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Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 161
06-13-2011, 11:19 AM
Point taken PFalcon
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 162
06-13-2011, 12:07 PM
Originally Posted by superchum View Post
Just my opinion. But yeah, shutting down this source of archived information? Not exactly a keen idea.
I think the point behind her post was, 'keep it on topic and keep it civil." I'm highly dubious she'd sticky a flamewar, I'm sorry to say.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 163
06-13-2011, 12:37 PM
See above two posts
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 164
06-13-2011, 12:49 PM

I'd like to be able to continue to update this timeline as time passes, but I'm not going to be able to do that if the thread gets locked. So please, stop.

Have this conversation in another thread.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 165
06-13-2011, 01:43 PM
So, speaking of trouble with Klingons, when are we going to see subtle changes to the KDF to show us that the devs actually care about bringing the faction on par, or at least make us seem to think they want to?

Currently, we see they are doing ground combat which changes everything for everybody, but the redesign of Qo'Nos is something that needed to be done since day 1. That being said, the redesign had to be done in order to make the people know they were at least trying.

I feel, as do others (ignoring the flamewar) that since there is nothing in the way of items specifically made for Klingons to flesh out the faction (the little things like Klingon gloves, hair tech options, or just some different styles, clothing options, and some proper rank sashes above BG5 *ahem*), that people do not wish to be playing 2nd fiddle in the band (so to speak) by continuing to play the KDF side.

Fix the little things that people ask for....that will be the key to making the whole mess stop. It doesn't take long. You don't have to place the items for customization in the C-Store if you think they will fail....
I see customization coming for the Gorn, but honestly...isn't it time that the Klingon race in the KDF gets some love too (customization love) ?

Let me know your thoughts devs..... I would like to know these things (like why we have no proper rank sashes, clothing options to make us look more like what we are fans of)

Keep your comments polite on this thread...lest I take and give people soggy cookies...
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 166
06-13-2011, 01:55 PM

First off, nicely done P_F. This is an excellent compilation of information, and a historical document well worth keeping current--if only to one day be able to look back on it and say "Remember when?" That is, in the hopes that things will infact continue to improve.

I for one think they will continue to improve. However, I do not think that the KDF will ever be the faction that those of us that have been around since PE had the rights--had hoped it could be.

Early development decisions (hinted at in the OP timeline), determined the KDFs future in such a way that we will always be playing catch-up. We should not, however, throw in the towel in my opinion. As bleak as this looks, I still have a great deal of trust in CS to keep improving STO all around.

I bought my lifetime membership at launch with the express purpose of supporting the game in hopes that KDF play would be improved over time. And it has. Slowly, and not always in the ways I wanted, but access to the full STO game for the KDF is happening--a little at a time.

If anything--and I think this is worth noting for those that are looking forward to the addition of future factions--I would that CS takes the KDF lessons learned to heart. By that I mean, that they are careful to not promise more than they can deliver on a realistic production schedule. I think they have learned this, which is why we do not yet have another faction.

I also hope that when the time comes to add another faction, that CS continues to pay attention to what the players are asking for, and not base design decisions on budget and time related resources. This is what ultimately hurt the KDF. If it is not ready, don't publish it--period.

With what we have all by now read about; how the KDF decisions were made at launch, it really sounds to me like CS was caught between a rock and a hard-place. They promised two factions, and delivered what they could at the time. Since then, they have supported the most populated and active faction (FED) as fully as possible, while continuing to add to the KDF too, but in smaller slower progression. But it IS happening.

I cannot really say if the KDF would have been healthier right now if STO had launched with both the FED and KDF factions equal-but-more-broken. It does sound to me, however, like that was the choice available at the time. In other words, release two (even more) broken factions at launch, release only one faction (which would not really have made anyone happy either), or make two factions and ensure that at least one was as polished as possible given the time limits associated with a forced launch schedule. It seems to me that CS chose the lesser of evils.

As to promises made at any given time (pre or post launch), while the Feds certainly have A LOT more going on for them and are strongly supported in comparison to the KDF, the game is still not precisely the MMO many expected it to be. However, it IS very definitely a good game, and one that continues to improve. This makes me hopeful for the future.

There is no "Undo" button that allows CS to go back and change previous decisions, but there is most definitely the opportunity here for the developers to learn from experience.

Personally I really like the idea of CS devoting an entire season to getting the Klingon game-play more caught up. But would I want that at the expense of say, Not having a functional DOff system? If asked at launch I would have said yes. But now, knowing that both (and perhaps future) factions will benefit from the DOff system, I feel it was a good call.

Moving forward, however, I'd like to see the time and resources of an entire season (or even two) dedicated to the KDF [before] a similar amount of time might go into a new faction. Likely, some of that effort would inevitably improve the FED side in the process, and certainly that time would also improve future factions as well.

Okay-okay, *Stepping down from soapbox* the OP was not really an invitation to discuss what does and does not, or could or would not, work--instead it is a well researched culmination of information about where the KDF stands in relation to the plans and ideas CS has shared with us over the past few years. It's purpose seems clearly to establish the history of the Faction and illuminate where improvement is still required.

As a historical document it is sound in my opinion. Thanks to P_F for collecting it. As stated in my opening comments, I hope that as a historical reference, in time we will be able to look back and see how much farther we will have come in a year, or two, or ten. Until then, CS gets my vote for setting the time (and resources) aside to devote to the KDF--"The Klingons" is a season I look forward to seeing hit the development schedule.

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