Yet, when going full speed with my ship and I collide with another ship, asteroid, or ESD... nothing happens. How can my captain collide with ESD at 50m/s and injure himself yet my ship collide at 5,000,000 m/s and not cause a scratch?

Is there a reason the ships don't register collision damage? Is there a chance to see this in the future? For Season 4 or Season 5 maybe?

I just think it would add an interesting dynamic to the game and would make PvP entertaining...
Well the main reason for this is it could get annoying and also somewhat abuse happy. For the way more maneuverable ships sure it would be fun to be dodging things all the time, but as a carrier pilot I can say that running into every little thing and taking damage would be annoying. Not to mention that a carrier wouldn't even be taking that much damage from it.

Also it could be a bit abuse happy in PvP with people activating a ton of engine abilities in a big ship and just exploding through the little ones. Logically it works, a carrier with full shields would pound through an escort and shear it in half. Not to mention flying around in an asteroid field in a carrier would be devastating,

What I do propose is more things like nebula that give buffs/debuffs or spacial anomalies that deal damage. Those could be much more easily avoided or at the very least powered through with full speed.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
11-17-2010, 05:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr.LoveMonkey
Well the main reason for this is it could get annoying and also somewhat abuse happy. For the way more maneuverable ships sure it would be fun to be dodging things all the time, but as a carrier pilot I can say that running into every little thing and taking damage would be annoying. Not to mention that a carrier wouldn't even be taking that much damage from it.

Also it could be a bit abuse happy in PvP with people activating a ton of engine abilities in a big ship and just exploding through the little ones. Logically it works, a carrier with full shields would pound through an escort and shear it in half. Not to mention flying around in an asteroid field in a carrier would be devastating,

What I do propose is more things like nebula that give buffs/debuffs or spacial anomalies that deal damage. Those could be much more easily avoided or at the very least powered through with full speed.
Well, I'm not talking Enterprise vs Scimitar type damage. I'm just talking about a 5% damage hit if going at top speed (or hit by someone going at top speed) and having it scale down based on speed (so hitting ESD at half impulse would amount to 2% damage). So even if you are hit by a larger ship, your damage is 5% of YOUR health while they get a damage hit of 5% of THIER health. But they could finally make that "Ramming Speed" matter. Hit your target and deal 10% damage. Odds are you would destroy your ship, but you would deal some decent damage to theirs too.

As for dodging things, most of us do that now out of habit anyway. So it's not like that would be any different.

It was just a thought.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
11-17-2010, 05:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
Well, I'm not talking Enterprise vs Scimitar type damage. I'm just talking about a 5% damage hit if going at top speed (or hit by someone going at top speed) and having it scale down based on speed (so hitting ESD at half impulse would amount to 2% damage). So even if you are hit by a larger ship, your damage is 5% of YOUR health while they get a damage hit of 5% of THIER health. But they could finally make that "Ramming Speed" matter. Hit your target and deal 10% damage. Odds are you would destroy your ship, but you would deal some decent damage to theirs too.

As for dodging things, most of us do that now out of habit anyway. So it's not like that would be any different.

It was just a thought.
I agree that it would be really cool, and if the damage was kept low enough not to matter then I'd be okay with it, but my ship of choice turns 4 degrees per second...it could just get annoying for me that's all. If it was implemented very carefully then I'd be for it, but there are a lot of other things I'd personally like to see first.

Keep thinking up ideas though! Stuff like this is great!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
11-17-2010, 05:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
So, when I jump off the upper deck of ESD, I injure myself. (though not enough, truthfully) Yet, when going full speed with my ship and I collide with another ship, asteroid, or ESD... nothing happens. How can my captain collide with ESD at 50m/s and injure himself yet my ship collide at 5,000,000 m/s and not cause a scratch?

Is there a reason the ships don't register collision damage? Is there a chance to see this in the future? For Season 4 or Season 5 maybe?

I just think it would add an interesting dynamic to the game and would make PvP entertaining...
the deflector dish, and shields are responsible for collision avoidance in space. They act as a buffer between the ship and the object. What i'm not very happy about, is when two ships are close enough to each other that their shields touch. They should repel each other, however, i'm able to get right up to my opponent, whip around him within their shields, scarping their hull, and even collide with them. The only time, that I should be able to pull something like this off, is when their shields are down we are moving at high speed.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
11-17-2010, 06:15 PM
we had ship collision damage on during early alpha and it was more frustrating than fun. Some will claim it adds more realism... sure... but its not fun and it was decided we would not use it. When we need to use it as a game mechanic to make a story more interesting we can utilize this for flavor, but to just turn it on wholesale was decidedly not a good idea (not to mention caused some griefing)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
11-17-2010, 06:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstahl View Post
we had ship collision damage on during early alpha and it was more frustrating than fun. Some will claim it adds more realism... sure... but its not fun and it was decided we would not use it. When we need to use it as a game mechanic to make a story more interesting we can utilize this for flavor, but to just turn it on wholesale was decidedly not a good idea (not to mention caused some griefing)
I remember the days when Self Destruct was just a click without needing to be damaged first. High-level ships were blowing up the lowbies and newbies left and right, just for fun.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
11-17-2010, 06:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstahl View Post
we had ship collision damage on during early alpha and it was more frustrating than fun. Some will claim it adds more realism... sure... but its not fun and it was decided we would not use it. When we need to use it as a game mechanic to make a story more interesting we can utilize this for flavor, but to just turn it on wholesale was decidedly not a good idea (not to mention caused some griefing)
Fair enough. I'll take your word for it. If the mechanic is still there, I'd love to see it used in missions more often.

A cool piloting daily could be piloting your ship through an asteroid field through a set of rings (as introduced last week) and you are awarded based on the amount of damage sustained (the less damage, the better the reward).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
11-17-2010, 07:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dstahl View Post
we had ship collision damage on during early alpha and it was more frustrating than fun. Some will claim it adds more realism... sure... but its not fun and it was decided we would not use it. When we need to use it as a game mechanic to make a story more interesting we can utilize this for flavor, but to just turn it on wholesale was decidedly not a good idea (not to mention caused some griefing)
I've always found that a weak argument.

Ship death is trivial in STO. I don't see how the frustration coming from there would end up being so dramatic when you end up knowing that colliding with stuff kills you, and that having some situational awareness and giving a damn about the environments would eventually settle those things.

The ramming mechanic could intuitively be worked into this. People would ram into other ships either when they did not pay attention (why are you playing and not paying attention?). When you want to ram a ship, you just go and collide into him rather than need a higher-level captain power. People not wanting to be ramming will just get out of the way. Near collisions will happen on occasion, but shields will blunt those and people will start to care about watching how the drive around.

I fail to see why this worked okay in multiplayer Bridge Commander and not in STO. I'm persuaded that if it had been left on, people would've eventually gotten used to it and helmed their ships consequently.

Griefers? Sure, it happens. But then, why aren't you just trying to steer clear after the first ship death? Dying means nothing! Shrug it off and move on. Especially considering the existence of falling damage and how it's non-fatal. An easy way to avoid griefing is to allow ship collisions, but not render it fatal unless the 'ramming speed' power is triggered/toggled.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
11-17-2010, 07:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoberraz View Post
I've always found that a weak argument.

Ship death is trivial in STO. I don't see how the frustration coming from there would end up being so dramatic when you end up knowing that colliding with stuff kills you, and that having some situational awareness and giving a damn about the environments would eventually settle those things.

The ramming mechanic could intuitively be worked into this. People would ram into other ships either when they did not pay attention (why are you playing and not paying attention?). When you want to ram a ship, you just go and collide into him rather than need a higher-level captain power. People not wanting to be ramming will just get out of the way. Near collisions will happen on occasion, but shields will blunt those and people will start to care about watching how the drive around.

I fail to see why this worked okay in multiplayer Bridge Commander and not in STO. I'm persuaded that if it had been left on, people would've eventually gotten used to it and helmed their ships consequently.

Griefers? Sure, it happens. But then, why aren't you just trying to steer clear after the first ship death? Dying means nothing! Shrug it off and move on. Especially considering the existence of falling damage and how it's non-fatal. An easy way to avoid griefing is to allow ship collisions, but not render it fatal unless the 'ramming speed' power is triggered/toggled.
Since we can rotate the camera to face our enemy (and fly in another direction), I could see a huge problem with trying to keep a lock while firing rear torpedoes and "bam!" you hit an asteroid, die, and your team wipes while you race back to where you hit an asteroid.
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