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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 51
04-24-2011, 11:13 AM
if this game had mroe deep meaningful things to aspire to, less people would be writing discertations about fotm skills on the forums. think about that before you tweak more skills from listening to this type of "feedback"

i played and would have stayed in the old vm snb world. this isnt a taste test, this is a mmo. youre either in it to win it or i dont want to know you. let the devs to their thing and get in game and L2P. one true counter to faw spam= be outside of 10km range
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 52
04-24-2011, 11:16 AM
You are adorable!
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 53
04-24-2011, 11:21 AM
The eie nerf is pretty funny really. The eie cruisers where always the sweetest targets.

Infinite COSMIC POWER.... itty bitty defense rating. LOL

Honestly running Mk IV engines at end game was always a VERY VERY bad idea. You should all be grateful that cryptic decided to push you to a proper end game engine. My BOL crits will suffer however so I say bring them back... infact give them +10 power bonuses so more suckers run em.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 54
04-24-2011, 12:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jheinig View Post
By comparison, changing EiE was about 3 data elements. (Plus a few more to fix an error in the expression for efficiency skills that was discovered in the process.)
So very simple vs very complex, huh.

Surely you don't have a copy of the previous version of FAW and simply copy and paste now would you? :p

Quote:
Originally Posted by RCO
Ironicly the EiE has been like it is today since launch for fed and later for Klingons. So say they where quick to nerf is not even remotely true. Unless you consider 14 months quick. In which case. It has not nearly been that look with BFAW.

They said they going to fix. This take time. After all they said the Klingons would be change to also have pve content and 14 month later this is still not case. So why is BFAW should be that much more important?
Never said they were quick to nerf.

But many, many players question Cryptic suddenly deciding it should be nerfed when it was a very popular item, which took Klingons 9 months to get Cryptic to add it for their side. Stats aside, upgrading engines every level for +1 more speed is hardly anything to go through the effort for. That is the main reason people never bothered replacing that EIE until Aegis and the Borg Sets. As people said above, there is no diversity with Engines. What Cryptic should be doing is making Hypers, Combats, and Standard Impulse Engines more diversified where they actually make a noticable difference.

Anyhow, even though the changes to EIE is simple compared to the changes in FAW, it sends a message that PvP is a very low priority. Which is ironic since an actual overpowered ability that is causing people to leave the game is being one of those very low priority issues. At any rate, Cryptic is losing player support with such a decision.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 55
04-24-2011, 01:49 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jheinig View Post
Yes, we will work on the elements of FAW, but the skill actually involves a lot of digging into the system and there are many ways to accidentally break it. CapnGeko is aware that there are problems but his time is currently booked up with making sure that the new ground combat system is totally solid for season 4. We haven't forgotten about the issue, but it's one that is not as simple as just changing one number in one data element -- updating FAW would actually involve changes to . . . as a quick estimate . . . a little over 4000 data structures. This unfortunately means we also can't rely on just implementing a quick fix with a more detailed tweak later; any adjustments would have to be rather involved. It will get done, it's just not something that can be done overnight!
I appreciate your honesty but I don't quite understand the logic. It's been 4 weeks since it was brought to the attention of the dev team, I would have thought it was being worked on but I see now its been relegated to a less important status.

I guess losing long standing subs is acceptable at Cryptic and does not require any immediate action.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tygerpaw View Post
Others have stated this, but exactly how many of you are programmers and game designers telling Cryptic their game engine and game mechanics are done incorrectly?
Does it really matter when its still true

Quote:
Originally Posted by tygerpaw View Post
It seems like a minority of players are enforcing their ideas and views, via the forums, on the rest of us and Cryptic especially in the PvP front. Yes, the 'squeky wheel gets the oil' but when there is thread after thread plying complaints about the same thing it does get tiresome; even when we have been told already that it's being looked into.
Did you ever stop to think that just maybe when a majority of those that play a particular gametype post and protest a certain skill, ability or item that they just might have a point and as a matter of fact a lot more insight into it than the devs do?

Are we to assume all devs know everything about balance, gametypes and overpowered abilities when they themselves don't play and actually use them in another gametype such as PVP?

Just maybe thread after thread are created because it seems as though no one is listening ? Well those of us that like PVP and actually enjoy a challenge feel that way because we see the devs constantly responding to less critical things like hairdos, wardrobes and other fluffy stuff that really has no effect on game play balance.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tygerpaw View Post
This is essentially our fault. Complaints about a game mechanic like the fighter spam and mines got them reduced in effectiveness and BFAW was changed to compensate. The skill is not broken. It works when you use the power. It is not overpowered, the damage is spread out and not focused. Now we are complaining because of that change. When do the players say to themselves: "Wow! I have to learn a new way to fight." The are all kinds of ways to counteract BFAW (see Peregrine_Falcon's earlier post). In PvP there a very few coordinated teams that use BFAW even remotely effectively. (For that matter any coordinated group will almost always dominate a match regardless.) There are other powers that have changed and no one complains about those. Why? Because the monitory that dominates these forums have not become rabid about it.
As to ways to counteract it, yes there are some but your whole build should not be relegated to stopping one OP'd ability as is the case with FAW.

1) Aceton Field - Works great on 1 person, what about the other 4 on the team ?

2) Feedback Pulse - only good when used at top tier which requires a certain class of ship to be used.

As to the rest, again, you should not have to make your entire build to counteract it.

As to the complaints by the PVP community and not a view also shared by the PVE side I ask.

What PVE player is gonna complain about FAW (in its current state) being used unless its being used by the NPC's on them ? If it was the case then you would see PVE players complaining as well, if not more so.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 56
04-24-2011, 01:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by StrykerV
Plain removing it could be just as big an issue as fixing it. Who knows what will happen when someone hits the delete button and code for other aspects of the game goes too by mistake. Ill live with a borked ability if it will spare us from other game changing issues by removing it.
i never implied deleting the ability if you read my post, my suggestion is to simply turn it off have the ability not usable but still coded into the game so whenever they feel like fixing it they can. Currently like many of the other posters are noting that this and the various other forms of pvp neglect are causing pvp to die in this game and its really the only part of the game that even is a game the rest is replaying missions you've already done a hundred times to get rewards you already have, or sitting in a chair looking at a screen of you sitting in a chair looking at a screen.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 57
04-24-2011, 01:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by EmoeJoe
if this game had mroe deep meaningful things to aspire to, less people would be writing discertations about fotm skills on the forums. think about that before you tweak more skills from listening to this type of "feedback"

i played and would have stayed in the old vm snb world. this isnt a taste test, this is a mmo. youre either in it to win it or i dont want to know you. let the devs to their thing and get in game and L2P. one true counter to faw spam= be outside of 10km range
is this a real suggestion or some kind of sarcasm gone wrong, "stay outside of 10km range" tell me please how you would be able to win a arena pvp match without ever entering weapons range and fyi faw uptime is at least 50% of the time if not closer to 75% it lasts what 10sec with a 15sec cd or something. please lets keep the responses to things in the realm of possibility.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 58
04-24-2011, 07:12 PM
I think you don't need to be a coder or a developer to notice that THIS BFaW is ridiculously OP and unbalanced:

1) it doubles (even triples) your damage with little or no drawbacks (depends if you are a Tac, Sci or Eng).
2) let's you target multiple enemies without bothering to select them or even FACE them.
3) it IGNORES defense/accuracy ratings: every hit is TRUE, 0% chance of missing.
4) In PvP is a No-Brains-Hit-Everthing-Kill-Everything ability.
5) It requires both COMPLEX team strategies and narrow-usefulness abilities to be countered: an ENSIGN ability that requires COMMANDER abilities just to be mildly MITIGATED.
6) it makes PvE and leveling a JOKE.

Points 1 to 5 have been covered substantially in this forums.

About point 6: I'd like to report that I managed to cap to VA1 an alt Engineer in a bit more than just 2 DAYS of gameplay ( /played command on chat console) by using normal Cruisers loaded with UNCOMMON (green) beams and 2 copies of BFaW (and a bit of self-healing).

I also tried K'errat with that FaW Engineer and the result was ridiculous: by the time you take down 1 CUBE (alone) you notice that you also destroyed 1 or 2 SPHERES and 1 or 2 groups of PROBES without even REALIZING you were attacking them....

EDIT: if all this isn't enough reason to put a HIGH PRIORITY flag on it then I probably chose the wrong game to waste my spare time. >_<
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 59
04-25-2011, 12:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord-Thy View Post
About point 6: I'd like to report that I managed to cap to VA1 an alt Engineer in a bit more than just 2 DAYS of gameplay ( /played command on chat console) by using normal Cruisers loaded with UNCOMMON (green) beams and 2 copies of BFaW (and a bit of self-healing).

I also tried K'errat with that FaW Engineer and the result was ridiculous: by the time you take down 1 CUBE (alone) you notice that you also destroyed 1 or 2 SPHERES and 1 or 2 groups of PROBES without even REALIZING you were attacking them....

EDIT: if all this isn't enough reason to put a HIGH PRIORITY flag on it then I probably chose the wrong game to waste my spare time. >_<
But there is 4000 data structures to it.

/sarcasm off

Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 60
04-25-2011, 02:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
The eie nerf is pretty funny really. The eie cruisers where always the sweetest targets.

Infinite COSMIC POWER.... itty bitty defense rating. LOL

Honestly running Mk IV engines at end game was always a VERY VERY bad idea. You should all be grateful that cryptic decided to push you to a proper end game engine. My BOL crits will suffer however so I say bring them back... infact give them +10 power bonuses so more suckers run em.
Not everything has to still be overpowered at endgame to be overpowered.

Imagine someone would create Mark XI Efficicent Impulse Engines? Would that be balanced?
If an item is allowed as a rare Mark IV item to have these properties, why aren't higher tier items?

Efficient Engines can probably be used safely until late Captain. You get them at Lt.Cmdr...
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