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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
11-22-2010, 08:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
What I don't really like is the "forced symmetry", so to speak. Why does it have to be two bases?

That seems weak, story-telling wise. Just have "Assault" mean "Assault/Defense". One group is the defender, one group is the attacker. Of course that would mean if the defender wins, there would be no ground part.

In the long run, we expect to have something Open PvP or territory control. We need to test how assymetric goals on a PvP map actually work anyway, and such a map seems a decent opportunity to do so.
the whole forced symmetry is there to allow both sides to engage in space and ground combat. if i could think of another way to do it without forced symmetry, then i would have suggested it
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
11-22-2010, 09:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dekkameron View Post
I think it makes more sense to be able to send in your elite ground troops after your elite space forces have taken control of the area.
Sure, but the people of Starfleet are awesome and multi-talented enough to be both!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
11-22-2010, 09:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by apt.pupil
the whole forced symmetry is there to allow both sides to engage in space and ground combat. if i could think of another way to do it without forced symmetry, then i would have suggested it
Hmm... this is a good point. Perhaps, when you have defenders/atatckers, you could have the attackers force a ground battle on a planet/base, and if the defenders push back enough, they force a battle on a ship-based map?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
11-22-2010, 01:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by apt.pupil
the whole forced symmetry is there to allow both sides to engage in space and ground combat. if i could think of another way to do it without forced symmetry, then i would have suggested it
You could create two versions of the map. If this type of map hat its own Queue, you could randomize between the two versions - either KDF defends or Federation.

This would also allow modifying the map to address the asymmetries in the factions. KDF alpha strikes from cloak, Federation has to "ball" up and move carefully into the engagement.
If, for example, it turns out that it's easier for Feds to defend because they are normally not zipping around so much and are mostly build for survival and not bursts, but they can't effectively launch an attack, this might be reason to adjust the map slightly.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
11-22-2010, 06:17 PM
I like the idea, but I say go balls to the wall. Keep a running tally of wins in FvK PvP, at the end of the day, the faction with the most wins gets to mount an attack on the other faction's home base. Klingons attack ESD, Feds attack the Great Hall. Issue out a mission to all players to defend or attack as applicable, then have the server create an instance of the home base for folks participating in this mission. The instance would need to have a very high population capacity.

To help break up the numbers and avoid massive slow downs, split the mission into a space and a ground portion. Players pick where they do their fighting. It would also be nice if the two were linked, so if the players on the ground took control of a certain room, automated turrets in the space portion would cease fire, then if the defenders retake that room, the turrets in space resume firing.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
11-22-2010, 06:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Felderburg View Post
Hmm... this is a good point. Perhaps, when you have defenders/atatckers, you could have the attackers force a ground battle on a planet/base, and if the defenders push back enough, they force a battle on a ship-based map?
one idea i did have to counter that was to have an NPC command flagship on the attacking side. However this becomes a bit of a pain because for a ship this scale, the Federation has nothing. the Klingons could use a Dreadnought, but the Federation Dreadnought is pathetically weak compared to the Klingon NPC version.

while this opens up the possibility for the Klingons to assault the Federation base, and the Federation's job is to fight off the Klingon forces, there currently is nothing in the game that can let the Federation lead the assault without Cryptic designing a new NPC dreadnought for the Feds
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
11-22-2010, 06:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dekkameron View Post
I like the idea.. but make it so it unlocks a new game option for ground pvpers instead of making us spacers have to be inflicted with having to play it.
Agreed. Some of us loath the ground game.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18
11-22-2010, 06:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Felderburg View Post
I don't understand this hate for ground PvP. Ground PvP is amazing awesome and exciting!
Clunky. Primitive. No cover system. Lousy look-and-feel... how can I count the ways I dislike ground combat in this game

Some day in the future MMO sci fi ground combat will be as awesome as Mass Effect. Until then...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
11-22-2010, 06:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilhippo View Post
Clunky. Primitive. No cover system. Lousy look-and-feel... how can I count the ways I dislike ground combat in this game

Some day in the future MMO sci fi ground combat will be as awesome as Mass Effect. Until then...

while i agree that a no ground cover system does detract from the gameplay values(especially since most of the ST tv series had ground combat during war take place either with Bat'leths or with rifles behind cover.

there is an inherent problem with this though: a cover system would be damn hard to set up on an MMO. not just damn hard, it would possibly make ground combat far worse.

also the ground combat is no more clunky than the space BO abilities that either fail to launch or launch without actually doing anything. I get this frequently in space, and i do find that just as annoying as i find ground combat annoying
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
11-22-2010, 08:46 PM
I guess if people hate ground so much, you could do what Dekkameron suggested and just have it unlock a ground PvP map for a certain amount of time...

I just hope all you ground haters are on tribble, testing the ground revamp when it comes out. I don't want to hear you complaining afterwards! :p

Quote:
Originally Posted by apt.pupil
one idea i did have to counter that was to have an NPC command flagship on the attacking side. However this becomes a bit of a pain because for a ship this scale, the Federation has nothing. the Klingons could use a Dreadnought, but the Federation Dreadnought is pathetically weak compared to the Klingon NPC version.
Are you talking about the USS Victory type ship? I think it's been called the Jupiter class? I think it's pretty cool.
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