Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
12-04-2010, 11:09 AM
Well, a couple things..

No game can generate content or challenges that can keep up with someone who grinds it all out as fast as possible. WoW has set the bar, but even WoW has literally had years to do so, and millions of dollars, if not tens of millions of dollars in funds to do it with. And people still make new toons in WoW and grind through them, exhausting all the available content. This game isn't even a year from launch, and it only had 18 months development before that.

It took me six months to get to the cap, why? because I read each and every line of dialogue, I explored every nook & cranny, I explored for anomalous data samples, and crafted, my first time through, I tried each and every ship, of each and every tier, and that was all with my first character, a Liberated Borg Science Officer.

Then Season two hit, and with it, the Federation Diplomatic Corps. So I went and did all the diplomacy I could do, and made Ambassador.

Then I did it again, with an Engineer, and again, with a Tactical Officer, now, I'm working my way up as a Klingon Science Officer.

Thursday, Klingon crafting, and all kinds of crafting changes, will debut on holodeck, and I'll get to go farm anomalous data for him to craft with. I get to go back, and relevel my other toons in the new crafting system.

This game is geared, by it's advancement progression, by it's mechanics, by virtually everything in it's structure, for the casual gamer who takes his time. This isn't the game for "1337" gamers who just want to get to the top as fast as they can. This game isn't designed for you, and that's a good thing. Because by virtue of being Star Trek, it's attracted a wider player base then just PvP addicts and MMO players.

I for one, never played any MMOs before STO, but now, I'm actually considering trying out WoW, not for the shallow ego boost of "pwning" people either, but because long ago, I played the ******** RTS installments, and I'd like to revisit Azeroth.

Also, if you'd paid attention to the story, you'd know that with the Romulan Empire on the brink of collapse, Cardassia demilitarized, and open warfare between the Federation and the Klingon Empire, there really can't be a Neutral Zone. And what's more, with the vast majority of the player base more interested in PvE, there's not a huge demand for areas where you can get greifed as you travel through minding your own business.

If this isn't the game for you, I'm sorry, I really am, I hate to see anybody unsatisfied. But if all you want to do is rush through things, and get to the top, then it's probably for the best that you go back to a more PvP oriented game.

But, before you go, could you and your buddies do us a favor? Play some FvK PvP on the Fed side, there's a huge shortage of capable PvPers on the Fed side, so there's a ton of whiners in the Arenas and here in the Forums that the Klingons are OP because of their Carriers. A larger group of Fed PvPers out there taking down Carriers would, I think, show some of those PvE-spoiled whiners just how wrong they are.

There's far too few of us Carrier-Hunters as is, we just can't make a dent in the perception because of statistics and their sheer numbers.

Anyway, hope to team with you and take down some Klingon! See you in game, I hope.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
12-04-2010, 11:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katic View Post
there really can't be a Neutral Zone.
Apart from the Federation/Klingon neutral zone where the entire last set of weekly episodes just played out in.

Besides there is no reason at all why there can't be some form of open PvP. If SoE can get it to work with SWG then crypic sure as hell can for STO.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
12-04-2010, 11:29 AM
Quote:
Apart from the Federation/Klingon neutral zone where the entire last set of weekly episodes just played out in.
I believe Katic's point is that it's no-longer an official Neutral Zone (a buffer area between the two groups that neither side agrees to enter) because the Feds and Klinks are in open warfare with each other. Klinks and Feds would be fighting each over all over the place not just around the Neutral Zone; espeically since Klinks can cloak and go most places undetected.

Quote:
Besides there is no reason at all why there can't be some form of open PvP. If SoE can get it to work with SWG then crypic sure as hell can for STO.
As was said above, it's on Cryptic's working list.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
12-04-2010, 11:50 AM
People keep saying "wow was dreadful on launch and is only what it is today because of 6 years developing"

Utter rubbish!. Wow on release was immense, much better than the tripe that it is today, which is why I no longer even have the game installed and will never return to it. But I don't want to discuss WOW, I want to discuss why STO has literally NO end game content, no PvP worth mentioning and a very low subscription number.

It is crying out for a faction based PvP zone and like I said in my original post, if you don't like PvP don't come into the zone, but don't tell anyone else that we can't have a PvP zone, thats being selfish and narrow minded. Star Trek lends itself far more to PvP than PvE and if you can not recall a Single episode that would lend itself to PvP then you clearly have not watched much trek. Besides, this is a game and it needs a lot of action or it becomes very boring (which it is now).

Someone mentioned that Cryptic are looking into PvP areas, great stuff, thanks for the info, they know it makes sense.

And anyone that thinks this game is not boring end game, please list me all the end game activities that you get up to day in day out.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
12-04-2010, 12:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katic View Post
Well, a couple things..

If this isn't the game for you, I'm sorry, I really am, I hate to see anybody unsatisfied. But if all you want to do is rush through things, and get to the top, then it's probably for the best that you go back to a more PvP oriented game.

But, before you go, could you and your buddies do us a favor? Play some FvK PvP on the Fed side, there's a huge shortage of capable PvPers on the Fed side, so there's a ton of whiners in the Arenas and here in the Forums that the Klingons are OP because of their Carriers. .
Firstly I never rush through games, I like to enjoy them. In WOW I hate it at lvl 80, I hate the entire PvE dungeon thing, I spent most of my time levelling up an army of alts as levelling up was great fun, an adventure in it'self as it was different every time. STO is exactly the same every time as you get the same thing happeneing in every zone. In WOW it was alive, you had to watch your back, you could be killed at any time, it was exciting.

When you watch ST on TV you never know whats gonna happen, all can be at peace then a Klingon suddenly decloaks and all hell breaks loose, thats exciting but can never happen in STO as there are no open PvP zones. The battlegrounds are not proper PvP, I hated them in WOW and hate them in this. It's all premeditate garbage, 3, 2, 1, GO pew pew pew pew pew B O A R I N G!. I much prefer to be exploring and then suddenly get attacked, chased or whatever, it's called excitment. So you won't be seeing me in any battlegrounds once I reach max level with my Klingon.

But I am trying to like this game and want to stay and play but am getting really bored fast and can't see my hanging around if there is no excitment to be had and I am clearly not alone. I think the reason this game has so many pro PvE people on the forums is simply because everyone else left long ago
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
12-04-2010, 12:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
It's quite easy why people don't end up staying in STO.

1) Repetitiveness: Keep doing the same missions day after day, especially with multiple characters, it becomes boring. Exploration missions are really terrible with this.

2) Fast Climb to High-End: For a hardcore player this can be easily done within a few days. They hit high-end, do everything, grind emblems and equip their characters and that's it, nothing else to do.

3) A war without a war. Territoral PvP on multiple fronts would really add to the emersion of actual war and give players a reason to fight.

4) Socializing: Outside of Earth, there is very little communication and very little reason for players to socialize. The return of the STFs might get some people to gain friendships for a little while at least.

These are a few things I view as STO's flaws.

Interesting as World of ******** also had similar flaws in it's first 10 months online - yet grew to a multi-millio n player subscriber base within 3 years. As content and new dfeatures are added; retention will increase, the same as any MMO with a good foundation. And STO has a good foundation.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
12-04-2010, 12:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanagrah
I think the reason this game has so many pro PvE people on the forums is simply because everyone else left long ago
Very true, if one goes back and check the threads from when the game came out in february/march
one can see alot of post from PvP players screaming for real PvP content, most of them dont post anymore.
As you said they left for lack of PvP,open PvP. And now this game are stuck with mostly PvE players who only plays PvP for emblems.This is very sad because of this this game have lost alot of subs since start.
And to be honest with gears 2,TOR, Terra,DC, what have you i dont see STO getting those subs back.
And with the few subs they have now making the Romulan faction next year will be a disaster, gonna take a day to get into 1 PvP match with 3 factions.

You reap what you sow.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
12-04-2010, 12:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanagrah
When I played WOW I farmed good gear for a reason, it was so I could replace it with greens every time a major patch or expansion comes out, and waste countless hours working my way back up the "gear food chain" just to do it all over again. About 6 or 7 of us would gear up and then attack the Alliance, ride into their lands, cause mayhem, have an adventure, see how long it would take them to QQ so much that all the Roleplayers logged their mains and we, get chased away by 10 or 15 Alliance, it was mediocre fun.
FTFY. If you love WoW so much, then why are you here complaining about STO? Don't you have a ton of OMGEPICPURPLES to replace with crappy greens in Cataclysm?

Every game has it's own version of "Endgame" content. I played WoW from Beta until 7 months ago when Blizzard royally screwed me, but that's another story for another time.. the point is even WoW suffered the same problem that STO is having in it's first year. Actually, to be more accurate, it's first THREE years. From initial release to Burning Crusade, the WoW forums were rife with these same complaints. "I reached max level and have nothing left to do!" "I have all the best gear, and nothing left to farm!", etc, etc, ad nauseum.

So, if you're going to compare Star Trek Online to World of ********, come back in three years and compare it to a snapshot of WoW at Burning Crusade's release.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
12-04-2010, 12:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SapphicZoid
Sounds like you need to go back to WoW, which is a known PvP game. This one is not. If it was, I'd leave it too.

It's a PvE game with PvP elements in it, that are a personal choice. You'd be happy in WoW, clearly.
Actually, the best PvP game out there is Dark Age of Camelot, which after 10 years is still going strong! WoW is "PvP Lite", comparatively speaking.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
12-04-2010, 12:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AdmiralChase

So, if you're going to compare Star Trek Online to World of ********, come back in three years and compare it to a snapshot of WoW at Burning Crusade's release.
So many wow players looking back through rose colored glasses. Pre-BC "endgame" was terrible. There was nothing to do, there was no good source of money, etc. I think STO is in a better position now than WoW was at the same age.
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