Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
12-27-2010, 04:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rokesmith View Post
In any case the shows are not internally consistent to begin with. (Not me complaining, simply a fact) The first time the feds fight the Dominion 1 Galaxy + 3 Runabouts get pwned by 3 attack ships. Now, even without shields a Galaxy would make short work of the paper tiger that is the attack ship. Later on even BoPs take on multiple attack ships without too much problem. The point is that the actual combat capabilities of all on screen ships fluctuated by what the story called for.
They did explain that in the show however. At that point in time, the Federation shields weren't adjusted yet to be able to handle Dominion weapons, nor Fed weapons to allow them to pwn Dominion ships. The Galaxy was effectively fighting shieldless with Mk I weapons at low weapon power.

Of course, worth noting there that the Dominion sure spent a lot of time shooting up the poor ship, while every time a Fed ship gets the ability to bypass shields (or take them down), they do some pin point shooting and disable the other ship with a single hit. And, for that matter, any time the TNG Enterprise gets hit once through shields, it loses Warp and/or phasers every time as well. Guess the Dominion at that time had weapons and shields that worked well, but needed to adjust their targeting sensors, hehe.

Anyway, as to the ships in question:

I believe the Gal X should get a bump in turn rate, to something just shy of the Klingon Battlecruisers. There's no reason the devs cannot do that. That would make both its lance and the ability to mount dual cannons more useful. And from the sounds of it, the Lance could use a little love, as it apparently misses often? And its recharge could be a bit lower as well.

And as to the Guramba, it is currently also less effective than its counterpart, the T5 Raptor. It is close to being balanced though.

In my opinion, the Javelin needs a shorter firing time, currently it costs you DPS. I also believe that an escort/raptor type ship, without the ability to stack the defenses of a cruiser, needs to be able to do DPS, which means make effective use of limited firing arc weapons. For that reason, I'd like to see Siege Mode reduce turn rate less than it does, but to maintain the siege feel, snare the ship a bit, slowing it down. Possibly with a bit of a resist buff to compensate for defense lost due to lower speed.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
12-27-2010, 04:03 PM
I actually wasn't saying they should all have battle cloak, more that for game considerations no one has it except the bop does to offset its frailty.

And my point about the Odyssey wasn't that it should have survived longer or anything against weapons that penetrate its shields, but that they should still have been able to destroy the attackers more quickly given the frailty of attack ships.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
12-27-2010, 04:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rokesmith View Post
And my point about the Odyssey wasn't that it should have survived longer or anything against weapons that penetrate its shields, but that they should still have been able to destroy the attackers more quickly given the frailty of attack ships.
Except their weapons weren't that effective against Dominion shields just yet. Yeah, plot armor, basically, but was the reasoning they gave for it

That said, it is still one of my favorite fights from the TNG/DS9/V'ger era, just because ships weren't disabled or blown up instantly, but could actually take a bit of a pounding.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
12-27-2010, 04:06 PM
One big thing to consider is that in the films and shows they always have the option to simply leave, to not fight. Hence they just warp out or cloak. In a video game the option to just not fight is severely curtailed for reasons of fun and balance. Imagine how annoying PvP would be if a crippled ship could just warp out instantly and be safe.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
12-27-2010, 04:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rokesmith View Post
One big thing to consider is that in the films and shows they always have the option to simply leave, to not fight. Hence they just warp out or cloak. In a video game the option to just not fight is severely curtailed for reasons of fun and balance. Imagine how annoying PvP would be if a crippled ship could just warp out instantly and be safe.
Who cares? Speaking ONLY for myself, I waited a VERY long time for a Star Trek game.
I am all too happy to pay for it too, all I ask is, get it right which is to say, get it like the damn show!
(yes, I know, there are limits of a game)

This game coming out more than likely negated any chance of any other (pre jj abrams butchered Trek)
Star Trek game so I think they have a duty and an obligation to get it right. I do not want to play a crptic interpretation of Star Trek but rather a game based (and not sooo damned loosely) on the show with
alteration only where needed.

They made alterations EVERYWHERE and 90% of them were not needed and certainly not for balance.
If balance was all they were after, they could have introduced ships/tech for the klingons never before seen in Star Trek and it would nether be canon or wrong. This would have allowed them to create the Federation faction as it was, not as they did. ( a few more alterations and this game will be more like
a parody of Star Trek than anything else)

Sometimes you CAN have your cake and EAT it too.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
12-27-2010, 04:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Axterix
Except their weapons weren't that effective against Dominion shields just yet. Yeah, plot armor, basically, but was the reasoning they gave for it

That said, it is still one of my favorite fights from the TNG/DS9/V'ger era, just because ships weren't disabled or blown up instantly, but could actually take a bit of a pounding.
It is a decent fight, though there is no mention of their weapons being less effective, just their shields. (I just watched that scene cause I couldn't remember exactly what they said) The captain of the Odyssey even transferred all the power from shields to the weapons, and yet they didn't destroy a single attack ship.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
12-27-2010, 04:36 PM
Also, taking up the issue of the less than spectacular damage output of the Dreadnought consider this. The AGT D existed in the year 2395, fourteen years before the game takes place. Now obviously that particular version of the ship never existed, but the same kind of tech was developed independently by Starfleet. It is logical to assume it was roughly at the same time. Don't you think that in more than 10 years the Klingons and everyone else would have developed some way of better surviving such hits? Remember, just because we are still given Inrepid, Defiant, and Galaxy class vessels to use that doesn't mean they are anything like the original models built by the Federation, the tech has undoubtedly improved quite a bit, hence the modular setup of our ships in game.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
12-27-2010, 04:45 PM
Just fine. So long as we can fire the Gal-X's gun somewhat faster (Tricobalt cooldown), and can turn it at least as well as an Assault Cruiser (More spots to put RCS thrusters, advanced tech to do it with)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
12-27-2010, 04:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rokesmith View Post
Also, taking up the issue of the less than spectacular damage output of the Dreadnought consider this. The AGT D existed in the year 2395, fourteen years before the game takes place. Now obviously that particular version of the ship never existed, but the same kind of tech was developed independently by Starfleet. It is logical to assume it was roughly at the same time. Don't you think that in more than 10 years the Klingons and everyone else would have developed some way of better surviving such hits? Remember, just because we are still given Inrepid, Defiant, and Galaxy class vessels to use that doesn't mean they are anything like the original models built by the Federation, the tech has undoubtedly improved quite a bit, hence the modular setup of our ships in game.
Yes, both that spinal weapon and the klingons shields would/should have improved.

As it stands, that spinal lance is more like a type I hand phaser. On stun.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
12-27-2010, 04:51 PM
I do think the GalX needs some tweaking as a Tier 5 ship, as mentioned a bit better turn-rate and reduced cd for the lance. I don't think it's damage should be improved however. It is still has about the highest damage potential of any weapon in the game.
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