Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 111
06-29-2011, 11:03 AM
Well, just because some dev miscalculated things and LoLLy Wizards with Floppy Hats suddenly found themselves armed with a Flaming Four-Handed Sword of PWNage +30.000 and got happily stuck with it for months since the code behind that item could only be understood with a PhD in String Theory, it doesn't mean squat.

Once the anomaly is corrected those LoLLy Wizards will go back to their Exploding Flying Tarts and Krap-Demon Summonings, hopefully filling the artificially created "loss" with some witful new discovery about their granted talents....

Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 112
06-29-2011, 11:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
Why are we talking about corrections and nerfs.... Faw was bugged folks. JH hasn't changed faw at all other then to correct a couple bugs.

Its a bug fix... the day cryptic stops putting out bug fixes I think we should all be out of here.

I'm sorry but if the bug was making pve so much easier for people... that they can't complete STO pve missions with out it, that is just plain sad.

Honestly 5 cruisers running this new version are going to be just as annoying... and spam will continue to be the best counter. so be it
Can't say I /agree with this.

The "bug" you are refering to was to single target damage which no1, even here, complained about nor said anything except FaW, in a 1 v 1 situation is "balanced" and fine. There was no "bug" on 1/3 of its time on, that's a NERF. This was not a "bug" fix and I'm sure every1 here knows that.

But, I believe your exatly correct in that this "fix/NERF" actualy did nothing to what the community did complain about and as such, the complaints will still be ongoing. Another new NERF (tm) coming?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 113
06-29-2011, 11:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
DEM and bleed are so easily un done by heals its not even funny. and i always run 2 copies of DEM. that's like saying plasma weapons are supposed do be a cruisers damage over time ability. i do not understand why so many people think escorts are the only thing that is supposed to do damage. why do they have 8 weapon slots then? why not 6 like a science vessel that does most of its damage with shield striping and disabling? all cruisers should do is sit pretty and heal escorts.

escorts are specs compared to the large cruisers that ruled the star trek universe, you have no idea how hard they had to nerf cruisers so they would fit into this escort, science vessel, cruiser trifecta in this game. but hey, they had to do it i guess. still, every class should be able to kill, escorts do it quick, they durable enough for long battles. cruisers should kill slower, but not never. that's why FAW is good for them, and not BO. these traditional MMO roles work on fantasy characters in magic land, not in space on starships, especially with such an established IP contradicting MMO design 101.
Escorts kicking cruisers around is cannon... sorry. The federation understood they where deficient hence the building of dedicated warships like the defiant. The jem'hadar main ship... small escort style attack vessel. The klingons main ship (they build for war not exploration) bird of prey. Hirogen warships also small escort style ships. Breen warships, thats right Escort class. If I rack my brain there are probaly 20 more cannon escort class warships. Cruisers are support class multi role ships as per cannon. Yes they can do dmg... but they are not going to out gun a purpose built warship. Honestly if you want to play something less MMO like perhaps you need to find a Star Ship Simulator, dig up Starfleet command or something.
If cruisers did as much dmg as escorts why would anyone fly anything other then a cruiser ?

Sci Ships also give up 2 weapons slots as they have access to more offensive boff skills then either of the other 2 ship classes.... I know that sounds crazy, and it depends on how you define some of the skills.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 114
06-29-2011, 11:11 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dontdrunkimshoot View Post
DEM and bleed are so easily un done by heals its not even funny. and i always run 2 copies of DEM. that's like saying plasma weapons are supposed do be a cruisers damage over time ability. i do not understand why so many people think escorts are the only thing that is supposed to do damage. why do they have 8 weapon slots then? why not 6 like a science vessel that does most of its damage with shield striping and disabling? all cruisers should do is sit pretty and heal escorts.

escorts are specs compared to the large cruisers that ruled the star trek universe, you have no idea how hard they had to nerf cruisers so they would fit into this escort, science vessel, cruiser trifecta in this game. but hey, they had to do it i guess. still, every class should be able to kill, escorts do it quick, they durable enough for long battles. cruisers should kill slower, but not never. that's why FAW is good for them, and not BO. these traditional MMO roles work on fantasy characters in magic land, not in space on starships, especially with such an established IP contradicting MMO design 101.
Cosigned! What I have been saying on my tread.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 115
06-29-2011, 11:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esquire View Post
Can't say I /agree with this.

The "bug" you are refering to was to single target damage which no1, even here, complained about nor said anything except FaW, in a 1 v 1 situation is "balanced" and fine. There was no "bug" on 1/3 of its time on, that's a NERF. This was not a "bug" fix and I'm sure every1 here knows that.

But, I believe your exatly correct in that this "fix/NERF" actualy did nothing to what the community did complain about and as such, the complaints will still be ongoing. Another new NERF (tm) coming?
FAW ignored ACC ratings... that has been fixed. I think people will find faw is just a bit less effective now. When an escort hits Omega / or Evasive / or even delta, they will have those numbers mean something again.

That is a Major bug, and I think we will all notice it.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 116
06-29-2011, 11:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Esquire View Post
Can't say I /agree with this.

The "bug" you are refering to was to single target damage which no1, even here, complained about nor said anything except FaW, in a 1 v 1 situation is "balanced" and fine. There was no "bug" on 1/3 of its time on, that's a NERF. This was not a "bug" fix and I'm sure every1 here knows that.

But, I believe your exatly correct in that this "fix/NERF" actualy did nothing to what the community did complain about and as such, the complaints will still be ongoing. Another new NERF (tm) coming?
The bug was about pulses from FaW ignoring the basic rules of accuracy/defense.

The uptime REDUCTION to 10s is a welcome REBALANCE PASS relative to it's cannon sister ability CSV.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 117
06-29-2011, 11:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by admneal View Post
Cosigned! What I have been saying on my tread.
So then this whole thing pretty much boils down to your interpretation of cannon... in that smaller ships = less powerful, week, fodder for the big ships.

I know we all remember that enterprise always wins.... of course that was a tv show. I don't really want to play a game where everyone flys around in the enterprise because only the enterprise ever wins.

Star Trek Cannon shows large ships killing small ships, and being killed by small ships all the time. The only ship that escaped the realities of war... where the "hero" ships... so unless you guys found boffs with names like McCoy, Spoke, Tuvok, O'brian, Sulu... or the like... well reality sucks I guess.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 118
06-29-2011, 11:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
FAW ignored ACC ratings... that has been fixed. I think people will find faw is just a bit less effective now. When an escort hits Omega / or Evasive / or even delta, they will have those numbers mean something again.

That is a Major bug, and I think we will all notice it.
No where has a dev said that FaW ignored ACC rating. Just that FaW will have ACC ratings in it. FaW wasn't bugged on ACC ratings. Beams had 95% ACC ratings built in, FaW just reacted to that. I have posted my testing several times on this boards regarding ACC, beams, and FaW and FaW did miss before this "fix". The only way that Cryptic gets a lower ACC rating for FaW is to decrease the ACC ratings to beams, in general and/or place a "be-buff" of sorts onto to FaW, specificaly, and leave the ACC rating for everything else alone. They still have not said which method they used. Both possibilities are NERFs, not bug fixes
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 119
06-29-2011, 11:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Husanak View Post
Escorts kicking cruisers around is cannon... sorry. The federation understood they where deficient hence the building of dedicated warships like the defiant. The jem'hadar main ship... small escort style attack vessel. The klingons main ship (they build for war not exploration) bird of prey. Hirogen warships also small escort style ships. Breen warships, thats right Escort class. If I rack my brain there are probaly 20 more cannon escort class warships. Cruisers are support class multi role ships as per cannon. Yes they can do dmg... but they are not going to out gun a purpose built warship. Honestly if you want to play something less MMO like perhaps you need to find a Star Ship Simulator, dig up Starfleet command or something.
If cruisers did as much dmg as escorts why would anyone fly anything other then a cruiser ?

Sci Ships also give up 2 weapons slots as they have access to more offensive boff skills then either of the other 2 ship classes.... I know that sounds crazy, and it depends on how you define some of the skills.
You seem to forget cannon wise that the Assault Cruiser class (the Sovereign) was designed specifically to combat the Borg. " Proving to be highly successful against the Borg, the Sovereign was hailed as one of the "best balances of exploration and tactical capability since the Constitution-class of a century prior" and was expected to be Starfleet's leading class well into the 25th century" (memory beta). I don't see being solely fleet support anywhere in quote. Escorts are indeed the warships and have great fire power for their size, per cannon. However, that does not mean that they are the only ship that has sole dominion over damage. Every ship should be able to hold their own in battle. It's the middle of a galactic war and we have only one ship class that does damage?
On a side note, its funny all this pomp for the Enterprise F... Starfleet investing all those resources and technology into a ship that doesn't do damage?
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 120
06-29-2011, 11:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lord-Thy View Post
The bug was about pulses from FaW ignoring the basic rules of accuracy/defense.

The uptime REDUCTION to 10s is a welcome REBALANCE PASS relative to it's cannon sister ability CSV.
"A rose, by any other name, is still a rose". A NERF, by any other name, is still a NERF. Honesty is always the best policy.
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