Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 21
06-13-2011, 03:37 AM
Duh.

Re-read my post. The Prom is an "infiltrator", not an infiltrator. I made the difference explicit and even explained that REAL infiltrators should be science vessels, not escorts or cruisers. The Prom is NOT a REAL infiltrator, just an "infiltrator" of sorts.

I agree that "tactical assignments" are more than just "attacking", but in a "deep space" situation the meaning gets restricted. Oh, and "power projection" means exactly "attacking" or "shooting".
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 22
06-13-2011, 03:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth-Thanatos View Post
Duh.

Re-read my post. The Prom is an "infiltrator", not an infiltrator. I made the difference explicit and even explained that REAL infiltrators should be science vessels, not escorts or cruisers. The Prom is NOT a REAL infiltrator, just an "infiltrator" of sorts.
That's assigning a possible activity as a fixed purpose. A Cruiser rigged for silent running (comm silence and emission control) could just as easily perform infiltration. Maybe the term you are looking for is Skirmisher?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth-Thanatos View Post
Oh, and "power projection" means exactly "attacking" or "shooting".
No that's Strike Operations, the deployment of an asset to destroy or disrupt a target. Power Projection is the ability to extend an effective military presence into an area that is generally considered to be "remote". This is usually done as a deterrent, "The pirates stay well away from Sector 83 since the USS Kyton started to patrol out there."
"Attacking and "shooting" only comes into it if someone contests that action ie. attacking that military presence.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 23
06-13-2011, 04:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by KnightErrant View Post
That's assigning a possible activity as a fixed purpose. A Cruiser rigged for silent running (comm silence and emission control) could just as easily perform infiltration. Maybe the term you are looking for is Skirmisher?
Nope. A skirmisher is a patrol ship, or a front line ship designed specifically for guerrilla warfare or ambush operations.

A "deep space" ship doesn't necessarily have to include stealth as part of its inherent powers, but a low presence would be an asset. Cruisers are BIG. Escorts are usually "not big", but not necessarily "small".

So, "speed and firepower" equal "escort", and "lots of supplies" equals "extended range and mission duration". That should be a "deep space tactical assignment". I'm guessing that's why the Prometheus is an Escort for "deep space" operations.

As for STO, I have an Eng and a Sci captain, so I tend to see the "cruiser-ish" and "science vessel-ish" side of things but, in this case, I agree that the Prom is an Escort and not a Cruiser.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 24
06-13-2011, 05:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yreodred
Shouldn't this make it more cruiser like?
(At least when it comes to survivability.)

Live long and prosper.
More like a Submarine then a cruiser. They are designed to attack enemy shipping, supplies and operate for long periods of time with out refueling or resupplying. and can dish out a ton of damage in a short period of time.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 25
06-16-2011, 04:01 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gropax
More like a Submarine then a cruiser. They are designed to attack enemy shipping, supplies and operate for long periods of time with out refueling or resupplying. and can dish out a ton of damage in a short period of time.
I wouldn't compare the prometheus with a submarine, that would be more matching to a BoP IMO.
I think that the devs should have made it a cruiser, but more tactical focussed.
Something like that:

BO Layout:
Tac: Cmdr.
Engineering: Lt.Cmdr.; Lt.
Science: lt.

4 Weapons fore/aft
3 Devices

Consoles:
4 Engineering
2 Science
3 Tactical

Turn Rate and Hull Hit points like a T5 Excelsior.

The reason why i think it should be a cruiser is that a "Deep Space Ship" depends on it's ability to stay alive. The Prometheus could have been a great ship...

Live long and prosper.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 26
06-16-2011, 04:08 AM
I'm starting to dislike the whole concept ship classes and the skills for it. No skills for certain ship class, just for helm, security, whatever ship functions. And each ship would be unique entity with unique bonuses, strengths and weakness.

And from T2 onward, scaling of ships, with perhaps some customized points to add some flavour.

The current concept is too, well...wrong :p
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 27
06-16-2011, 04:35 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dalnar
I'm starting to dislike the whole concept ship classes and the skills for it. No skills for certain ship class, just for helm, security, whatever ship functions. And each ship would be unique entity with unique bonuses, strengths and weakness.

And from T2 onward, scaling of ships, with perhaps some customized points to add some flavour.

The current concept is too, well...wrong :p
I must agree, the whole ship tier concept and player rank concept in this game is just wrong IMHO.

Live long and prosper.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 28
06-16-2011, 04:41 AM
Problem with the Canon Prometheus is that she is an uber ship.
She's the fastest ship in the fleet, extremely maneuvrable, has MVAM, and extreme firepower, and also can take A LOT more punishment than most other Starfleet ships because of her Regenerative Shield Array and Ablative Hull Armor as well.

Kinda Ironic though, Regenerative Shields are one of the more advanced/most powerful shield arrays in the Star Trek Universe, while in STO they generally suck.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 29
06-16-2011, 04:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alexraptor View Post
Problem with the Canon Prometheus is that she is an uber ship.
She's the fastest ship in the fleet, extremely maneuvrable, has MVAM, and extreme firepower, and also can take A LOT more punishment than most other Starfleet ships because of her Regenerative Shield Array and Ablative Hull Armor as well.

Kinda Ironic though, Regenerative Shields are one of the more advanced/most powerful shield arrays in the Star Trek Universe, while in STO they generally suck.
Thats a general problem with STO, it's a MMO everything has to be balanced if it's appropriate or not.

Every "hero" ship was more or less "uber" (if you like to call it that way), the devs really should have made it a cruiser because an escort in this game is a small ship using cannon weapons, both terms do not fit to the prometheus IMHO.

Live long and prosper.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 30
06-16-2011, 02:26 PM
To qoute Yoda "Size matters not"

The size of a ship does not designate it's type or role. Yes the Promethius may be of similar lenth to a Nebula, but the Nebula is just all bulk. It's practically a Galaxy class saucer section with a couple of nacelles hung underneath and the sensor aray on top. So while it's lenth isn't huge, the actual size and power capabiltiies are much more than the Promethius.

The Soverign is designated a Cruiser, but it's skinny as hell, it has no bulk to it but that's not what defines a Cruiser. A Cruiser is a ship which is capable of pretty much filling all roles, exploration, transport, science all while boasting a large warp core capable of supporting excellent shields and powerful weapons.

Ships like the Defiant are floating gun platforms and fall into the role of Escort a lot more easily than ships like the Promethius. But while the Promethius and it's sister ships are larger than the small gunboats such as the Defiant and Rapier it boasts a lot of weapons for a smaller style ship and also excellent maneuverability.

So the size of a ship isn't what defines it's role but what it is designed to do, and the Promethius was designed to be an offensive tactical ship capable of being it's own attack group.
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