Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 281
03-18-2011, 11:31 PM
Only way to get your message out is to keep on posting in the thread you made and make sure it never drops out of sight for too long. Just like the territory control thread. The more active it is, the more likely the devs will see that the community really is keen on this idea.

Of course that also means you have to count on other people supporting that idea too. I'm all for seeing the Klinks getting another sci ship though.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 282
06-12-2011, 08:12 AM
Mhh overpowered? Depends on how you look at it. When you compare the MVAM mode (Beta command?, most turnrate one) with the defiant, the MVAM part is much more maneauvrable, by far. Having a great advantage over the defiant.

Second thing that worries me is the 'phaser proc', I've 1v1 many MVAM'ers and the total phaser fire coming at ya is really really annoying (hence irritating). There you can actually see that the phaser proc is really a great proc compared to any other weapon.

Even Science users in MVAM can be very devastating when using the mvam mode (3 ships), photonic fleet (+3 ships), perhaps a fleet suppot somewhere in the middle of the battle (These ships spawn much too often if you ask me) so sometimes you are forced to kill of 5 or 6 ships to even get to the 'real' thing. and when that happened, he can already re-enter the mvam mode and spawn photonics and you can do it all over again...

The +5 to weapons doesnt bother me and i dont find that to be overpowered, but if you compare turnrate of mvam versus a bop or defiant then the MVAM and BoP have a very big advantage over the def.

I think this should be balanced somewhat. Since the normal mode (Advanced cruiser mode) actually already has a lower turnrate then the defiant (because of extra console slots or science stations) i think this should be way more scaled.

(Hell, the whole weapon procs should be balanced if you ask me, i.e. Polarons are supposed to do -25 to all subsystems, but that proc is so damn worthless at the moment, when the proc happens, even without EPS console (while most people have at least 1) the power is back before you know it.. even if people would have their shield (for example) at 25 i dont think the actual value would be 25. My shield is running at 53 (if i would put it on 25) and same for any other system in my build) So its pretty worthless to say the least.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 283
06-12-2011, 09:22 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Iceroid View Post
I vote yes, and here is why (and yes, I fly one, and will continue to fly one for the foreseeable future):

1. It outmaneuvers all other escorts.
2. It outruns all other escorts.
3. It out tanks all other escorts.
4. It only loses *up to* 10% hull & shields for above bonuses.

IMO, it needs to lose more hull/shields (like it did in the first revision on tribble) in order to be a balanced ship.

Discuss.
The ship itself is not OP, for one thing, it really doesn't out tank the others due to less burst damage (which means your enemy has more time to fight back). Also the RA AE, can maintain comparable shield tanking (which is the only thing that matters in this game even in a duel) while maintaining superior tactical abilities (Delta 2 +Bo3, or Delta 2 and RF2 together for example) In my RA AE I can keep pace with an MVAM pretty easily. A Fleet Escort, can compete with one on it's own terms, due to having a myriad of eng tanking capabilities, while still maintaining a higher level of offensive potential. A Defiant well in my opinion the Defiant is pretty much trash anyway after it's decloak alpha compared to any of the other Escorts.

The Console, however does need slight adjustments as you do get too much bang for the buck. Though the only time I activate it, is when fighting another vector moded Escort. (It's simply too easy to overshoot a target in Vector Modes)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 284
06-12-2011, 09:33 AM
It also needs to lose some of its maneuverability. the MVAM while in a single form can turn just as well as a Guramba, not even counting seige mode. It is only surpassed by Birds of Prey on maneuverability and it can more than out damage them.

It's science boff slot allows it to utilize science abilities that even cruisers cannot gain access to. It is capable of cloaking (Mask energy signature) while gaining an extra higher level of science abilities). The Defiant retro sacrificed a console slot for this ability, while the MVAM gained the ability to be equipped to do this, as well as the ability to split into three vectors.

It's much more durable than the other escorts, despite the fact that its splitting should make it much more fragile. As mentioned the phaser proc is also much to unbalanced. So yes, for lack of a better term the MVAE is OP'd and needs a FIX not a Nerf. A nerf will simply garner more whiners than a fix and result in an even more unbalanced MVAE in the future when they 'fix' the nerf.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 285
06-12-2011, 11:21 AM
You do realize the Defiant, can out turn a single mode AE/MVAM right?

So, it's the Defiant, Bop, Vorcha with Aux to Damp, Recon with Aux To Damp, all out turn the non vectored MVAM.

As for damage the only time it can out damage a BOP is in Vector Mode. The Bop will spend more time on target otherwise, and likely has the same boff slots otherwise. The bop also gets the Decloak damage bonus.

The other Escorts, out damage the MVAM period, as they have higher level tac abilities.

If you are taking MES, on an MVAM you are Doing it Wrong. Sure you have more tanking than a defiant, but only if you are using MES1 which sucks, hardcore. MES2 is abit worse than a cloak. And again, you're still kind of wasting the ships potential. If you are taking MES3, congratulations you've equaled a cloak... and have the tanking of a defiant. Without the Burst Potential.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 286
06-12-2011, 11:26 AM
MVAMs that split in the middle of combat do they still get negative defense since they come to a stop and then split? I was against the LTC slots they put in a lot of the newer ships starting with the excelsior. Before the Excel the only way a cruisers was getting out of TB is with Trics, JS, or PH now the excel has access to APO the only cruiser in game with that ability. I have always felt that instead of the LTC BOff they should have gotten LT boff instead. So the Excelsior would have Cmdr Eng, LT Tac, LT Tac, LT Eng, LT Sci
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 287
06-12-2011, 12:03 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mavairo
The ship itself is not OP, for one thing, it really doesn't out tank the others due to less burst damage (which means your enemy has more time to fight back).
No, any good MVAM uses PSW.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 288
06-12-2011, 12:20 PM
Why is it in every thread that claims something is OP it is coming from the hard core PvPer's? I fly the MVAM and I don't find it OP at all. I've done one on one against an advanced escort and got defeated everytime. It's all about the skills of the user, how the ships configured, skill points aligned, BO's used etc.

In my own opinion nothing is overpowered or underpowered....well...maybe a few things do bug me, but so what. I don't cry about it stomping on my keyboard and whining to the game developer to fix it because I can't win against other PvPer's. You know what I do? I go figure out what I can change with my build, BO's, and skills to make me more effective.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 289
06-12-2011, 12:21 PM
PSW on an MVAM isn't nearly as effective as it is on a BOP, because your opponent has more time to prep for the stuns.

The odds of also getting to drop your PSW on the target after the first couple times, is also lowered considerably due to lacking of a cloak.

I'll take on any MVAM in my RA AE. (You know the supposed worst escort in the game) PSW, HE3, TSS3, TBR2, or FBP2.

TBR2 is actually imo better than PSW, because of superior damage, and the ability to isolate a target from friendly healers. There are alot more variables in using PSW on a non cloaking ship.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 290
06-12-2011, 01:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Strome
Why is it in every thread that claims something is OP it is coming from the hard core PvPer's? ...
A better question may be why was this thread dredged up after 3 months.
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