Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 11
01-08-2011, 10:05 AM
There is a larger thread already on this here, by the way: http://forums.startrekonline.com/sho...d.php?t=196543
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 12
01-08-2011, 10:07 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NohMalkiri
They could take some lessons from Warhammer Online which had (I no longer play) some of the greatest PvP I've ever experienced.

On Blue Servers (PvE Ruleset) there were open PvP areas in every zone containing multiple Keeps that had to be assaulted or defended based on which faction controlled them. Every tier had Keeps in every zone, the more keeps in the lower tiers you controlled (which let lower level players take part in the effort to control the world map) the easier it was to capture the higher level keeps. Once your faction controlled all the Keeps in one of the three campaigns at the highest tier, you were able to assault the enemy Fortress. If you were able to capture two of the three Fortresses you could then lay siege to their Capitol City and try to capture it for 6 hours before the server reset world control back to 50/50.

PvP'ers aided their faction's effort by doing open world PvP, scenario PvP (like Arena, Capture the Flag etc) and gaining points by killing enemy players and completing PvP dailies.

PvE'ers aided their faction's effort by killing NPC's aligned to the opposing faction, completing quests, completing public quests and doing dalies.

Low Levels aided their faction's effort by doing either PvP or PvE objectives in their tier, making it much easier for their higher level brethren to capture top tier zones.

In the end, EVERYONE on the server worked together for their faction and when the big boys came out to play, the entire server's player base pulled out all the stops to support the top guilds as they tried to wrest control of the enemy city from the opposing faction. The end result of this was denying the enemy normal city functions (bank-auction house-mail etc) for those six hours and provide chances to get the best equipment in the game which either PvP'ers or PvE'ers could get by participating in the effort.

If something similar was adapted to STO, maybe just in a single sector to start, PvP and PvE would be rejuvenated. Your faction HAD to have PvP'ers to capture enemy territory, but it was much harder to do without the support of the PvE teams racking up points for your faction's zone control. It was beautiful!
Completely agree, Warhammer had a great model for RvR and how it tied in both PVE and PVP to make everyone feel like they were contributing to the war effort. Anyone who played Warhammer knows there were some issues with server stability and city raids but they did an awful lot of things right. I am always at a loss why games seem so reluctant to embrace the idea that PvE'ers and PvP'ers can flourish in an environment that supports both types of players. The communities do not need to be mutually exclusive of each other they just need to be given the same opportunities to enjoy the game. It does make me sad that the Devs seem to not even grasp the concept of setting up an open PvP zone(s).
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 13
01-08-2011, 02:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kilawpilath View Post
I forsaw something similar my self..

World of ******** has a PVP area called Wintergrasp. Where when one side Wins the area, it unlocks a special Dungeon. (They have more from what I've seen, but this is the one that sticks out in my mind)

Startrek Online could set up the Neutral Zone, aka Eta Erandi, to be similar, where depending on which side has won it, Drozana could be set to be a Store that maybe sells special items, has a special STF unlocked, and maybe even ship venders that have ships that you can only buy there. Perhaps even some sections of the area when won would be similar to Pi Canis, in that there would be some Resource rewards as well. They could even Link the Galaxy - X or the Gurumba to Emblems or even Gold Pressed latinum, but you can only buy them when your side has control over the Neutral zone at Drozana.

And the Final reward for winning the Neutral Zone could give the top 5 scorers (if they ever fix that system) in each Level Catagory (LG/VA, MG/RUA, etc..) a Fleet Action type reward.

And this could be set up to be once every hour the Neutral Zone "resets" and can be won all over again.

This is just a thought, because I'd honestly hate to see there be only Instanced Open PVP zones and Instanced PVP Queues in this game. Not that those aren't moderately Fun.. but it would be nice to have more.
I agree. Either Eta becomes the "Neutral Zone" or the sectors are tweeked where there is a sector that actually is the Neutral zone. And there can be other Neutral Zone Sector blocks as well along the Federation-Romulan Border and the Klingon-Romulan Border. Maybe a fourth along the Gamma Orionis Border that involves the Gorn and Federation?

The acutal territorial control can work in a system similar to ****'s Realm vs Realm of the 3-way factional PvP, where players battled it out for control over fortresses and whoever gained control over these fortresses gained benefits and bonuses for their sides. This would be perfect for both control of Space Stations and Ground Fortresses.

And space around these worlds can be true open PvP where players can come and go as they please, even if the world is under battle cooldown. They can even beam down to safe camps and fight on the ground against other players or NPCs.

Like mentioned before PvErs who don't want to participate in PvP, falls under a diplomacy flag and is able to do PvE or diplomatic missions that can help with the war effort by convincing locals to support your side via uprisings or aiding with supplies to your side.


If Cryptic can pull this off, then it truely would be Star Trek!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 14
01-08-2011, 02:17 PM
Eta Eridani is temping to use for Open PvP, but I might prefer a new Sector Block. One of the existing Nebulas could finally become "explored" and its own territory, sitting adjacent to Klingon, Romulan and Federation space so that we can eventually have three-way warfare between the 3 factions (should the Roms ever come.)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 15
01-08-2011, 02:39 PM
Indeed, I stated in the past that Khitomer would be a great place for 3-way PvP.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 16
01-08-2011, 02:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Azurian View Post
I'll be honest, I really don't think Dan understands what people really want with PvP.

Sure, he said they are going to add more Open PvP areas, but that bit about "part of the Story" or "play out scenarios" makes me think it's going to be something like Ker'rat with somekind of PvE objective or objectives we have in C&H.

I just can't help but to think this would get old fast.
Objective PvP can be the most entertaining provided the objectives are fun.


Quote:
Personally, what I feel that this game really needs with PvP is actual Territorial PvP. Where there is actual reasons to fight, where there are actual wins and losses. Controling sectors or controlling a world with a certain benefit (technology, resources, etc).
That is objective PvP.

Quote:
If we had such a system, I'm very sure that it would encourage PvEers to participate and shore up the declining PvP population. And at the same time, make STO really fun!



So, what do you all think?
I agree there needs to be some sort of persistent capturable territories / zones that have the chance to change hands (and give good rewards).

Kerrat is all about whoever has the most zerg on at the moment and has no decent rewards or incentives.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 17
01-08-2011, 11:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjaboy View Post
Objective PvP can be the most entertaining provided the objectives are fun.
From my experience, the best PvP is guilds / fleets fighting over control over a raid dungeon. The winners get a chance at great drops, while the loser walks away with their weapons dragging in the snow.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjaboy View Post
That is objective PvP.
No, there is actually a difference.

Objective PvP is Ker'rat or C&H, where you got an objective to win in a short-term battle. Where the battle resets or the points change hands easily.

Control / Territoral PvP is long-term where control can technically be days, months, years.


Battling for Control over a Space Station >>>>> Capturing a point in space (C&H).


Quote:
Originally Posted by Ninjaboy View Post
Kerrat is all about whoever has the most zerg on at the moment and has no decent rewards or incentives.
Heh, all PvP in this game is all about Zerging.

As for Ker'rat, while battling for control is the best type of PvP, PvP in Ker'rat is the worst type of PvP. I really hope Dan deletes that zone or make it a blank slate for Open PvP. The community would be a ton better off.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 18 fleet starbase
01-09-2011, 12:12 AM
I've heard about fleet bases coming out anywhere from Season 4 to Season 7. Any news on fleet bases?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 19
01-09-2011, 08:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MustrumRidcully View Post
Oh, I absolutely see that it's hard. They need to come up with an entire new game subsystem for having something like territory control. I can see this being an upgrade requiring the work for a full "season" (or more.)
I'm not talking about the coding aspect of it, I'm talking about the concept of creating a whole new sector devoted purely to open PVP.

A lot of the STO community seems to panic at the concept of Open PvP and assume that all of the sudden every single place in the game is going to be open season on their arse, which is ridiculous and shouldn't be the case.

One specific region dedicated to open PvP, that's all. Nothing more. Nothing less.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 20
01-09-2011, 09:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaruslothran View Post
They should do open world pvp with territory control. If you don't want to pvp,..then flag as not-pvp....simple. You are not forcing anybody into anything..and giving everybody else what they want.


This tbh...
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