Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 51
04-24-2011, 02:59 PM
There's a good way to do a grind mission and a bad way.

The bad way is the room with 23 mobs spawning one after the other. That's awful.

A good grinder might be a highly detailed warzone where the player moves across the battlefield and engages in other activity aside from just killing things.

The point is a good grinder actually has the story and interactions as its top priority and fulfills the accolades as a secondary priority. I don't mind grinders, unless they're boring and blatantly obvious about it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 52
04-24-2011, 03:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darren_Kitlor
There's a good way to do a grind mission and a bad way.

The bad way is the room with 23 mobs spawning one after the other. That's awful.

A good grinder might be a highly detailed warzone where the player moves across the battlefield and engages in other activity aside from just killing things.

The point is a good grinder actually has the story and interactions as its top priority and fulfills the accolades as a secondary priority. I don't mind grinders, unless they're boring and blatantly obvious about it.
Though I personally agree, whether we "mind it" or not is irrelevant. Stormshade said if the mission is "centered on" grinding or farming, it should be reported. So as mentioned in my last post, if there are parts of the mission that allow for grinding that is one thing. But if the mission itself is focused on the grind then Stormshade said to report it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 53
04-24-2011, 03:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Otto_von_Bismarck View Post
I have not played many Foundry missions, so I may be wrong when I say this:

Couldn't the creator just not specify the location that the mission takes place in their description, so that people would not know that it really was a grind mission? It would basicly be the creater's own grind that no one can access...

and personaly I really could care less if about these grind missions, but I think that Foundry Author's should have the freedom to create whatever they want, crap or not.

I have created numerous missions without stories, and they consist of large numbers of ships concentrated in an area. Now this may seem like a grind but its not, its my personal fleet action.
I would not otherwise publish these missions because I would rather no one play them but myself, but you cannot play it yourself without publishing.
All of the fleet actions in the game involve 2 fleets fighting each other. If you make a mission where you are the only ship fighting an enemy fleet, that is not a fleet action. To make a fleet action you would have to put an allied fleet on the map fighting the enemy fleet.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 54
04-24-2011, 04:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by trekbaby9000 View Post
Logic fail. Just because some grind missions are still in game doesnt mean Cryptic thinks they are fine, it simply means they havent gotten to them yet. There are alot of people who speed, but that doesnt mean its ok. If they continue to do it long enough, they will eventually get pulled over. And eventually people who publish grind missions will get either a warning or having their publishing abilities removed if they do not listen to the warning.
Fact fail. These missions have been out since day one. They're highly rated and clearly labeled with the words "grind" and "accolades," just like the ones that were deleted. There are only 10 of them at last count (today). Cryptic knows they're in the system, just like everyone else who searches for the word "grind" or "accolade." Cryptic's own people have also clearly stated that they don't care about missions where you just go into a map and kill 1,000 things. That's all that these missions are, and that's why they have not been, and won't be, removed. What they care about is where you abuse a mechanic to kill 1,000 things in a way that you could not in any other scenario in the game. That was the problem with the warp core breach missions, and that problem has been fixed. Cryptic also carefully reviewed and deleted all the missions that they could find which they considered a problem at that time; in some cases they even had to delete some of them several times when they were republished. They conspicuously left all the ground accolade, and regular space killing missions alone, consistent with exactly what they've said they were concerned about, and the problems they said they were trying to solve.

If you think these missions are reportable, go report them. No doubt they've already been reported dozens, hundreds, or even thousands of times as "violating" this policy; they're easy to find, and they show up right at the top of the list. And there aren't more than a handful of them. Yet there they are. If you continue to think they're in violation, then keep reporting them. And we'll see how long they stay.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 55
04-24-2011, 04:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Courage_Wolf
All of the fleet actions in the game involve 2 fleets fighting each other. If you make a mission where you are the only ship fighting an enemy fleet, that is not a fleet action. To make a fleet action you would have to put an allied fleet on the map fighting the enemy fleet.
No, they don't. Gorn Minefield; Klingon Scout Force; Big Dig; none of them involve "two fleets." There are hundreds of enemy mobs of one or a couple races, and some number of players. There is no "other fleet" in any of these. When they run, there might be one player inside, or there might be twenty, it just depends on who is around.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 56
04-24-2011, 04:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heezdedjim
Cryptic's own people have also clearly stated that they don't care about missions where you just go into a map and kill 1,000 things.

Verifiable quote or it didnt happen.

What they care about is where you abuse a mechanic to kill 1,000 things in a way that you could not in any other scenario in the game.

No other scenario in the game allows you to kill 1,000 things on one map. To do that normally would require lots of traveling. So doing it in the Foundry would be alot faster than doing it outside of the foundry. And Stormshade said you cannot make missions that allow you to get kills or accolades faster than in the normal game.
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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 57
04-24-2011, 04:20 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Courage_Wolf
No other scenario in the game allows you to kill 1,000 things on one map. To do that normally would require lots of traveling. So doing it in the Foundry would be alot faster than doing it outside of the foundry.
You can't actually put 1,000 mobs on a map; the max is a couple hundred. The 1,000 number was hyperbole on Salami's part. But the principle is the same. You can do exactly the same thing in a Foundry map that you can do in any fleet action or DSE. If you want to "verify" the quote, get in game and ask Salami or any other dev on TTS any time you find them on.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 58
04-24-2011, 04:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heezdedjim
If you want to "verify" the quote, get in game and ask Salami or any other dev on TTS any time you find them on.
The burden of proof lies with the person making the claim, not the person asking for verification. Stormshade said to report grinding. Anyone can read that statement and verify it was said.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 59
04-24-2011, 04:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Courage_Wolf
The burden of proof lies with the person making the claim, not the person asking for verification. Stormshade said to report grinding. Anyone can read that statement and verify it was said.
You want verification; verify it. TTS is open to anyone to chat, and developers are frequently in game talking there. You also know exactly how to find these accolade missions. There are about 10 of them. If you think these missions are reportable, report them. Feel free to post when you see them get depublished.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 60
04-24-2011, 04:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heezdedjim
You want verification; verify it.
Nope, you've got it backwards. If you want people to believe your claim, then you have to verify it. This is the internet. No one knows you, so your word doesnt mean anything without proof. We have a verifiable quote from Stormshade that says to report grinding. So unless you can provide a verifiable quote saying otherwise, then your argument is irrelevant.
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