Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 611
05-09-2011, 03:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by V-Mink
You've actually hit upon the irony of the great battleships of the 20th Century. In the First World War, both the German High Seas Fleet and the British Grand Fleet were itching for a decisive naval engagement that never came. They finally had to force the issue and the result was the disappointing, hardly decisive battle of Jutland. In the Second World War, the great superbattleship Yamato was built with the idea that there would be some sort of decisive naval engagement... that never was. Yamato and her sister ship Musashi toodled from one place to another, hardly engaging in any battles more decisive than those which saw their own destruction.

Battleships are teh sexay. They're prestige units, and are the pride of any fleet. They're big and gorgeous and look like they can break anything that they want. They bring a lot of firepower to a battle. (And Marines love Iowa- class BBs because nothing says 'naval fire support' like nine shells each carrying a Volkswagon's weight of explosives.) But the truth of naval warfare is that there is hardly ever any 'decisive engagement' recognized as such at the time, which makes putting all your firepower in one armored basket difficult to deploy. (Ironically, "getting there firstust with the mostest" is a job that fast (and thus lighter) battleships and much-maligned battlecruisers excelled at. Ignore the idea of a massive 'line of battle' and you get things done, naval-speaking.) Smaller, lighter, faster ships -- basically, heavy cruisers -- is a more viable use of resources than the drop-dead gorgeous dreadnought battleship.

Naturally, this isn't reality. THIS... IS... STARTREEEEEEEEK! *kicks tribble into well* So we get a sort of 'arms race' of where the biggest ship is obviously more powerful. There's a law of diminishing returns here somewhere... but it's apparently not been reached yet. Maybe (hopefully) Ent-J will be the last of the hugenormous ships, but until then, the Federation -- and the rest of the Galaxy -- hasn't learned their lesson yet.

Which means... each successive Enterprise is going to be bigger.
Well if the size of starships really means that much to you: Think about this, on ENTERPRISE we saw that ships of the 31st century were smaller on the outside, than on the inside....so technically there will be smaller ships in the far distant future
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 612
05-09-2011, 03:47 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xenor-Nyiad View Post
Well if the size of starships really means that much to you: Think about this, on ENTERPRISE we saw that ships of the 31st century were smaller on the outside, than on the inside....so technically there will be smaller ships in the far distant future
Fairly sure Cryptic and CBS will be eager to ignore that to save accusations of ripping off the Tardis. :p

(And the cries would be rightly justified...)
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 613
05-09-2011, 04:53 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jack_Armstrong View Post
Bigger is not always necessarily better. Look at the Defiant. It was a small ship, but it packed some serious firepower. It kicked ass all throughout the Dominion War...and it was a SMALL ship.

While a bigger ship will have larger Warp cores and shields and deflectors and whatnot, you should not automatically discount what a smaller ship can bring to a fight.

In THIS case, however, bigger is better because it's gonna be the flagship of Starfleet.
The Defiant had shields made of paper. The Dominion proved that when they ripped her apart a lot faster then they did the Odyssey (sp?).

The Enterprise F will be a cruiser, as all Enterprises before it were. It doesn't make sense for a cruiser to be tiny. It makes sense for them to be larger, with more power.

Also: Someone mentioned crew... A certain ship from the 24th century was mostly automated... So why not the Enterprise F? Just some food for thought
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 614
05-09-2011, 05:27 PM
the joke is:

with this kind of voting, you have a winner, that has, lets say 10 votes more than number 2.

but: you still have more ppl that DONT like the ship (cause they chose some of the 100 other ones ...)

so you have a majority of ppl beeing unhappy actually.

this is what i like, most ppl dont have a clue how "democracy" works and what its flaws are.

lets say you have 5 parties. everyone votes for HIS favorite. this is the fictional result:

37% A
26% B
14% C
12% D
11% E

now A is the relative winner, but STILL you have 63% of the ppl who NOT voted for A ... so bam, though you had a vote, you still have a majority against you ...

Edit says: im one of the many that dislike that shipdesign. to me it looks like a kitbash merge of galaxy and oberth ... the eng section is FAR to big and the whole ship looks unproportional.


they had better chosen 5 out of those and then make a poll with 1 out of 5. when you consider the above explanation, imagine we had about 20-50 parties around you choose from, not 5 ... so ...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 615
05-09-2011, 05:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bomyne View Post
The Defiant had shields made of paper. The Dominion proved that when they ripped her apart a lot faster then they did the Odyssey (sp?).

The Enterprise F will be a cruiser, as all Enterprises before it were. It doesn't make sense for a cruiser to be tiny. It makes sense for them to be larger, with more power.

Also: Someone mentioned crew... A certain ship from the 24th century was mostly automated... So why not the Enterprise F? Just some food for thought
My destroyer just sank your battleship and skipped around your guns all the way in.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 616
05-10-2011, 04:36 AM
I would have much preferred this design. THIS ship screams Enterprise!

http://www.startrekonline.com/enterp...lery?share=869
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 617
05-10-2011, 04:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Commodore_Rook View Post
I would have much preferred this design. THIS ship screams Enterprise!

http://www.startrekonline.com/enterp...lery?share=869
*sighs* Damn that ship is sexy.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 618
05-10-2011, 08:32 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by squidheadjax View Post
*sighs* Damn that ship is sexy.
I'll admit, it does look pretty. But it makes me think of what would happen if JJ Abrams' people got hold of a Sovereign. Maybe it's just the lens flares. ^_^
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 619
05-10-2011, 08:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by V-Mink
I'll admit, it does look pretty. But it makes me think of what would happen if JJ Abrams' people got hold of a Sovereign. Maybe it's just the lens flares. ^_^
Actually, this is what that would have been :p

http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs46/i/20...njapan1988.jpg

http://th09.deviantart.net/fs48/PRE/...njapan1988.jpg

http://th08.deviantart.net/fs47/PRE/...njapan1988.jpg

Here was this guys' entry for the Ent-F, btw:

http://madeinjapan1988.deviantart.com/gallery/#/d381xs9

He was actually the first in the list of runner ups.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 620
05-10-2011, 09:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by AngelOfDespair
the joke is:

with this kind of voting, you have a winner, that has, lets say 10 votes more than number 2.

but: you still have more ppl that DONT like the ship (cause they chose some of the 100 other ones ...)

so you have a majority of ppl beeing unhappy actually.

this is what i like, most ppl dont have a clue how "democracy" works and what its flaws are.

lets say you have 5 parties. everyone votes for HIS favorite. this is the fictional result:

37% A
26% B
14% C
12% D
11% E

now A is the relative winner, but STILL you have 63% of the ppl who NOT voted for A ... so bam, though you had a vote, you still have a majority against you ...

Edit says: im one of the many that dislike that shipdesign. to me it looks like a kitbash merge of galaxy and oberth ... the eng section is FAR to big and the whole ship looks unproportional.


they had better chosen 5 out of those and then make a poll with 1 out of 5. when you consider the above explanation, imagine we had about 20-50 parties around you choose from, not 5 ... so ...
Another way to look at this is that 63% of the voters couldn't agree on what they wanted while 37% of the voters agreed on the same thing. That's 37% of voters that rallied for the same choice and that still counts for something.

I can see why people are so upset that the ship the fans voted on didn't win, or even made it to the top 4. However ANYONE who hass voted on any Cryptic poll knows that they don't take our vote seriously.
For the "outfit" poll, they produced and released the costumes in what ever order they saw fit, NOT in the order in which the fans voted for.
On the star ship poll, even though the Ent J is clearly listed on the poll and a link to the ship is provided on the poll, they decided against even making the ship. The whole reason we even had this DTNE contest was because of the backlash they received after they back peddled on the Ent J. I remember them saying that instead of making the Ent J they would let US help design and pick the new Enterprise, yet here we are AGAIN. The fans have voted and Cryptic has decided to ignore it.
http://forums.startrekonline.com/sho...5&postcount=78

Even if the popular winner wasn't selected by Cryptic or CBS for whatever reason, the winner of this contest should have taken the fan selections into consideration. However the winner of this contest is neither in the "Most Votes" or "Highest Rated" tabs. Of course there are so many fans who hate the ship, the fans had nothing to do w/ selecting it.
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