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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 31
04-04-2011, 01:23 AM
I am using FAW 1 and 3 and i can't see where is the problem. Before that this skill was broken, now when they fix it you say is over power. It\s not so easy to be good with FAW. I met a lot of ships like me that trying to use it but they didn't make any good damage. From the other hand i also met a lot of teams which can neutralize my powers very easy - scramble sensors, photonic shockwave, tractor beam repulsor or they just focus fire on me and kill me very fast. My weapon power is always on 125 but my shield are on 75. I am really easy target for good escorts.
I think this people who complain about this are spammers, but you forgot what was with tractor beam mines, pets, fighters etc.
Maybe only the cooldown is too small, they need to increase a little and will be ok.
( sorry for my english, but you will understand me )
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 32
04-04-2011, 02:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mindmage View Post
What's a "crutchplayer"? Never heard that term before.
Its a player or group of players, that rely on broken/op skills to perform above their skilllevel, primarily because the toplevel players refrain from using skills, that are obviously OTT.

IE:
VM at the very beginning of the game, you know.. The skill that shut you completely down for upwards of 20 secs, later the SNB/VM combo.

CSV3 when it had an insane damage boost and a single Tactical could take out 3-5 cruisers in one pass.

FAW is exactly like this, not when one ship uses it, but rather when a full group fit a ton of arrays and 2 copies of FAW each, it takes only little thought to power them, particulary if youre an engineer.. And its actually worse, since VM and CSV actually required you to aim at the opponents.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 33
04-04-2011, 05:13 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mindmage View Post
Adapt? These people have no patience to adapt. They just want FAW nerfed so their ships won't die really fast because they are too lazy to find counters for FAW.

I put FAW1 on my cruiser to handle the spam in PvP and it worked just fine. I also use it when I'm surrounded by the opposing fleet. They can kill me, but I make sure they get a beating before I blow.

Too many people are looking at it on small scale, their ship, the problem isn't there BFaW works as intended, it clears trash and in a 1 v 1 it does no "real" extra damage. The problem is when there is 1 BFaW boat is against 2 ships the BFaW does twice the damage. Now add another BFaW boat into the mix and it is a 2 v 2 now the 2 BFaW boats are doing twice the damage to 2 ships and no one is being focused because BFaW takes care of the focus. If you keep adding ships to make it a 5 v 5 you have 5 BFaW boats that can target 5 different targets but still do FULL damage to secondary targets with every secondary beam. If you are flying an escort and cruiser A has targetted you and is hitting you with all of his beams well guess what you have the potential to be hit with up to 32 other beams from the other 4 cruisers even though they do not have you targetted.

Friday night I ran against a full premade running BFaW in my fed tac cruiser and I was getting melted within seconds, EPtS3 didn't help, ET didn't help, TSS didn't help, HE didn't help, Delta does not work.

Everyone says counters. On my Tac Cruiser I can run FBP1, lulz impotent, SS1 again lulz mitigates at best, BTWS 1 or 2, lulz most BFaW cruiser are running EPtW, Aceton Field 1, lulz some more, RSP maybe 3 of them.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 34
04-04-2011, 05:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ObieKenobi View Post
Don't FAW me, bro!
Well played.

Using FAW is easy a caveman can do it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 35
04-04-2011, 06:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vesko
I am using FAW 1 and 3 and i can't see where is the problem. Before that this skill was broken, now when they fix it you say is over power. It\s not so easy to be good with FAW. I met a lot of ships like me that trying to use it but they didn't make any good damage. From the other hand i also met a lot of teams which can neutralize my powers very easy - scramble sensors, photonic shockwave, tractor beam repulsor or they just focus fire on me and kill me very fast. My weapon power is always on 125 but my shield are on 75. I am really easy target for good escorts.
I think this people who complain about this are spammers, but you forgot what was with tractor beam mines, pets, fighters etc.
Maybe only the cooldown is too small, they need to increase a little and will be ok.
( sorry for my english, but you will understand me )
Sorry, for the sake of the future PvP in Sto, it needs to go back to the way it was.

When I tested it out in my Tac Excelsior, even 2 Faw boats could turn the tide of the battle, if no other used it, and I only had FAW 2 with tactical Initiative offcourse. It was so OP when we took the first enemy down and looked for the next all was without much shield and some even hull hurting just from pasive Faw.

Let me clear something out a FAW boats is a cruiser with 8 beams on max weapon power, a tac needs 2 ep2w a eng could settle for 1. A FAW boat is not a cruiser that for ex. use 6 beams and low weapon power. That will meen that not all FAW users is getting the big advantage of the broken FAW skill, so they are not the problem.

If anyone is still in dout about the OPness of FAW fell free to contact me ingame or by mail for a 1 on 1 or 2 on 2 demonstration.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 36
04-04-2011, 06:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tidemand82 View Post

If anyone is still in dout about the OPness of FAW fell free to contact me ingame or by mail for a 1 on 1 or 2 on 2 demonstration.

But but it is not op'd just the perception. As the Borg say, "Evidence is Futile"
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 37
04-04-2011, 06:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tidemand82 View Post
Sorry, for the sake of the future PvP in Sto, it needs to go back to the way it was.

When I tested it out in my Tac Excelsior, even 2 Faw boats could turn the tide of the battle, if no other used it, and I only had FAW 2 with tactical Initiative offcourse. It was so OP when we took the first enemy down and looked for the next all was without much shield and some even hull hurting just from pasive Faw.

Let me clear something out a FAW boats is a cruiser with 8 beams on max weapon power, a tac needs 2 ep2w a eng could settle for 1. A FAW boat is not a cruiser that for ex. use 6 beams and low weapon power. That will meen that not all FAW users is getting the big advantage of the broken FAW skill, so they are not the problem.

If anyone is still in dout about the OPness of FAW fell free to contact me ingame or by mail for a 1 on 1 or 2 on 2 demonstration.
Yea i wrote you i want to try one private challenge. I am eng. in excelsior and using FAW 1 and 3 with DEM 3 and DEM 1 and 1Epw. Let's test it
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 38
04-04-2011, 06:41 AM
Does this mean that FAW on a BoP is the equivalent of "Game Over" for any whom come against such a beast?:p
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 39
04-04-2011, 06:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Captain Data
Too many people are looking at it on small scale, their ship, the problem isn't there BFaW works as intended, it clears trash and in a 1 v 1 it does no "real" extra damage. The problem is when there is 1 BFaW boat is against 2 ships the BFaW does twice the damage. Now add another BFaW boat into the mix and it is a 2 v 2 now the 2 BFaW boats are doing twice the damage to 2 ships and no one is being focused because BFaW takes care of the focus. If you keep adding ships to make it a 5 v 5 you have 5 BFaW boats that can target 5 different targets but still do FULL damage to secondary targets with every secondary beam. If you are flying an escort and cruiser A has targetted you and is hitting you with all of his beams well guess what you have the potential to be hit with up to 32 other beams from the other 4 cruisers even though they do not have you targetted.
The real problem isn't that 5 FAW boats can target 5 separate targets; the problem is that they can all target the same thing and hit it for 5x the damage, while still hitting the other 4 ships on the team for full damage. If doesn't even take perfect focus fire, 2 or 3 players focussing is enough because the ships that aren't focussing will still add in some stray beams.

There's a lot of ways to fix the problem: reducing the damage multiplier, increasing the rank (to make it harder for cruisers to run multiple copies), or increasing the cooldown would all help.

Old FAW kind of sucked because when you had multiple targets it would actually reduce the damage to your primary target, but new FAW got overbuffed.

I still use FAW on the ship that had it before, but I usually don't run with premades, and I don't run 8 beams. I set up that ship for spam clearance, and I just don't want to spend real money to respec. I could switch FAW over to BOv, but I don't often change play style based on buffs and nerfs.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 40
04-04-2011, 07:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by inktomi19d View Post
The real problem isn't that 5 FAW boats can target 5 separate targets; the problem is that they can all target the same thing and hit it for 5x the damage, while still hitting the other 4 ships on the team for full damage. If doesn't even take perfect focus fire, 2 or 3 players focussing is enough because the ships that aren't focussing will still add in some stray beams.

There's a lot of ways to fix the problem: reducing the damage multiplier, increasing the rank (to make it harder for cruisers to run multiple copies), or increasing the cooldown would all help.

Old FAW kind of sucked because when you had multiple targets it would actually reduce the damage to your primary target, but new FAW got overbuffed.

I still use FAW on the ship that had it before, but I usually don't run with premades, and I don't run 8 beams. I set up that ship for spam clearance, and I just don't want to spend real money to respec. I could switch FAW over to BOv, but I don't often change play style based on buffs and nerfs.
One or both of these proposals would help

1: Increase Global CD to 25-30 secs personal CD to 50-60 secs
2: Match the FAW extra shot cone, to match than of CSV, instead of the entire 270 degree arc
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