Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 1 Jan 2011 "Ask Cryptic"
01-08-2011, 12:46 AM
Quote:
Q: There was talk about open pvp from Stahl, I was hoping that you could possibly elaborate on where you would like to take this idea in game wise.

A: This is a tough subject because there are those who love PVP and those who don't. Looking at the Star Trek Online playerbase, I don't forsee a future where we ever move to a completely open PVP architecture. What I do see are opportunities where we can make Open PVP areas a part of the Story and allow players to play out scenarios where they make sense. My gut says that you'll see more planned PVP contests before you see open world PVP.
I'll be honest, I really don't think Dan understands what people really want with PvP.

Sure, he said they are going to add more Open PvP areas, but that bit about "part of the Story" or "play out scenarios" makes me think it's going to be something like Ker'rat with somekind of PvE objective or objectives we have in C&H.

I just can't help but to think this would get old fast.



Personally, what I feel that this game really needs with PvP is actual Territorial PvP. Where there is actual reasons to fight, where there are actual wins and losses. Controling sectors or controlling a world with a certain benefit (technology, resources, etc).

If we had such a system, I'm very sure that it would encourage PvEers to participate and shore up the declining PvP population. And at the same time, make STO really fun!



So, what do you all think?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 2
01-08-2011, 01:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
I'll be honest, I really don't think Dan understands what people really want with PvP.

Sure, he said they are going to add more Open PvP areas, but that bit about "part of the Story" or "play out scenarios" makes me think it's going to be something like Ker'rat with somekind of PvE objective or objectives we have in C&H.

I just can't help but to think this would get old fast.



Personally, what I feel that this game really needs with PvP is actual Territorial PvP. Where there is actual reasons to fight, where there are actual wins and losses. Controling sectors or controlling a world with a certain benefit (technology, resources, etc).

If we had such a system, I'm very sure that it would encourage PvEers to participate and shore up the declining PvP population. And at the same time, make STO really fun!



So, what do you all think?
Agreed. They should go take another look at how **** used to be. Now that was a game where PvP mattered.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 3
01-08-2011, 02:09 AM
They should do open world pvp with territory control. If you don't want to pvp,..then flag as not-pvp....simple. You are not forcing anybody into anything..and giving everybody else what they want.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 4
01-08-2011, 07:28 AM
At least give us more Maps DStahl, give us something.I pay $20 a month & all I do is PVP.It is taking to long to get PVP match's anymore. I love the PVP in this game, & the PVP community is a LOT of fun, But I am having a hard time justifying spending money every month on a game that hasn't added anything new to PVP since i joined in season 1.1
The new Klingon ships kept me interested for awhile, but I'm getting Bored, I have A limited income, & I am starting to look around for another MMO to spend my time and money on. This game is awesome, but the PVP is Stagnant, & DStahls response has pretty much convinced me that nothing is going to change. I guess the PVP community is just to small to justify spending money to try to keep us interested. I don't want to be part of an ignored unimportant community ( from the Devs point of view), & would rather spend my money on a game thats moving in the same direction i want to go, towards more pewpew .
This ask Cryptic kinda made my spirits sink.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 5
01-08-2011, 07:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by amidoinitright View Post
At least give us more Maps DStahl, give us something.I pay $20 a month & all I do is PVP.It is taking to long to get PVP match's anymore. I love the PVP in this game, & the PVP community is a LOT of fun, But I am having a hard time justifying spending money every month on a game that hasn't added anything new to PVP since i joined in season 1.1
The new Klingon ships kept me interested for awhile, but I'm getting Bored, I have A limited income, & I am starting to look around for another MMO to spend my time and money on. This game is awesome, but the PVP is Stagnant, & DStahls response has pretty much convinced me that nothing is going to change. I guess the PVP community is just to small to justify spending money to try to keep us interested. I don't want to be part of an ignored unimportant community ( from the Devs point of view), & would rather spend my money on a game thats moving in the same direction i want to go, towards more pewpew .
This ask Cryptic kinda made my spirits sink.
might take a look at league of legends, it is free to play, and has a good pvp queue system. it is all ground but the teaming and communication are pretty good.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 6
01-08-2011, 08:28 AM
What's so hard about creating a whole new sector that's specifically an Open PvP zone with territory control?
For a developer, this guy is seriously narrow minded.

Contests? Said they'd do that a long time ago and they still haven't put their money where their mouth is. The current two limited map playstyles are getting -really- old and uninspired. It's wholly unprofessional of them to assume halfassed contests will be satisfactory content.


Then again this probably will require them to commit more money and resources that they'd rather put into more C-Store materials so they can milk the STO community even further.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 7
01-08-2011, 10:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ObieKenobi View Post
What's so hard about creating a whole new sector that's specifically an Open PvP zone with territory control?
Oh, I absolutely see that it's hard. They need to come up with an entire new game subsystem for having something like territory control. I can see this being an upgrade requiring the work for a full "season" (or more.)

But there need to be some things added. There is just no way around it. We can't play the same maps over and over again. If it can't be a fully fledged Open PvP system, at least add new maps and a few new game modes.

I don't think that contests (or leaderboards) are a bad idea, either. It is not a "story" reward, but it is something that can give the game some sense of "persistence", that the fact that you won 5 Arenas in a row mean something and is not forgotten in a week. Football or Baseball games don't have "territory control", but they are popular with players and fans a like since we track the scores and declare a winner for a season or a championship.

This approach is not for everyone, but I think Open PvP isn't for everyone either (and I mean that with regards to the PvP community, not in regards to the entire STO community).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 8
01-08-2011, 10:25 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
I'll be honest, I really don't think Dan understands what people really want with PvP.

Sure, he said they are going to add more Open PvP areas, but that bit about "part of the Story" or "play out scenarios" makes me think it's going to be something like Ker'rat with somekind of PvE objective or objectives we have in C&H.

I just can't help but to think this would get old fast.



Personally, what I feel that this game really needs with PvP is actual Territorial PvP. Where there is actual reasons to fight, where there are actual wins and losses. Controling sectors or controlling a world with a certain benefit (technology, resources, etc).

If we had such a system, I'm very sure that it would encourage PvEers to participate and shore up the declining PvP population. And at the same time, make STO really fun!



So, what do you all think?
I forsaw something similar my self..

World of ******** has a PVP area called Wintergrasp. Where when one side Wins the area, it unlocks a special Dungeon. (They have more from what I've seen, but this is the one that sticks out in my mind)

Startrek Online could set up the Neutral Zone, aka Eta Erandi, to be similar, where depending on which side has won it, Drozana could be set to be a Store that maybe sells special items, has a special STF unlocked, and maybe even ship venders that have ships that you can only buy there. Perhaps even some sections of the area when won would be similar to Pi Canis, in that there would be some Resource rewards as well. They could even Link the Galaxy - X or the Gurumba to Emblems or even Gold Pressed latinum, but you can only buy them when your side has control over the Neutral zone at Drozana.

And the Final reward for winning the Neutral Zone could give the top 5 scorers (if they ever fix that system) in each Level Catagory (LG/VA, MG/RUA, etc..) a Fleet Action type reward.

And this could be set up to be once every hour the Neutral Zone "resets" and can be won all over again.

This is just a thought, because I'd honestly hate to see there be only Instanced Open PVP zones and Instanced PVP Queues in this game. Not that those aren't moderately Fun.. but it would be nice to have more.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 9
01-08-2011, 10:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaruslothran View Post
They should do open world pvp with territory control. If you don't want to pvp,..then flag as not-pvp....simple. You are not forcing anybody into anything..and giving everybody else what they want.
That worked great in pre-NGE SWG. It could work here too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ObieKenobi View Post
What's so hard about creating a whole new sector that's specifically an Open PvP zone with territory control?
For a developer, this guy is seriously narrow minded.

Contests? Said they'd do that a long time ago and they still haven't put their money where their mouth is. The current two limited map playstyles are getting -really- old and uninspired. It's wholly unprofessional of them to assume halfassed contests will be satisfactory content.


Then again this probably will require them to commit more money and resources that they'd rather put into more C-Store materials so they can milk the STO community even further.
I personally don't have any issues with paying additional fees through the C-Store to buy the content I want to play.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 10
01-08-2011, 10:49 AM
They could take some lessons from Warhammer Online which had (I no longer play) some of the greatest PvP I've ever experienced.

On Blue Servers (PvE Ruleset) there were open PvP areas in every zone containing multiple Keeps that had to be assaulted or defended based on which faction controlled them. Every tier had Keeps in every zone, the more keeps in the lower tiers you controlled (which let lower level players take part in the effort to control the world map) the easier it was to capture the higher level keeps. Once your faction controlled all the Keeps in one of the three campaigns at the highest tier, you were able to assault the enemy Fortress. If you were able to capture two of the three Fortresses you could then lay siege to their Capitol City and try to capture it for 6 hours before the server reset world control back to 50/50.

PvP'ers aided their faction's effort by doing open world PvP, scenario PvP (like Arena, Capture the Flag etc) and gaining points by killing enemy players and completing PvP dailies.

PvE'ers aided their faction's effort by killing NPC's aligned to the opposing faction, completing quests, completing public quests and doing dalies.

Low Levels aided their faction's effort by doing either PvP or PvE objectives in their tier, making it much easier for their higher level brethren to capture top tier zones.

In the end, EVERYONE on the server worked together for their faction and when the big boys came out to play, the entire server's player base pulled out all the stops to support the top guilds as they tried to wrest control of the enemy city from the opposing faction. The end result of this was denying the enemy normal city functions (bank-auction house-mail etc) for those six hours and provide chances to get the best equipment in the game which either PvP'ers or PvE'ers could get by participating in the effort.

If something similar was adapted to STO, maybe just in a single sector to start, PvP and PvE would be rejuvenated. Your faction HAD to have PvP'ers to capture enemy territory, but it was much harder to do without the support of the PvE teams racking up points for your faction's zone control. It was beautiful!
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