Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
01-01-2011, 08:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordOfPit View Post
It simply isn't a style that appeals to me so there's little point in forcing myself to attempt it just to please others, is there?
Hence, the last sentence of my post.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
01-01-2011, 09:23 PM
I'm hoping some of my work appeals to at least some players... but I don't expect all or even a majority of players to Love them to death. I loved Armada back in the day but STO Far surpasses it with the ground and drama components and the space is far more advanced.

Overall, I'm focusing on missions that start out short and simple and introduce characters and story lines... so that if players don't care to see the whole enchilada they still get some nice eye-candy and don't waste a bunch of time with something they are not really interested in.

The players that enjoy it might play through the whole 6 mission story arc to see what happens, but either way the Camel's Nose is under the Tent.

I like a challenge and the Finale of the series has some serious combat in space and on the ground so I put a warning in for that one. However after the second mission I really start to pick up the drama.

I could always change things around if I change my mind or get some relevant reviews that make the case for easier or harder. I'm taking a wait & see approach... Lots of waiting and not much seeing...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
01-02-2011, 04:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by The.Grand.Nagus View Post
Hence, the last sentence of my post.
OK, so what about the last sentence of my post:

Quote:
Originally Posted by LordOfPit View Post
And this should show that when writing your mission, you should first and foremost please yourself, unless you're a professional writer whose livelihood depends on pleasing a paying audience.
Are you saying you actually are going to design and create stories and gameplay according to concepts which you yourself do not enjoy all for the benefit of others?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
01-02-2011, 07:20 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordOfPit View Post
OK, so what about the last sentence of my post:

Are you saying you actually are going to design and create stories and gameplay according to concepts which you yourself do not enjoy all for the benefit of others?
If you are only making stuff for yourself to play, go all out for it, if you want others to play it you may need to make changes. Kind of why writers have editors and why most self published books don't become commercial successes. On the other hand niche markets need to be served and if serving a niche is enough then that is a good thing. Trek is a niche filled with niches, and a Nichelle.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
01-02-2011, 08:44 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LordOfPit View Post
Are you saying you actually are going to design and create stories and gameplay according to concepts which you yourself do not enjoy all for the benefit of others?
No, I will obviously create stories that I like. However my main goal will to create a mission that is enjoyable for others to play, not just enjoying the process of creation. Thankfully, those two aspects are not mutually exclusive.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
01-02-2011, 09:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CapnBludd View Post
If you are only making stuff for yourself to play, go all out for it, if you want others to play it you may need to make changes.
My point was that the author first and foremost has to enjoy the story the mission will be based upon and this comes before any audience can like or dislike the resulting mission; I said nothing about being rigid and not making changes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by The.Grand.Nagus View Post
No, I will obviously create stories that I like. However my main goal will to create a mission that is enjoyable for others to play, not just enjoying the process of creation. Thankfully, those two aspects are not mutually exclusive.
I was not talking about the process of creation. I was talking about the basic story-idea for the mission.

If you follow the chain of posts here, this started when apt.pupil talked about his mission where the most common story-element was the scale of battle, i.e. massive forces and big battles. This is a part of the story apt.pupil wanted to tell.

Since I usually dislike large battle scenes, especially when crafted in the particular way apt.pupil did, I told him as much. He then politely and discreetly mentioned my dislike, and then I reinforced his choice to do what he felt was right for the story he wanted to tell.

So, just as I will not write missions based on stories that I dislike, and I advise others to do the same, I don't believe you will write missions based on stories you dislike. Am I wrong?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
01-02-2011, 09:46 AM
No you aren't wrong, but what I was getting at is, you make like a story, think it is great, then if almost everyone is telling you it isn't you may need to realize that maybe it isn't. Then the choices are change what you thought in order to get more folks to like what you are putting out, or say 'forget' them and cater to folks that like what you are doing.

The whole point of making missions is the hope that folks will play and like them,
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
01-02-2011, 11:38 AM
Well... at this point we are testing the system and trying to break it... at least that is what I thought.. the benefit is learning how things work and how to combine dialogue, maps and contacts to tell a story.

We are at the beginning of the learning curve and charting new territory every day. Lessons learned will help improve everyone's missions and allow all of us to be better authors.

We should, as a group, encourage thinking outside the box and use experimentation to see what works and what doesn't. It is up to us to figure all of this out so everyone has a better end product.

If you wish to try something a certain way I would encourage you to try and if you fail, ask for help and we can work together to either find a solution or write it off as currently not possible.

It might be helpful for us to get on each others friend lists if possible for better communication.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
01-02-2011, 02:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by CapnBludd View Post
No you aren't wrong, but what I was getting at is, you make like a story, think it is great, then if almost everyone is telling you it isn't you may need to realize that maybe it isn't.
I have no doubt such a thing can and will eventually happen. In that case, I may decide to withdraw the mission and either re-work the story or completely abandon it. I'll cross that bridge if/when I'll get there. I may even, depending on the feedback I get, decide that the positive feedback outweighs the negative feedback by subjective quality rather than objective quantity.

So, in essence, I guess I'm saying that if a lot of people say "LordOfPit, your story was disappointing because there wasn't enough action and it felt like one of those episodes of TOS/TNG where they talked and talked talked...", and then some other people would say "LordOfPit, your story made me feel like I was actually Capt. Picard, awesome job!" I may decide the positive outweighs the negative and the needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many.

Quote:
Originally Posted by CapnBludd View Post
The whole point of making missions is the hope that folks will play and like them
But not at all costs and by any means, that's how I see this issue.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Napoleon_BlownApart View Post
Well... at this point we are testing the system and trying to break it... at least that is what I thought.. the benefit is learning how things work and how to combine dialogue, maps and contacts to tell a story.
I think we're also learning what our little group considers acceptable as far as stories, mission difficulties and gameplay sequences go.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
01-02-2011, 03:58 PM
Yes LordofPit... I have strayed from the OP somewhat and appreciate and agree with your comments..

I was a live audio engineer for 28 years and every idiot in the club thought something was louder than something else and demanded that I fix it... a similar problem that we face now...

My solution was that I was the one being paid to do MY JOB and the actual Musicians on the stage were the ones paying me... so I tried to please my employers and friends that I had to share a silly crowded van with 24 hours a day and that inspiring confidence was just as important as delivering the goods on a consistent basis.

At the end of the day it will be up to us to help each other and find what works and what doesn't and develop reasonable guidelines for reasonable people while keeping the gate open for experimentation and creativity to flow in a coherent manner.
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