Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
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# 11
11-15-2010, 06:59 AM
STO Klingons act more like Romulans than like Klinongs but that's the way ppl want them now... devs and players.
So ppl devaluate code of honor not characters
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# 12
11-15-2010, 07:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by morfius75 View Post
STO Klingons act more like Romulans than like Klinongs but that's the way ppl want them now... devs and players.
So ppl devaluate code of honor not characters
Were there really any Klingons on the shows who "acted like Klingons"? I don't think there was ever one or that we're meant to believe that Klingons REALLY subscribe to everything they preach.
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# 13
11-15-2010, 07:05 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
Were there really any Klingons on the shows who "acted like Klingons"? I don't think there was ever one or that we're meant to believe that Klingons REALLY subscribe to everything they preach.
I think the Klingons were ruined by writers who had no imagination. When in doubt, turn aliens into space vikings. The Klingons I prefer the most are those from ST:VI. They were dangerous just by looking at them.
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# 14
11-15-2010, 07:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commadore_Bob
I think the Klingons were ruined by writers who had no imagination. When in doubt, turn aliens into space vikings. The Klingons I prefer the most are those from ST:VI. They were dangerous just by looking at them.
Yeah. I liked ST VI Klingons. Chang is probably my favorite Trek villain, aside from Dukat. But, again, not REALLY honorable.
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# 15
11-15-2010, 07:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leviathan99
Yeah. I liked ST VI Klingons. Chang is probably my favorite Trek villain, aside from Dukat. But, again, not REALLY honorable.
But I guess you could say that once the never ending threat of war with the Federation ended, the Klingons lost their way. There was an episode of DS9 of Kor and Koloth saying as much, that the modern Klingons had become a caricature of themselves.
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# 16
11-15-2010, 07:17 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cormoran View Post
Seems a little specist to think that all Klingons act with the exact same belligerance and courage to any given situation, especially when we saw multiple examples of Klingons who didn't live up to that ideal throughout the shows.
Klingons can breed with Humans and produce fertile offspring - how does that make them a separate species?
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# 17
11-15-2010, 09:23 AM
Q'apla!

This is a very good point. Klingon values are a philosophical ideal. They stem largely from a legendary messianic type figure 'Kahless' who embodies all these impossible virtues in the same way 'King Arthur' might be expected to embody the codes of chivalry, only without the associated flaws of character. Actual Klingons must and do fall short of this ideal, just as all people fall short of their idealized virtues and mythological heroes.

That having been said, any Klingon would probably look at a cowering brother with some degree of disdain, and may take the Patton approach to it. This, not just because the 'coward' is falling short of the ideal, but because he is all too uncomfortable a reminder that any Klingon might succumb to such inadequacies, and that reminder forms a sense of inner disgust that people tend to turn outward.

Think of how you feel the next time you see a homeless person on the street, reduced to begging for coins and scraps. Dirty, possibly diseased, in misery. Do you feel compassion and pity? Probably. Do you feel disgust? Possibly. Do you feel fear?

How many missing paychecks separate you from him?

Look away. Shuffle on. Pretend you didn't just see a worst-case-scenario of your own fate.

Perhaps some of you have read Lord Jim? It's a tale that is almost Klingon. A young officer from a nation that prides itself on Honor performs a dishonorable act in a moment of crisis. He spends the rest of his life lamenting his decision, and striving to reclaim the honor he lost. Meanwhile, the tale of his cowardice and dishonor spans the globe amongst the sea-farers from his nation. He is frowned upon and derided as the subject of dinner conversation... And every man that speaks of Jim also feels a touch of discomfort. When push comes to shove, might not they, too, fall short of their honorable ideals?

I highly recommend it.
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# 18
11-15-2010, 09:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SaintAdalberto
Q'apla!

Perhaps some of you have read Lord Jim? It's a tale that is almost Klingon. A young officer from a nation that prides itself on Honor performs a dishonorable act in a moment of crisis. He spends the rest of his life lamenting his decision, and striving to reclaim the honor he lost. Meanwhile, the tale of his cowardice and dishonor spans the globe amongst the sea-farers from his nation. He is frowned upon and derided as the subject of dinner conversation... And every man that speaks of Jim also feels a touch of discomfort. When push comes to shove, might not they, too, fall short of their honorable ideals?

I highly recommend it.
With Sir Peter O'Toole.

Very good points and well done seeing behind the veil and from outside the box.
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# 19
11-15-2010, 10:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by razoreye2005 View Post
Anyone else notice that during the Night of the Comet mission, there was a cowering Klingon offer in the same room next to Cassidy? Surely that would not be the case in the 23rd century!? Klingons were never afraid and certainly this was not a good placement of a NPC character in the game. Come on Cryptic, Star Trek canon is there for a reason!!
That is canon.

Klingons of that time did not have their warrior ridges. As a result they were honorless and weak. This has been alluded to in various DS9 and VOY episodes as well as written of in several Trek novels.


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# 20
11-15-2010, 10:48 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren_Kitlor
Klingons can breed with Humans and produce fertile offspring - how does that make them a separate species?
That's something you'll wan't to ask the killer B's (Or even Roddenberry considering Spock):p
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