Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 81
08-25-2011, 10:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heretic
Hey guys,

I just wanted to give you all a head's up that Geko and I are going to be getting our hands dirty over the next few months with a number of different aspects of ships. As a result, I am particularly interested in hearing your opinions and thoughts in several areas.

This being said, I want to keep your expectations moderated; there's a ton we'd like to do, a lot we can do, but also quite a bit we won't be able to do for a wide variety of reasons from time to balance. Also, I can't at this point give out as many details about what we are doing as we have with the duty officer system, and I apologize in advance that this will be a lot more listening and analyzing and a lot less spilling cans of beans.

Specific questions:
1. What ship(s) did you fly as you ranked up?
Tier 1 -- Miranda and Constitution
Tier 2 -- Constitution Refit, escort and science ship (the basic ones, I only vaguely remember them)
Tier 3 -- Heavy escorts on most of my toons. Excelsiors after they were available. I dislike the Heavy Cruiser because it's too small, and I've just never liked the look. I can't stand the look of the tier 3 science ships. Tier 3 is where I tend to respec to use a ship I don't hate, even if I was leveling a character using a different class of ship at every other tier.
Tier 4 -- Defiant, Intrepid, Galaxy
Quote:
For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both?
I leveled up my first two characters (and engineer in cruisers and a tac in escorts) mostly through PvP, and I would have leveled later characters through PvP if it were an option.
Quote:
Group or solo?
Solo. I prefer PvP because it's easy for a solo player to find teams there. I'd probably PvE more if it were easier to find teams. In other MMOs that have a robust LFG tool I tend to use that a lot, and I find that PUGging is a good way to meet people.
Quote:
2. What ship(s) do you fly at cap? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
On my Engineer I alternate between an Excelsior-R, Galaxy-R, and Sovereign (though I hate that the Sovvy is a whole different skill than other cruisers). I've used Star Cruisers, but I never stick with them long.

On my Tac I use the Defiant-R or Fleet Escort (again, I hate having to respec to switch ships)

On my Sci I use the Intrepid-R.

I primarily PvP, but again, if there were a way to easily find teams for PvE I'd probably do it more.

I usually solo-queue, but I tend to build my ships to fill a role in a group.
Quote:
3. Which ship(s) do you think are currently overpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
The Intrepid-R is overpowered in PvP. With the extra Science ensign, it's easy to take multiple copies of both HE and TSS while still having good offensive science powers, which makes the Intrepid-R very tanky. Then on top of that, it's got ablative armor to carry it through the dead-space in it's tanking rotation. When you consider that it can also afford to run at full Aux most of the time (since it can use Science for offense instead of beams) it tends to get great effect from HE and TSS.

I love the Intrepid; it's one of my favorite designs and I love the way it handles, but it's probably a little too hard to kill. While there are niche roles for the other science ships, the Intrepid-R can still fill those niches as well or better than the other science ships.

The MVAE seems a bit OP too, but I don't use that one. Having an LC Science station and CDR Tactical station together is just too much offensive power. On top of that the ship is too maneuverable as compared to other escorts, but doesn't give up anything significant in it's multi-vector mode. It replaces the Fleet and Advanced Escorts too completely.
Quote:
4. Which ship(s) do you think are currently underpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
Galaxy-R. It's biggest problem is the cooldown on saucer seperation; once you respawn you're stuck with a slower-than-normal cruiser using weapons and BOffs for offense rather than tanking/healing (it is not practical to switch during PvP, since you need to set up your hotkeys every time you change BOffs).

With the saucer attached, the Galaxy-R is less maneuverable than other cruisers, and it's extra ensign engineering station is less useful either for offense or defense than a science or tactical ensign would be. Since we have to fight with the saucer attached occasionally, there should be some upside to doing it, perhaps bonus Aux power.

Since offensive power comes more from BOff abilities than weapons, the Galaxy-R kind of lacks a punch. It's a great ship for laying down Warp Plasma if that's your thing, but it only has space for one offensive Tactical power, and the offensive Engineering powers are all above Ensign rank, most have cool-downs that are too long, and most are ineffective in PvP. To be an offensive cruiser, the Galaxy-R needs access to some significant damage buff.

The stardrive section runs less power to everything except weapons, so it is less effective at healing and tanking , which makes the weak offensive punch harder to swallow. If it kept the regular cruiser power levels to sheilds, engines, and aux, then it would have more of a niche since it could perform the tradition cruiser roles better.

I don't think the Galaxy-R should be able to mount dual cannons, but the lack of dual cannons and lower turn rate should be enough to differentiate it from escorts. The stardrive section could probably have more cruiser-like power levels without stepping on escort toes.
Quote:
5. What feature of your favorite ships do you like the most? As in, console configurations, station configurations, aesthetics, special abilities, etc.?
Excelsior-R -- handles well, and has a good balance of survival and offense.

Galaxy-R -- I love the handling. It's probably the ship I have the most fun with, but it sucks for healing (because of power levels) and it sucks for DPSing (because Engineering is weak offensively). And the cooldown on the saucer separation really blows. If saucer separation was as much an improvement as MVAM is to the MVAE, then the punitive cooldown might not be so awful (nevermind that an MVAE still handles like an escort in either mode, where the Galaxy-R becomes a completely different ship type). The Galaxy-R is kind of like a scab I can't stop picking at -- I have a lot of fun with the ship, it just sucks.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 82
08-26-2011, 07:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heretic
Specific questions:
1. What ship(s) did you fly as you ranked up? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
First character to hit level cap was my engineer who flew science ships the entire way up.
Second character to hit level cap was my other engineer who flew cruisers the entire way up.
Third character to hit level cap was my Klingon, tactical. He flew the BoP, then switched to K'Tanco, then switched to a Raptor, then tried a Neg'Vahr, then back to a Raptor. And ended up in the Garumba.

The first character did a little PVP, but not much. His ship choice was based on his back story. The second character did the most PVPing. But his ship choice was based on me wanting to fly the heck out of the cruisers in the game. The Klingon's choices were based on me trying to find something to fit his build and flying style. All of my characters were solo heavy, group considerations were minimum.

Quote:
2. What ship(s) do you fly at cap? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
First character to hit level cap currently flies a T5 Nebula. But I'm sorely tempted to try the Vulcan ship.
Second character flies an Assault Cruiser. This character craves the Odyssey when it comes out.
The klingon flies the Garumba. He's a Nausicaan. So he flies his species' ship.
PVP and PVE considerations have next to nothing to do with my ship choices at this level. If I were choosing based on PVP, the first character would fly a Nomad, the second would fly an Excelsior and the third would go back to his Raptor.

Quote:
3. Which ship(s) do you think are currently overpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
I think the Excelsior is overpowered in relation to the Assault Cruiser. And this is just a hangup of mine based on functionality. A ship like the excelsior shouldn't really outclass something CALLED an "assault" cruiser in terms of, you know, leading or taking place in an assault. So maybe you can just fix that whole thing up by changing the name of Assault Cruiser. Though I do find it inherently ridiculous that a ship appearance as old as the Excelsior is top of the line in terms of damage potential for end-game cruisers. It says something bad to me about the design philosophy being followed in the game.

Quote:
4. Which ship(s) do you think are currently underpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
I've long considered science ships underpowered in this game in both PVE and PVP. Why? Because their weapons loadout is weaker compared to the rest of the ships in the game. The tradeoff for this is the inherent beam powers they get. But those powers are all rank 1 and so fall short as a tradeoff. Also science powers themselves have been heavily nerfed over the course of the game's history. So unlike initially when a Viral Matrix could easily make up for the lack of firepower, currently science has not enough pop to really compete. This doesn't affect PVE as much, but it is noticeable.

At this stage of development I'd also like to suggest that the Bird of Prey is underpowered. Originally it was considered one of the strongest ships in the game, especially in PVP. But back then only the KDF had access to a cloak. And cloaks weren't bugged and broken. These days, the power creep from all the C-Store ships and special ships that have been made have marginalized the Bird of Prey, so that it ends up being weaker (because it still has all of its limitations) and its strengths are either matched by other Fed-side ships, or are bugged.

Quote:
5. What feature of your favorite ships do you like the most? As in, console configurations, station configurations, aesthetics, special abilities, etc.?
Truthfully, the aesthetics are what drive my interest in ships. Flying a Sovereign really made me feel like I was part of the storyline in the game. In fact it's what really bugs me about some of the other parts of the game not matching up. Being unable to sit in my captain's chair for so long really messed up that aesthetic value of gameplay. Having random NPCs on my bridge in a different uniform messed up the aesthetic. This kind of stuff matters to players like me.

The aesthetics of the non-klingon KDF ships I am a big fan of. Those ships look sweet.

I'm not a fan of the BOFF layouts that have been chosen for the various "special" ships. I'll tell you right now, it feels like each of those ships have been allowed to break the rules of the game's ship tiers and "balance" just to be incentive to get people to buy them in the c-store. If that's the goal, well then mission accomplished. However, I feel that doings so cheapens the entire point of balance that ship tiers were originally created to have. When each new ship is an "exception" to the rule, and we're a bout a half dozen ships into this, then the rules no longer have much strength to them.

So there's no BOFF layout I like. In fact, I tend to think that as much as I disliked the idea of ship tiers (because really, no one seems to have cared that an Akira showed up to fight Borg in First Contact, or a Constellation or six got wrecked at Wolf 359) ... I will say that there was a balance and an elegance to the layouts originally. At the top tier you could go in a specific direction that gave you a sub-specialty. For instance you choose DSSV over RSSV because it had the extra ENG slot instead of TAC slot. The special/c-store ships have degraded that balance in a very real and noticeable way.

And the Nebula, and alllllllll of the tug of war involving the Nebula's first suggested layout and its eventual released layout, just underscore my point right there.

As far as special powers and consoles and the like ... I think the only one I even enjoyed was saucer separation. Just not my cup of tea really. As stated, aesthetics are what drive me far more than the gimmick button I get to push once every minute or longer.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 83
08-26-2011, 07:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heretic
1. What ship(s) did you fly as you ranked up? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
Miranda > Refit Constitution > Dakota > Galaxy (T4 all the way to level cap) > Galaxy-R

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heretic
2. What ship(s) do you fly at cap? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
Galaxy-R for everything.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heretic
3. Which ship(s) do you think are currently overpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
All Klingon cruisers, because they can use DHC's and have uber turn rate. They have all the strengths of Fed cruisers and none of the weaknesses.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heretic
4. Which ship(s) do you think are currently underpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
Galaxy-R:
- Slowest turning cruiser in the game.
- Weakest where tactical and science are concerned, both the Assault and Star cruisers are better in those areas while tanking equally well.
- Essentially a flying damage sponge with nothing else to offer unless you separate.
- Is still a weaker damage sponge compared to the Star Cruiser because a science ensign gives you far more defensive benefits than an engineer ensign (when you already have two ENG ensign powers).
- Has one less console slot than all other cruisers.
- Separation is pointless when you have no bonus to tactical abilities like the Sovereign and Excelsior have.
- Extra turn rate is useless when separated. Trying to utilize it with a DBB/Turret setup makes you useless in combat when connected. Separated with a standard beam array layout is also useless because the extra turn rate isn't needed when the point of arrays is to broadside.
- Loss of 90% of crew when separated along with weaker shields and hull, and loss of the extra power to non-tactical subsystems makes you lose a lot of your damage sponge ability for barely any tactical benefit.
- Unlike MVAM, saucer pet has no purpose except to get disabled in pve and ignored in pvp.

Please note: I have tried out the Assault Cruiser, the Star Cruiser and the Retrofit Excelsior. All of them are better at pvp and pve than the Galaxy-R. Even the Galaxy-X at least has a big honking gun on it, but it's still nearly as useless as the Galaxy-R.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Heretic
5. What feature of your favorite ships do you like the most? As in, console configurations, station configurations, aesthetics, special abilities, etc.?
Galaxy-R. I love the way it looks. It sadly has nothing else about it to make it compare to the other T5 cruisers. Saucer separation is a joke. I'd trade it for a third tactical console slot in a heartbeat. A universal ensign would go a long way too.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 84
08-26-2011, 09:16 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heretic
Specific questions:
1. What ship(s) did you fly as you ranked up? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
A: Rank and class specific, for example, with Tac, all escorts till the end.

2. What ship(s) do you fly at cap? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
A: Eng: Assault Cruiser, Gal Dreadnaught & Galaxy-R, Tac: Defiant-R & Prometheus MVAM, Sci: Nebula-R & Intrepid-R

3. Which ship(s) do you think are currently overpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
A: Excelsior-R, high man rate and higher tac console

4. Which ship(s) do you think are currently underpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
A: All Rear Admiral ships (how many do you see being used) but the one which hurts me the most is the Sovereign (assault cruiser)

5. What feature of your favorite ships do you like the most? As in, console configurations, station configurations, aesthetics, special abilities, etc.?
A: I personally enjoy Galaxy-R saucer separation, Intrepid-R ablative hull armor and Defiant-R cloaking device.

I didn't tried Nebula-R anti-cloak systems yet.
Thank you for this time to read our feedback.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 85
08-26-2011, 10:08 AM
1.What ship(s) did you fly as you ranked up? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
For mi mine (engineering officer) i use cruisers, but then I want it to rise up fast, so I use escorts, even with science players.

2. What ship(s) do you fly at cap? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
I use Severeign with engi officer, Nebula with Scie officer, MVMA Prometheus with tact and Galaxy R with the other engi.
With the Klingons I use Carrier with scie and Vorcha with Engi.

3. Which ship(s) do you think are currently overpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
Excelsior for sure, not only have more turn rate than Sovereign, but also have the same hull and better BOFFs layout. Intrepid also, it has a I win button that others donít have, so thatís make it better. Defiant has cloak and more turn rate, also overpower.

4. Which ship(s) do you think are currently underpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
Sovereign for sure, and thatís hurts, because itís a beautiful ship, and itís a Enterprise.. and has been forgotten from the times of the times.. Excelsior make the Assault Cruiser complete useless.

5. What feature of your favourite ships do you like the most? As in, console configurations, station configurations, aesthetics, special abilities, etc.?
I donít choose mi ship for the feature, i take it because i am a ship crazy that like to ride a good looking ship.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 86
08-26-2011, 11:06 AM
1. What ship(s) did you fly as you ranked up? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
Escorts on Tac, Sci on Sci and Cruisers on Eng,

2. What ship(s) do you fly at cap? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
Same as above but with cruisers on my Tac, i just change them as i feel, no particular reasons

3. Which ship(s) do you think are currently overpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
none, its all about the captain and boff skills

4. Which ship(s) do you think are currently underpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
Galaxy variants, need to turn quicker, they feel like such whales compared to the shows/films. Also Defiant doesnt feel quite as heroic as the shows

5. What feature of your favorite ships do you like the most? As in, console configurations, station configurations, aesthetics, special abilities, etc.?
Love the canon ships and love the shield/sensor/engines that change the looks of your ship
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 87
08-26-2011, 12:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forgotten-Nemesis View Post
Galaxy-R:
- Slowest turning cruiser in the game.
- Weakest where tactical and science are concerned, both the Assault and Star cruisers are better in those areas while tanking equally well.
- Essentially a flying damage sponge with nothing else to offer unless you separate.
- Is still a weaker damage sponge compared to the Star Cruiser because a science ensign gives you far more defensive benefits than an engineer ensign (when you already have two ENG ensign powers).
- Has one less console slot than all other cruisers.
- Separation is pointless when you have no bonus to tactical abilities like the Sovereign and Excelsior have.
- Extra turn rate is useless when separated. Trying to utilize it with a DBB/Turret setup makes you useless in combat when connected. Separated with a standard beam array layout is also useless because the extra turn rate isn't needed when the point of arrays is to broadside.
- Loss of 90% of crew when separated along with weaker shields and hull, and loss of the extra power to non-tactical subsystems makes you lose a lot of your damage sponge ability for barely any tactical benefit.
- Unlike MVAM, saucer pet has no purpose except to get disabled in pve and ignored in pvp.

Please note: I have tried out the Assault Cruiser, the Star Cruiser and the Retrofit Excelsior. All of them are better at pvp and pve than the Galaxy-R. Even the Galaxy-X at least has a big honking gun on it, but it's still nearly as useless as the Galaxy-R.

Galaxy-R. I love the way it looks. It sadly has nothing else about it to make it compare to the other T5 cruisers. Saucer separation is a joke. I'd trade it for a third tactical console slot in a heartbeat. A universal ensign would go a long way too.
if they are still checking this thread, i have to agree completely with this. using the Galaxy-R practically makes you a liability to a team because you cant fill any role as well as you could using any other end game cruiser. hard pill to swallow when your favorite ship is the galaxy.

all those tier 4 retrofits, and klingon VA ships, should have their powers become consoles, and not universal consoles but specific type consoles. the galaxy's should be an engineering console, intrepid's should be a science console, and defiant's should be a tactical console. in return the intrepid and defiant should get an extra engineering console and the galaxy should get an additional tactical console, then at least it would match the negvar's station and console setup wile the galaxy has better or worse maneuverability separated and unseparated then the negvar, at the cost of that console.

the defiant losing a tactical console to gain the cloak gives an advantage to the raptor, (for once) but it will still have that awesome 17 turn rate compared to the at least currently sub 15 turn rate of the raptor. sounds fair to me. i think the intrepid will basically be buffed by this, but i don't have enough sci ship experience to be sure.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 88
08-27-2011, 05:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Heretic
Hey guys,

I just wanted to give you all a head's up that Geko and I are going to be getting our hands dirty over the next few months with a number of different aspects of ships. As a result, I am particularly interested in hearing your opinions and thoughts in several areas.

This being said, I want to keep your expectations moderated; there's a ton we'd like to do, a lot we can do, but also quite a bit we won't be able to do for a wide variety of reasons from time to balance. Also, I can't at this point give out as many details about what we are doing as we have with the duty officer system, and I apologize in advance that this will be a lot more listening and analyzing and a lot less spilling cans of beans.

Specific questions:
1. What ship(s) did you fly as you ranked up? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
2. What ship(s) do you fly at cap? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
3. Which ship(s) do you think are currently overpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
4. Which ship(s) do you think are currently underpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
5. What feature of your favorite ships do you like the most? As in, console configurations, station configurations, aesthetics, special abilities, etc.?

Looking forward to all your feedback!
1) I mostly fly Escorts when levelling as it's faster than when using a Cruiser or Science ship, although my first couple of characters when I still read the NPC dialogues I levelled in Science ships as I liked the look of them. Levelling is exclusively solo PvE with occasional teaming with fleet mates for the FEs.

2) At cap I mostly use Escorts, predominantly the Advanced Escort/ MVAE for Science characters and Defiant R for Tactical. Again mostly solo PvE but with regular STF runs with fleet mates.

3&4) Not a Space PvP player so can only speak for PvE but none of the ships seem terribly over powered. Escorts are by far the most efficient way of getting through any PvE content as the raw damage they deal rapidly overwhelms any NPC but every class can get through any of the content without any trouble. Science ships are the weakest of the three classes for PvE but that's more to do with the NPCs having huge amounts of HP, the DoT from Gravity Well may be nasty on an Escort with 39k hull but barely makes a dent into an NPC cruiser with over 60k of hull.. They do however come into their own when teaming so I don't regard them as under powered, just more team orientated than the other classes.

5) I tend to use the ships that best suit the character that I'm using as well as for the aesthetic appeal, hence the AE/MVAE for Sci characters as the extra Science console is helpful for boosting Science and Sci captain skills.
BO layout is important but my main concern is skill point allocation, I prefer a balanced ground/ space spec so Escorts are my preferred choice due to lower skill points expenditure. Special abilities are nice but they don't make the sale, I just use them if the ship I choose has them. In order of importance I'd say;
Ship class,console layout, BO layout, aesthetics, special abilities.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 89
08-27-2011, 05:38 PM
You know the C-Store would flourish more (although i hate the damn thing) if they gave a new skill to put points into , once you max it out you can fly any ship without penaltys, i love ships and brought alot but respeccing to fly one that i BROUGHT costs me more to respec, hate the system they use so much.
Lt. Commander
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 120
# 90
08-29-2011, 04:42 AM
Specific questions:
1. What ship(s) did you fly as you ranked up? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?

Engineer flew Science to the max rank. This was back during the head-start, when crusiers couldnít turn left (or right). First Tac flew Escorts before rank 4, a mix of ships for rank 5. Second tac flew escorts for everything. Science officer leveled in Escorts.

2. What ship(s) do you fly at cap? For each, primarily PvE, PvP or both? Group or solo?
Engineer runs an Excelsior. Tac 1 Runs Defiant Retro. Tac 2 is in an Excelsior. Science officer is in an Intrepid.

3. Which ship(s) do you think are currently overpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
Klingon Carriers seem a tad overpowered, simply because the Federation has no match for it.

4. Which ship(s) do you think are currently underpowered? PvE, PvP, or both? Specifically why?
Escorts seem to be in need of help in PvP, unless the player is really good, and has specced to the maxx. Escorts seem to require the most skill to succeed.

5. What feature of your favorite ships do you like the most? As in, console configurations, station configurations, aesthetics, special abilities, etc.?
Excelsior BO layout is the reason I fly her. If the assault Cruiser had that setup Iíd be flying that right now (looks nicer).
Defiant BO layout is really hard to leave. I wish I could find it on a non-cloaking escort.
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